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let's blame the rape victim

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  • Indrid ColdIndrid Cold Warming up? Posts: 16,688
    Whowhere wrote: »
    I want to point out though, a rapist is a rapist, a predator of the vulnerable. I don't think a rapist is willing to lose control. A campaign aimed at them isn't going to work.
    A campaign aimed at the men who go out with an intention to rape someone wouldn't work, but one aimed at people who might become rapists but don't have that intention might.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I thought it had, but you're right.
    In any case, if it can happen to someone who's sober it can happen more easily to someone who's drunk, do you disagree with that?

    By 'it' do you mean raping someone?

    No I don't. Because by that definition, rape could be classed as 'a drunken mistake'.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Whowhere wrote: »
    I want to point out though, a rapist is a rapist, a predator of the vulnerable. I don't think a rapist is willing to lose control. A campaign aimed at them isn't going to work.

    I thought this was pretty good as a tongue in cheek campaign. http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-AAvaRJUytZI/TqaY02nTiiI/AAAAAAAAAEs/m0qarRsx7gg/s1600/poster+1.jpg
  • Indrid ColdIndrid Cold Warming up? Posts: 16,688
    By 'it' do you mean raping someone?

    No I don't. Because by that definition, rape could be classed as 'a drunken mistake'.
    By "it" I meant raping someone without realising that this is what they're doing, in which case it can be a drunken mistake.
    Please note that your phrase "rape could be classed as 'a drunken mistake'" implies that ALL rapes could be classed as that. Is that seriously what you meant?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    By "it" I meant raping someone without realising that this is what they're doing, in which case it can be a drunken mistake.
    Please note that your phrase "rape could be classed as 'a drunken mistake'" implies that ALL rapes could be classed as that. Is that seriously what you meant?

    No, my personal opinion is that drunk or sober there is still enough awareness of what is going on when someone commits an act like that. I can understand why people disagree with my viewpoint though. An example is when a man gets angry and hits his wife when he is drunk. It's my opinion that being drunk hasn't suddenly 'turned him into a monster'. A decent person drunk or sober just doesn't do these things, in my opinion.
  • Indrid ColdIndrid Cold Warming up? Posts: 16,688
    No, my personal opinion is that drunk or sober there is still enough awareness of what is going on when someone commits an act like that. I can understand why people disagree with my viewpoint though. An example is when a man gets angry and hits his wife when he is drunk. It's my opinion that being drunk hasn't suddenly 'turned him into a monster'. A decent person drunk or sober just doesn't do these things, in my opinion.
    Exactly. I 100%, completely, absolutely, agree.
    It's still a fact though that, monster or not, if he hadn't been drunk he wouldn't have hit his wife. Isn't that good enough a reason to prevent him getting drunk?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    No, my personal opinion is that drunk or sober there is still enough awareness of what is going on when someone commits an act like that. I can understand why people disagree with my viewpoint though. An example is when a man gets angry and hits his wife when he is drunk. It's my opinion that being drunk hasn't suddenly 'turned him into a monster'. A decent person drunk or sober just doesn't do these things, in my opinion.

    There's a difference between not descent and criminal though. A person may be able to remain non-criminal with some distinctly non-decent attitude sober. Getting drunk releases the inhibition.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Exactly. I 100%, completely, absolutely, agree.
    It's still a fact though that, monster or not, if he hadn't been drunk he wouldn't have hit his wife. Isn't that good enough a reason to prevent him getting drunk?

    Ahh I see :)

    I think I agree with you on that example but also think it's a bad idea to put that message in a campaign without explanation where it could be interpreted as an excuse for rape or to use words such as 'drunken mistake' or 'regret'.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    That is a very good campaign.
  • SkiveSkive No discipline. No morality. No respect. New ForestPosts: 15,169 Skive's The Limit
    Maybe campaign that centred on the dangers of drinking for both sexes would been been less offensive, rather than one that centres on rape alone.

    Men and women are more vulnerable and more likely to be a victim of crime including assault, sexual assault and rape if you have been drinking.
    Both men and women are also generally more likely to commit a crime of any type if you've been drinking to excess and drinking is no excuse.

    This is common sense, but its not commonly practiced.
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  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    You make a good point.

    I think it's probably worth having a two pronged approach. Men and women separately orient adverts on keeping themselves safe on the one hand, and on the other, the attitudes of men towards women out, drinking and dressed to impress.

    I, for the record, frequently tease a friend saying she looks like a high end prostitute because very little is left to any imagination. That doesn't mean she's up for anything.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Skive wrote: »
    Maybe campaign that centred on the dangers of drinking for both sexes would been been less offensive, rather than one that centres on rape alone.

    Men and women are more vulnerable and more likely to be a victim of crime including assault, sexual assault and rape if you have been drinking.
    Both men and women are also generally more likely to commit a crime of any type if you've been drinking to excess and drinking is no excuse.

    This is common sense, but its not commonly practiced.

    Agree
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Randomgirl wrote: »
    http://www.theviolencestopshere.ca/dbtg.php

    This campaign is really good.

    Yeah I like that campaign.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    That's a really good campaign - and would be the perfect type of thing to compliment the 'don't get so drunk that you're making yourself vulnerable to bad stuff happening'.

    The option isn't one or the other.

    And I stand by my moronic comment. There are young women out there who seem to be genuinely under the impression that they can go out, get so drunk that they don't remember what they're doing, do things they'd never do sober and don't know how they got home and somehow think that's ok and that they're not putting themselves at risk.

    It's not ok. It's not safe. It's exactly the same principle as kids talking to strangers, crossing the road without looking or not wearing a seat belt.
  • Indrid ColdIndrid Cold Warming up? Posts: 16,688
    Fiend_85 wrote: »
    That is a very good campaign.
    I think (hope?) we're all in agreement on this one.
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