Home Politics & Debate
If you need urgent support, call 999 or go to your nearest A&E. To contact our Crisis Messenger (open 24/7) text THEMIX to 85258.
Read the community guidelines before posting ✨
Aged 16-25? Share your experience of using the discussion boards and receive a £25 voucher! Take part via text-chat, video or phone. Click here to find out more and to take part.
Options

Davis: Multiculturalism is outdated.

245678

Comments

  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    racism dressed up in pretty writing.

    Without having read the replies or anything.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Does 'money' exist?

    >sigh< Which bit of it do you mean? In one sense yes, in another no.
    Not really though, does it?

    Quite correct.
    So let's be practical. Since 59,999,999 people in Britain says it exists (not to mention 5,939,999,999 other people in the world) and one person says it doesn't, I say it does.

    So, lets be practical. On this basis, the world is flat.
    Sorry mate. Tyranny of the majority and all...

    Sorry mate. It's a tiny minority that program the rest of you with this bullshit for their own ends. Do you really think that your "leaders" think it's there? or do they just do enough to keep you under the illusion that it is because they know it makes your behaviour predictable?

    Now are you saying that I am correct but doomed to be considered wrong because no one else will believe what's actually true, or are you saying I am incorrect?
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    It’s a tough one really. It’s very interesting looking at America. America has absorbed many different cultures. As anyone who’s studied American history will know groups have not always integrated smoothly there; the Irish, Italians and the Jews for example received a hostile welcome from some but still on the whole I think America has been incredibly successful. A lot of different cultures and different groups have integrated very well into American society and quickly too. Their model isn’t always PC; first generation immigrants Americanising their names for example but I think history will show America to have done it better than Britain.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    i think everyone believes in the concept of money, including our leaders, they just know enough of the system to get them well off and screw us over, yes things like money and countries, if you actually sat down and thought about it, mean fuck all, we've realised that but we don't actually care, there's always been money in my life, there's always been countries, fictional or not, i'm happy enough with them and i'm sure most people are aswell
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Multiculturalism is certainly outdated. People from ethnic minorites often tend not to intergrate,although many do. We all live in Britain, so we should act British, yet their are people who come here and try to turn the place into little India, or little Pakistan. Has anyone been to Leicester? I felt like a foreigner in my own country, at one point an Indian man asked if I spoke Punjabi :crazyeyes . Wtf, please make an effort to learn english if you do live in England. There should only be one culture, British, yet some people don't even bother learning English, let alone acting English. Instead they stay in their own communites, rarely mixing with other people. Thankfully many people who are of foreign origin intergrate into society, and it doesn't matter what race they are, they are considered British. However many people don't which causes problems

    Multiculturalism has failed, highlighted by the 7/7 suidicide bombings. A minority of British Pakistanis and other muslim groups feel alienated and disenfranchised. The bombings would not have taken place if the ethnic communties had been properly integrated.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I like this idea that multiculturalism has failed because of the bombings, a little rash I would say.

    Most Britians now are far more open to different cultures and experiences and happier and richer for it.

    The US isnt some utopia when it comes to race relations at all. Just look at how the Mexicans are treated and the economic divide between the coloured and the whites.

    And as for multiculturalism failing because immigrants live in 'sink hole' estates, it makes really no odds of their 'culture' those places are horrid for anyone who lives there.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    >sigh< Which bit of it do you mean? In one sense yes, in another no.



    Quite correct.



    So, lets be practical. On this basis, the world is flat.



    Sorry mate. It's a tiny minority that program the rest of you with this bullshit for their own ends. Do you really think that your "leaders" think it's there? or do they just do enough to keep you under the illusion that it is because they know it makes your behaviour predictable?

    Now are you saying that I am correct but doomed to be considered wrong because no one else will believe what's actually true, or are you saying I am incorrect?
    I am saying you are quite incorrect. Countries exist. End of.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Teagan wrote:
    I would rather NOT have Chicken Tikka than run the risk of being blown up on a tube by "British" suicide bombers who accept the hospitality and freedom of speech in this country - then turn and bite the hand that feeds.

    Why the inverted commas- they were British. Born in Britain, therefore British.

    Are you also seriously trying to imply that white people don't suicide bomb? It was white Chritians who invented the tactic- go and do some research on the Crusades- along with concentration camps and racial cleansing, it should be noted.
    The Muslim community had from 9/11 to start dealing with these people in their ranks but have only now have accepted that they (the hate-expousing extremists who hang around the doors of mosques) are, indeed, a thorn in the side of the moderate Muslim community.

    You mean in exactly the same way white Christians tolerate the Scientologists and Agnus Dei?
    How often do you hear from, say, the Chinese community that they are being 'discriminated' against in such a vocal way?

    Often enough.
    Yet they continue to pursue their lives and religon very peacefully within British Society. A fine example of integration!

    Ah, of course. Muslims (because that's what your goat is) just spend all their time suicide bombing places, yeah?

    9% of the UK's population is Muslim, if memory serves me right (if you don't agree, go and research it yourself). That's about 5 million people. How many suicide bombers were there? 12? 15? 100? Even ten thousand suicide bombers is but 0.2% of the UK's Muslim population.

    But lets not let facts like this get in the way of some good old-fashioned racial prejudice, eh? All those dirty Muslims can't wait to blow us up!
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    I am saying you are quite incorrect. Countries exist. End of.

    They only exist because someone with a big gun says they do, though.

    I think people assume that the nation state is more inevitable than it really is. We managed perfectly without countries before 1648.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Are you also seriously trying to imply that white people don't suicide bomb? It was white Chritians who invented the tactic- go and do some research on the Crusades- along with concentration camps and racial cleansing, it should be noted.

    Am I reading this right? Are you suggesting White Christians who invented the suicide bomb during the crusades???

    Could I have a source for the first suicide bomb being invented by Christians?

    Racial cleansing probably came from way before Christ btw.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    They only exist because someone with a big gun says they do, though.

    :yes:
    I think people assume that the nation state is more inevitable than it really is. We managed perfectly without countries before 1648.

    :yes:

    So, if we are in a country, and it exists, where was it before 1648? Or was everyone standing on a vacuum?
    I am saying you are quite incorrect. Countries exist. End of.
    Not really though, does it?

    Make your mind up. Is it really there or not? Is it a belief or not?
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Kermit wrote:
    I think people assume that the nation state is more inevitable than it really is. We managed perfectly without countries before 1648.

    No we didn't. The Treaty of Westphalia changed how states related to each other and reduced wars of religion. But states existed before then.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    White christians don't suicide bomb but they certainly bomb, with gusto.

    Look no further than Bible-toting, god-bothering George W. Bush and his ''crusades'' (his word) in Iraq and Afghanistan.

    You could also mention our very own caring Christian Prime Minister, not too concerned either about waging wars of aggression and slaughtering tens of thousands of innocents.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    NQA wrote:
    Am I reading this right? Are you suggesting White Christians who invented the suicide bomb during the crusades???

    Not the bomb. Certainly suicide attacks, though.
    Could I have a source for the first suicide bomb being invented by Christians?

    Here you go.

    During the Crusades, the Knights Templar destroyed one of their own ships, killing 140 Christians in order to kill ten times as many Muslims.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    White christians don't suicide bomb but they certainly bomb, with gusto.

    Look no further than Bible-toting, god-bothering George W. Bush and his ''crusades'' (his word) in Iraq and Afghanistan.

    You could also mention our very own caring Christian Prime Minister, not to concerned either about waging wars of aggression and slaughtering tens of thousands of innocents.

    That's not what I was asking. I'm well aware of Christian bombing. But as far as I'm aware the first recorded incidence of something referred to as suicide bombing was an Iranian boy-soldier strapping himself with explosive and throwing himself against an Iraqi tank. Though I suppose its possible to argue that he was following the example of Japanese soldiers who'd done the same thing during WW2.

    whilst there may be isolated examples of others blowing themselves and others up for a political cause - it would be difficult to say they invented it, because a) it can often be difficult to say whether they meant to do it or not and b) you can really only claim to invent a trend if others follow you're example.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Kermit wrote:
    Not the bomb. Certainly suicide attacks, though.



    Here you go.

    During the Crusades, the Knights Templar destroyed one of their own ships, killing 140 Christians in order to kill ten times as many Muslims.


    OK - interesting. I've never heard of this and would be interested in following it up ( can be a bit of a history nerd). Have you any dates or any more details.

    Against that I'd struggle to put the scuttling of ships in the same category as suicide bombings. Often they are meant to deny the ship to the enemy or to prevent the enemy claiming they sunk it (Graf Spee and Bismarck are two examples which spring to mind). Also a Captain sinking a ship whilst often reckless of the lives of his crew, doesn't mean that he is planning to commit suicide doing it.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    So, if we are in a country, and it exists, where was it before 1648? Or was everyone standing on a vacuum?
    Oh dear dear dear...

    Make your mind up. Is it really there or not? Is it a belief or not?
    Oh it does. I was just using your reasoning for a moment...

    Incidentally, if your methodology for establishing whether something exists or not consists on being able to feel it up with your hands or see it with your eyes, dare say you cannot really be sure whether anything at all really exists. Are you sure you are awake now? Are you sure this is not an hallucination?

    Shall we just put such silly arguments to rest? If you believe counties are pointless man-made concepts, fair enough. But I'm no further prepared to discuss whether they "exist" or not any more than I'd be prepared to discuss whether Elvis is alive and living in sin with the Loch Ness monster on the third ring of Saturn with somebody who believed such thing.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Oh dear dear dear...

    What?
    Oh it does. I was just using your reasoning for a moment...

    No, you weren't.
    Incidentally, if your methodology for establishing whether something exists or not consists on being able to feel it up with your hands or see it with your eyes, dare say you cannot really be sure whether anything at all really exists.

    Course you can say that. It's not wht i am on about at all. unfortunately you are so brainwashed that you think when i say the country doesn't exist, you think I am saying that the ground itself isn't there. Which would of course, be ridiculous. What i am pointing out is that the distinction that's made between "england" and "wales" must by it's very nature be fictional. Not that hard to follow is it?
    Shall we just put such silly arguments to rest? If you believe counties are pointless man-made concepts, fair enough.

    No, I don't believe that. it just happens to be the truth of the matter. I would swap silly for "maybe useful" perhaps. Why be ruled by fiction though? it never works well in the long run.
    But I'm no further prepared to discuss whether they "exist" or not any more than I'd be prepared to discuss whether Elvis is alive and living in sin with the Loch Ness monster on the third ring of Saturn with somebody who believed such thing.

    Nothing to do with what i am saying at all. From my point of view you are the one with the wacky unprovable belief. the fact that you have no proof but lots of fellow believers makes you akin to the early catholic curch or something.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    Course you can say that. It's not wht i am on about at all. unfortunately you are so brainwashed that you think when i say the country doesn't exist, you think I am saying that the ground itself isn't there. Which would of course, be ridiculous. What i am pointing out is that the distinction that's made between "england" and "wales" must by it's very nature be fictional. Not that hard to follow is it?
    No it's not fictional. It's very real. Ask anyone. You appear to have some kind of perception problem there.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    Course you can say that. It's not wht i am on about at all. unfortunately you are so brainwashed that you think when i say the country doesn't exist, you think I am saying that the ground itself isn't there. Which would of course, be ridiculous. What i am pointing out is that the distinction that's made between "england" and "wales" must by it's very nature be fictional. Not that hard to follow is it?

    But as Alladin points out, you don't take your reductionism far enough - you seem to be stopping at an arbitrary point. How can you be sure that anything exists?

    You think you can touch things (or see, smell etc) but can you really? Couldn't it all be a dream? Couldn't your senses deceive you? Maybe you're a figment of a madman's imagination?

    A country isn't a fiction, it's merely a different category of "thing" to a table.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    No it's not fictional. It's very real. Ask anyone. You appear to have some kind of perception problem there.

    Ok, what's your proof that the boundaries between "countries" exist and when and where did you get it?

    No, I have no perception problem you seem to be basing your perceptions on the opinions of others though, which would be one in itself.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    As I said klintock, tyranny of the majority. 59,999,999 people in this country are familiar with, and agree with the concept of the nations of England, Scotland and Wales- even if they are man-made, which seem to be something you are struggling with.

    So the countries exist by agreements and laws that define their borders and legislations. I'm sorry if you cannot touch or feel a physical border. Everybody else manages just fine without it though.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    As I said klintock, tyranny of the majority. 59,999,999 people in this country are familiar with, and agree with the concept of the nations of England, Scotland and Wales- even if they are man-made, which seem to be something you are struggling with.

    I have no problme with the concept of nations. As a concept. Do people really think about them as the arbitary, man made delusions that they are though? No, they think they are facts and act accordingly.
    So the countries exist by agreements and laws that define their borders and legislations.

    All law is based on the idea that the contry exists first, and then the "laws" are applicable in that country. Agreement between who? When and where was this agreement made and what has it got to do with me? How can a "law" that only operates within a "country" be used to make a country up in the first place?
    I'm sorry if you cannot touch or feel a physical border.

    So theres no evidence for it.
    Everybody else manages just fine without it though.

    I agree completely. Most people do just fine without it. Some people don't though, ask the millions of dead this century alone, all of them dead for a fiction.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    NQA wrote:
    Am I reading this right? Are you suggesting White Christians who invented the suicide bomb during the crusades???

    Could I have a source for the first suicide bomb being invented by Christians?

    Racial cleansing probably came from way before Christ btw.


    the group without veichles that could fire explosives but had desperate disillusioned young people who liked their ideals is the one who invented the suicide bombers


    whats so bad about a suicide bomber in comparison to someone that leaves a bomb to go off anyway????
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    NQA wrote:
    OK - interesting. I've never heard of this and would be interested in following it up ( can be a bit of a history nerd). Have you any dates or any more details.

    Against that I'd struggle to put the scuttling of ships in the same category as suicide bombings. Often they are meant to deny the ship to the enemy or to prevent the enemy claiming they sunk it (Graf Spee and Bismarck are two examples which spring to mind). Also a Captain sinking a ship whilst often reckless of the lives of his crew, doesn't mean that he is planning to commit suicide doing it.


    actually its exactly the same it destroys the destryoer in process denying the other side a chance to extract information from it, whether it be a crew or 1 person
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    actually its exactly the same it destroys the destryoer in process denying the other side a chance to extract information from it, whether it be a crew or 1 person

    No it isn't. If I wander into a tube with the deliberate intent of blowing msyself and others up it is different from a ship's crew which finds itself in the situation to sink, scuttle or surremder.

    It would only be the the same if the suicide bomber decided to blow himself up whilst being chased by police - which unless you have some evidence to contrary is not the case in mosty suicide bombs.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    A country is not tangible therefore not real. It's simply an idea, not a fact.

    If most people perceive an idea as fact then it is treated as fact, but that doesn't make it real. The idea of a country is not real, but because everyone indulges in the same idea it is effectively real.

    There is nothing concrete that makes a country real. Alsace-Lorraine proves that.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    the group without veichles that could fire explosives but had desperate disillusioned young people who liked their ideals is the one who invented the suicide bombers

    By vehicles firing explosives you mean tanks and by desperate, disillusioned young people you mean the German infantry on the Somme. So its the RTR's fault?

    whats so bad about a suicide bomber in comparison to someone that leaves a bomb to go off anyway????

    I tend to agree - I hoping the suicide bombers on't get their virgins. I hope the fuckers who placed the bomb at Enskillen burn painfully in hell.

    But in security terms its harder to stop someone who's already decided to commit suicide than a normal terrorist who wants to plant a bomb and get out.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Kermit wrote:
    A country is not tangible therefore not real. It's simply an idea, not a fact.

    If most people perceive an idea as fact then it is treated as fact, but that doesn't make it real. The idea of a country is not real, but because everyone indulges in the same idea it is effectively real.

    There is nothing concrete that makes a country real. Alsace-Lorraine proves that.
    Countries exist though. And no amount of semantic or grammatical twisting is going to change that. Whether they are tangible or not is irrelevant.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    Countries exist though.

    They exist because the people who benefit most from them force everyone else to indulge the idea.

    They do exist. They're not real though.
Sign In or Register to comment.