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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Blagsta wrote:
    Look - the absolutes I believe in are what I've said I base my ethics on...

    ...now within that framework, things are relative, depending on the situation (see my stealing example) and people are quite capable of deciding these things for themselves without relying on a father figure.

    Geddit?
    What are you absolutes measured by?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Thank you.

    (I quite like the banner of that site :p)
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fiend_85 wrote:
    What are you absolutes measured by?

    I've just fucking said. Can't you read or something?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    That's the point you haven't said anything at all. What a surprise.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fiend_85 wrote:
    That's the point you haven't said anything at all. What a surprise.

    Fucks sake, what is the matter with you? I'VE ANSWERED YOUR QUESTION SEVERAL TIMES. Just because you don't like the answer, or its so far outside of your tiny narrow world view that you can't get your head round it, but I'VE FUCKING ANSWERED IT.

    Here it is again - PEOPLE ARE CAPABLE OF DECIDING FOR THEMSELVES WHAT IS RIGHT AND WRONG BECAUSE WE ARE INHERENTLY EMPATHIC, SOCIAL AND CO-OPERATIVE BEINGS GIVEN THE RIGHT CIRCUMSTANCES AND EQUALITY OF INFORMATION, POWER AND RESOURCES

    If you still can't get it, you're fucking stupid.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    You have said (repeatadly) what you believe to be true. What is it according to. And before you bring up for the nth time about inherrant human empathy. Autisics have no sense of empathy, those who are pre-4 have no sense of empathy, are they not human?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    P.S.

    THERE IS NOTHING OUTSIDE OF HUMAN BEINGS TO MEASURE THESE THINGS BY

    Why should there be? Why does there need to be? It rather seems to me that you have a need for things to be certain and clearcut and black and white. What psychoanalysis would call being in the paranoid schizoid position, a state of splitting things into good/bad. Life isn't like that. Life is messy, not clear cut, uncertain. If that scares you too much, see a therapist.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    So, that would mean that everything is relative?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fiend_85 wrote:
    You have said (repeatadly) what you believe to be true. What is it according to. And before you bring up for the nth time about inherrant human empathy. Autisics have no sense of empathy, those who are pre-4 have no sense of empathy, are they not human?

    You can't fucking read can you?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fiend_85 wrote:
    So, that would mean that everything is relative?

    :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

    You can't read can you?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Blagsta wrote:
    You can't fucking read can you?
    You can't post without being deliberatly offensive can you?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fiend_85 wrote:
    You can't post without being deliberatly offensive can you?

    Not when faced with a fucking moron who seems incapable of reading, no.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Blagsta wrote:
    :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

    You can't read can you?
    If there is NOTHING to measure by, then there is NO absolute, THEREFORE it's all relative.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fiend_85 wrote:
    If there is NOTHING to measure by, then there is NO absolute, THEREFORE it's all relative.

    Are you being deliberatly obtuse or something? The basis of my ethics are what I hold as absolutes, i.e true for all humans and all cultures (I do actually take your point about autism - but to say that autistic people are incapable of empathy is too broad a generalisation. And anyhow, irrelevant as other human beings are, so that is extended to autistic people). So they are absolute as I think they apply to all humans.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    So YOU are the absolute? Why? Are you better than eveyrone else?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fiend_85 wrote:
    So YOU are the absolute? Why? Are you better than eveyrone else?

    For fucks sake. No, HUMAN BEINGS ARE THE ABSOLUTE.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Do you think morals are totally absolute? How about my 2 examples earlier? Is stealing OK to feed yourself?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    But all humans are different, how can that be an absolute?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Given the incredible unlikelihhod of blagstas circumstances, is he saying that there can be no moral behaviour.

    just like to add that morality is defined best by circumstance, as are most human interactions.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    Given the incredible unlikelihhod of blagstas circumstances, is he saying that there can be no moral behaviour.

    No, I'm not. What I am saying is that human beings are capable of deciding what is right and wrong for themselves without needing God.
    klintock wrote:
    just like to add that morality is defined best by circumstance, as are most human interactions.

    Which is what I'm saying too.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fiend_85 wrote:
    But all humans are different, how can that be an absolute?

    Yes, all humans are different. But we all have things in common too. We (mostly) are capable of empathy, love, caring, co-operation.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Why are those things morally correct?

    And why don't people act that way?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fiend_85 wrote:
    Why are those things morally correct?

    Are you going to answer my question?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I think stealing is always wrong.

    Why are those things morally correct?

    And why don't people act those ways?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fiend_85 wrote:
    I think stealing is always wrong.

    So you think that someone should starve instead?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fiend_85 wrote:
    Why are those things morally correct?

    What things? :confused:
    Fiend_85 wrote:
    And why don't people act those ways?

    People mostly do.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I answered, it's your turn.

    Obviously if everyone were acting according to your "absolute" morals then the circumstance would never arrise. I have empathy with the situation, that doesn't make stealing right. He's causing hardship to someone else.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Blagsta wrote:
    What things? :confused:

    Love, compassion, empathy
    Blagsta wrote:
    People mostly do.

    Actually mostly people don't, you certainly haven't shown any of them toward me, ever.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    So you think someone should starve then? How is stealing a loaf of bread from Tescos causing hardship to someone else?

    BTW I haven't said anything about having "absolute" morals - I have said that ethical actions come from those things - a subtle but very important difference.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    It's your turn again.


    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Blagsta
    What things?


    Love, compassion, empathy

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Blagsta
    People mostly do.


    Actually mostly people don't, you certainly haven't shown any of them toward me, ever.
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