Three schoolgirl sisters have given birth aged 12, 14 and 16.

Skive · May 2005

klintock wrote:

The problem isn't with the lack of oppotunity it's with the perceived lack of opportunity for those people. And once it's perceived that way, it becomes true for that person

Exactly.

If people don't believe they have any opertunities they need to be shown that they do, rather than cussed and isolated even further with comments such as 'chav slags'. Comments liek that are totally oposite of what is useful.

Former Member · May 2005

The "mother", I use this term loosely, allowed her 11 year old daughter to sleep with her 14 year old boy friend in the bedroom next to hers. Says it all really about the lack of decency and morality among members of the underclass.

Former Member · May 2005

Former Member · May 2005

Rich Kid wrote:

The "mother", I use this term loosely, allowed her 11 year old daughter to sleep with her 14 year old boy friend in the bedroom next to hers. Says it all really about the lack of decency and morality among members of the underclass.

It says no such thing really. What it does say is that some people have some strange ideas about what is acceptable. You get bad parents in all classes.
This woman doesnt parent in the same way that I think is best, but then neither do a lot of people. Its wrong to label an entire class based on the actions of a few.

Skive · May 2005

I don't think anybody pays much attention to him anyway.
He's like a fly that you can't swat. Midly annoying but altogether harmless.

Former Member · May 2005

I think you're right Klintock about many people not realising the worlds of opportunity, but I think it's as much human nature as conditioning. I'll agree that more inspiring teachers, role models and community leaders are required, and that it's shameful we let so many talented and bright kids believe that there's nothing for them.

If you think there are not levels of talent and work-ethic you're a funny one ~ I'll file this puzzler with your head in the sand attitude about the least intelligent being the ones who suffer most from the negative social outcomes I named earlier.

Former Member · May 2005

girl with sharp teeth wrote:

Rich Kid, unlike other board members I don't think you should be banned for your politics, but I find your comments incredibly offensive and I am going to ask for you to be banned if you do not desist in abusing this 'underclass' that exists in your imagination.

A typical reaction if I may say so sharp teeth, you don't like an opposing view so you immediately wish to ban it. Censorship is always close to those of certain political persausion.
So, according to you, we've got some left-wing posters who want me and others banned because of our politics, but you might want me banned because of my views on a certain strata of society. Got it all sewn up haven't you.

The underclass exists in more than my imagination, its out there in the real world and increasing rapidly. You may wish to be in denial but others, with more sense, wish to tackle the problem before it devours us. Normal decent society is at risk but some are oblivious to it.

Former Member · May 2005

but I think it's as much human nature as conditioning.

There's no such thing as human nature. The people who suceed on your scale of measurement are just as human as those who fail, so how can they both have the same nature? Ridiculous.

And I said nothing about conditioning either.

I'll agree that more inspiring teachers, role models and community leaders are required,

Those people never reach the people we are discussing here. I think that people need less instruction and following, and more independance.

If you think there are not levels of talent and work-ethic you're a funny one

My question would be who is doing the measuring? Everyone knows people who do fuck all and get by on talent and everyone knows someone who uses a work ethic to compensate for lack of atalent. People with both are rare as hen's teeth. What scale are you using to measure success? Money, happiness, lots of friends, a big family?

the least intelligent being the ones who suffer most from the negative social outcomes

It's not a question of intelligence, it's a question of independence, action and brass balls. Also, negative social outcomes are a misnomer, having a dozen kids is better from your genetics point of view than having one, no matter how good a lifestyle that 1 child has. Again, everything changes dependent on your point of view.

Former Member · May 2005

Rich Kid wrote:

A typical reaction if I may say so sharp teeth, you don't like an opposing view so you immediately wish to ban it. Censorship is always close to those of certain political persausion.
So, according to you, we've got some left-wing posters who want me and others banned because of our politics, but you might want me banned because of my views on a certain strata of society. Got it all sewn up haven't you.

The underclass exists in more than my imagination, its out there in the real world and increasing rapidly. You may wish to be in denial but others, with more sense, wish to tackle the problem before it devours us. Normal decent society is at risk but some are oblivious to it.

Are you stupid? She says she doesnt want you banned because of your politics! And if there is an underclass its because of selfish people like you hoarding your precious money. At least these people have their communities. I dont image you get much love off your money.

Im going to feel ashamed to be living back in Bucks during the holidays because you live there.

Former Member · May 2005

"it's either educated out of them or social and peer pressure reduces it down to nothing." That's conditioning.

The nature of humans is that some are optimistic or ambitious, some are pessimistic or idle. Human nature by any other name.

Some people who fail when independent (isolated?) can achieve when inspired. "My question would be who is doing the measuring? Everyone knows people who do fuck all and get by on talent and everyone knows someone who uses a work ethic to compensate for lack of atalent." In this case you're doing the measuring but as you say, we all know...

"negative social outcomes are a misnomer" Among my examples, domestic abuse, unemployment, addiction, crime...

Former Member · May 2005

Renzo wrote:

Are you stupid? She says she doesnt want you banned because of your politics!

Oh thats good then, aren't I a lucky boy. No, she wants me banned because I have a view on the underclass of our society. Clever tactics.

Im going to feel ashamed to be living back in Bucks during the holidays because you live there.

Well don't come back then. Simple.

Former Member · May 2005

Renzo wrote:

And if there is an underclass its because of selfish people like you hoarding your precious money.

I'm confused. So anyone with wealth shouldn't hoard it and should share it round?

Rich Kid wrote:

Says it all really about the lack of decency and morality among members of the underclass.

Really not a valid point since it used to be the upperclasses who were the ones lacking morality e.g raping of servants, begetting of children with young serving girls and then kicking them out etc. I could go on.

Former Member · May 2005

Rich Kid wrote:

Oh thats good then, aren't I a lucky boy. No, she wants me banned because I have a view on the underclass of our society. Clever tactics.

Well don't come back then. Simple.

Thankfully, I know there are actually nice people in Bucks and i can see my friends. Also I have to go back anyway. I might come contaminate Chalfont a bit actually...

Former Member · May 2005

Former Member · May 2005

Carolina wrote:

I'm confused. So anyone with wealth shouldn't hoard it and should share it round?

Really not a valid point since it used to be the upperclasses who were the ones lacking morality e.g raping of servants, begetting of children with young serving girls and then kicking them out etc. I could go on.

The fact he doesnt want to help anyone out any little bit through taxes is disgusting.

Former Member · May 2005

My imagination sharp teeth?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,,1386616,00.html
http://englischlehrer.de/uk/underclass.php
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/974463.stm
http://www.vhl.org/newsletter/vhl2001/01bginsu.htm
http://www.tsa.uk.com/YCSC/RB/TSA_RB_06.pdf
http://www.findaproperty.com/story.aspx?storyid=5051
http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/1903386101/202-7146545-8469436
http://www.jakeg.co.uk/essays/underclass.htm

Former Member · May 2005

Well done for finding any article with 'Underclass' in it. :rolleyes:

Former Member · May 2005

Renzo wrote:

Well done for finding any article with 'Underclass' in it. :rolleyes:

Not just my imagination then? And a few links to satisfy those "source junkies"

Former Member · May 2005

twat.

Former Member · May 2005

Rich Kid wrote:

Not just my imagination then? And a few links to satisfy those "source junkies"

All those articles have is the word underclass in it a couple of times. Im not denying there is one but i despise the way you think you are better than these people when you are possibly one of the worse people ive ever had the misfortune to encounter.

Former Member · May 2005

Fiend_85 wrote:

twat.

Thanks fiend, luv u 2.

Former Member · May 2005

Former Member · May 2005

Rich Kid wrote:

Not just my imagination then? And a few links to satisfy those "source junkies"

It is your use of the term rather than the reality that some people dont have a great deal in life which people find deeply offensive Rich Kid. It is your assumption that they are evil and wrong and that they will 'infect' the rest of society.

This Christian act you persist with is annoying and offensive because its so obviously rubbish, you have little to no understanding of the Bible at all and many of the sentiments you express are directly oposite to that of Christian teachings. You are a boring troll, you could have been far more interesting if you werent stupid and obvious.

Former Member · May 2005

The issue here sharpteeth is that you said "underclass" was just a figment of my imagination, the links prove that the subject is out there in the big wide world, the only trouble is you haven't caught up with it, either that, or you're in denial.

Former Member · May 2005

The issue here sharpteeth is that you said "underclass" was just a figment of my imagination, the links prove that the subject is out there in the big wide world, the only trouble is you haven't caught up with it, either that, or you're in denial.

God you are an idiot.

All you have proven is that lots of other people think there is an underclass.

Quick questions -

What does it look like?

What does it sound like?

What is it's atomic composition?

The fact that you have found lots of other people just as lazy thinking as you means bugger all.

Former Member · May 2005

Former Member · May 2005

I see I'm not the only one to use the word "scum". Please take note all you lefties out there.

Former Member · May 2005

Rich Kid wrote:

I see I'm not the only one to use the word "scum". Please take note all you lefties out there.

whats this got to do with left/right wing politics...you're an imbecile, everything in life is either a left wing problem or a right wing solution...idiot!

Former Member · May 2005

turlough wrote:

whats this got to do with left/right wing politics...you're an imbecile, everything in life is either a left wing problem or a right wing solution...idiot!

1) as I'm often being criticised for using the word "scum", I'm simply pointing out that I'm not the only one. Thats all, don't jump out of your pram.

2) I do not see everything in simple left/right wing terms, that would be ridiculous. I got into the habit of calling my opponents "lefties" as a shorthand term, what else would you suggest, I'm open to suggestions on this.