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enlighten me oh font of all knowledge........
Dunno, don't think they're that obvious. All I know is that he ain't on the level.
Banz0r?
i have never written up false cr@p as it endangers people health. I did indeed write up that doing 5-HTP after a week-end on jack 'n' jills isn't the best thing, as 5-HTP takes a couple of weeks to get a clinical response (kick in)
Judge for yourselves people.
Bullshit. Our values are the best and applicable to everyone. Its racist to say that arabs are 'unsuited' to democracy.
SO you dont agree that having an election was a good thing?
That is Racist. You think the western way of life is superior and dismiss others. You are racist.
Alot of Arabic folk beleive wester ways to be corrupt and don't like it. So their beleif are wrong, are you saying?
Do you know what 'racist' means?
Yes. Their beliefs are wrong. If you believe in womans rights, freedom of religion, freedom of speech, democratic institutions, personal liberty and other core values of Western civilization, then you would agree with me.
How the fuck is that racist? At the most it is arrogant.
You are discriminating against those of Islamic race and beleif. You are saying they are wrong.
And oyu feel anyone who DOESN'T is wrong and inferior?
Womans Rights? Russia had it first. Freedom of Religion? It is not illegal to be another religion is the Middle East, Even under Saddam's reign. Freedom of speech? Thats limited under western societies now, by the way. As is personal liberty. Democracy is the issue we are debating.
Good. THen Western values should be defended. And if the best way to do that is to spread them to other nations, so be it.
One doesn't necessarily follow from the other. You suggested that "Our values are the best and applicable to everyone.". I'd disagree that "Our values are the best". In fact our values are pretty shite IMO. We value greed, competitiveness, competition, profit and material goods over co-operation, community and human relationships. To think that western liberal democracy is the pinnacle of human endeavour is narrow minded arrogance.
Defending would be stopping another beleif, say, taking over Britain.
In that principal, Nazi Germany was "Defending" itself by taking over Europe.
Head. Hit. Nail.
Rearrange as necessary.
Western Liberal democracy is the best system of government that humans have yet created. You said it yourself, you would not like to live in an Islamic theocracy.
Our values obviously appeal to humans, because pretty much the whole world would copy them given the chance.
The ebst defence is a good offence.
Personally I would rather we convert other peoples to our (better) way of life than wait for them to convert us to their (worse) one.
your sick.
Saying someone is wrong, is not the same as implying that they are inferior. Your argument is way too fat-fetched.
And btw, he in his original statement didn't even put down others believes but rather emphasised ours. So your argument has totally fallen to the ground.
Oh, and not illegal to be another religion in the Middle East? Well, you might say so, but it sure is as hell to practice your own religion in for example Saudi Arabia - Jewish soldiers from the American troops which came to help the country under the Gulfwar were sent out on ships to pray and mark holidays, as they couldn't justify the worshipping of another belief in their country.
Democracy is not just elections. Mugabe and Saddam had elections. It is a free press, freedom of religion, equal rights for minority groups, equality for women etc, these are hallmarks of a democracy, a free society. No free society is perfect (it being made up of humans after all) but is what should be aspired to.
Arkanoid said "They, as a people, tend not to favour it [democracy]." I would like to know, how many times have people in the middle east being given the chance to express that? How could they?
I agree with The Matadore on the point of womens rights. Practices like female circumcision/female genital mutilation cannot be shrugged away by the west, explained away through moral and cultural relativism. "They" just don't understand womens rights. Let's hope we in the west could take a stand at least. Or we are just reactionaries, isolationists and not the progressives we would like to think we are.
When people talk about Islam as a race they are associating it with the place it originated from, South Western Asia. I agree that there certainly is a distinction to be made but for the most part I think that when people refer to it as a race they are just speaking in layman’s terms.
and the times which people have willingly voted in Dictators?
Logical thinking isn't your strong point is it? As I said - one does not necessarily follow from the other. Just because I don't want to live in an Islamic theocracy it doesn't necessarily follow that I think Western liberal democracy and capitalism is all that great either.
Thinking isn't your strong point either is it? Apart from there being no evidence that "pretty much the whole world would copy them given the chance" (I think the mess in Iraq refutes that), you're totally ignoring the role of media, idealogy, hegemony, power etc in creating the desire for bright shiny things.
How about I come up to Manchester and smack you in the face then? Would you still be saying that? After all, you appear to want to impose your values on the rest of us. Maybe I should get my defence in first eh?
Please try and engage your brain. It is not an either/or situation.
Is anyone here defending Islamism?