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What unpopular opinions do you have?

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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Chav is a derogatory term, I think if we were replacing it with nigger or faggot and saying "well, if they deliberately fall into the stereotype it's ok" we'd be considered wrong by any reasonable person.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Its not "the poor" many many poor people wouldnt be described as chavs at all. Chav is a description on a certain type of underclass type lifestyle, which is adopted by rich and poor, but signals a lack of education and..........class. We are in britain. To pretend we dont notice social class because we are so right on, is snobbery in itself
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I'm middle class, I'm not ashamed of that. I have a white collar job, and a fucking good education. If that's not middle class I don't know what is. Doesn't make me better than the guys on the shop floor though.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fiend_85 wrote: »
    Chav is a derogatory term,

    To some. Just like 'idiot'
    Fiend_85 wrote: »
    I think if we were replacing it with nigger or faggot and saying "well, if they deliberately fall into the stereotype it's ok" we'd be considered wrong by any reasonable person.

    As is usually said when that analogy is used, do people get beaten up and/or killed for being a 'chav'?

    What next, 'chavism'?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Its not "the poor" many many poor people wouldnt be described as chavs at all. Chav is a description on a certain type of underclass type lifestyle, which is adopted by rich and poor, but signals a lack of education and..........class.

    Agreed. I'd say 'chav' is more a state of mind than a social class.
    We are in britain. To pretend we dont notice social class because we are so right on, is snobbery in itself

    This. Oh my god this. One thing that makes a tosser even more of a tosser is to pretend humans don't have preconceived ideas about people/things, and that we don't judge people on what we see/hear about them. I don't see why people are afraid of admitting it.

    It becomes a problem when their attitude and actions towards those individuals is influenced by that 'view'. One does not necessarily lead to the other.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    CM Punk wrote:
    As is usually said when that analogy is used, do people get beaten up and/or killed for being a 'chav'?

    What next, 'chavism'?
    It's called class prejudice, or class war. Try demonisation. Pick your poison. Just because people aren't "beaten up and/or killed" doesn't make it right.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fiend_85 wrote: »
    It's called class prejudice, or class war.

    I'll say it again - 'to some'. A 'chav' is not about social class in my eyes, it's a chosen lifestyle that can be adopted by anyone.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    CM Punk wrote: »
    I'll say it again - 'to some'. A 'chav' is not about social class in my eyes, it's a chosen lifestyle that can be adopted by anyone.

    Oh right! Well then, by all means, be prejudice then.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    CM Punk wrote: »
    To some. Just like 'idiot'

    Chav stands for 'council house and violent'. Of course it's offensive. You don't have to be poor to be violent, and you don't have to be violent to live in a council house, and bandying the word chav around is just perpetuating links between poverty and council houses, and violence. It just demonises actual people that live in council houses (like my family.)
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fiend_85 wrote: »
    Oh right! Well then, by all means, be prejudice then.

    You just can't shake it can you? I simply must be a 'bigot'. Why? Because it fits your stereotype.

    I have difficulty in focussing on individual social groups (not 'classes') and I find it easier to use labels. That works for me. I use labels purely on the basis it's easier for me and that I'm ready (and happy) to be proven wrong about anyone that falls in to said labels.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    grace wrote: »
    Chav stands for 'council house and violent'. Of course it's offensive. You don't have to be poor to be violent, and you don't have to be violent to live in a council house, and bandying the word chav around is just perpetuating links between poverty and council houses, and violence. It just demonises actual people that live in council houses (like my family.)

    Erm...you're aware that that is just one view of what it means right?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    CM Punk wrote: »
    You just can't shake it can you? I simply must be a 'bigot'. Why? Because it fits your stereotype.

    Or the evidence, but ok.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fiend_85 wrote: »
    Or the evidence, but ok.

    Oh right, if we're going on 'evidence' then forgive me for paying more attention to the people that actually know me in real life and have never called me a bigot rather than a random from the internet who knows little or nothing about who I am yet calls that 'evidence'.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    CM Punk wrote: »
    Erm...you're aware that that is just one view of what it means right?

    Yeah, but the best known one.

    (According to wikipedia it comes fron the Romani word chavi, meaning child, but I don't think even a supreme being like you could have told me that.)
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    grace wrote: »
    Yeah, but the best known one.

    So now you're deciding for the rest of us what we best know a word to mean...interesting...
    grace wrote: »
    (According to wikipedia it comes fron the Romani word chavi, meaning child, but I don't think even a supreme being like you could have told me that.)

    I could have - I read wikipedia too, just like you....
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    grace wrote: »
    Chav stands for 'council house and violent'. )

    Pretty sure "chav" comes from an old Romany gypsy word? I'm sure my dad's told me that...

    Also, this whole "chav being offensive thing" I think it must be different generations? There's plenty of kids in my year who freely call themselves chavs... I used to be one of them! I don't think (amongst my school at least) it's seen as a bad thing any more. Generally if we're being offensive we'll call people skanks or rats.

    Edit: Just seen you wikipedia'd it, and it is a Romany word! Look at me and my pointless knowledge.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Pretty sure "chav" comes from an old Romany gypsy word? I'm sure my dad's told me that...

    Also, this whole "chav being offensive thing" I think it must be different generations? There's plenty of kids in my year who freely call themselves chavs... I used to be one of them! I don't think (amongst my school at least) it's seen as a bad thing any more. Generally if we're being offensive we'll call people skanks or rats.

    Edit: Just seen you wikipedia'd it, and it is a Romany word! Look at me and my pointless knowledge.

    If you're not careful, you'll find yourself being called a 'bigot'....
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    CM Punk wrote: »
    So now you're deciding for the rest of us what we best know a word to mean...interesting...



    I could have - I read wikipedia too, just like you....

    Don't be ridiculous, saying that something is 'best known' for something else is not 'deciding for the rest of us'; by definition it's common knowledge. Stop being intentionally difficult.

    You know that because you've just read wikipedia. I'm fairly certain that when you and most other people have used the word chav
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    they've been unaware of any Romani origins it may have (although we both got that from wiki so ít might be bullshit.)
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    grace wrote: »
    they've been unaware of any Romani origins it may have (although we both got that from wiki so ít might be bullshit.)

    I'm 99% sure it comes from old gypsy language. My dad knows quite a few Romany's and goes to gypsy festivals in Europe and I remember him telling me Chav comes from Romany language.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I don't really see what's so offensive about the word either - when I was at school people also freely identified as 'chavs' (back in 2005ish when it was all about burberry, hoop earrings and gold jewelry). I didn't see it any different to 'goth' or 'greb' or 'townie' - which were also used at the time. Though for us it was more to do with how you dressed and your social circle. Maybe that's just me. I don't think the Jeremy Kyle show has helped though, as most people that take part seem to fall into what people class as 'chav' these days and seems to be more about passively ridiculing the participants than actually helping them.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Also the word probably means different things to the people that call other people 'chav' and the people that get called it.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    grace wrote: »
    Don't be ridiculous, saying that something is 'best known' for something else is not 'deciding for the rest of us'; by definition it's common knowledge. Stop being intentionally difficult.

    By your 'common knowledge'. I have never heard of 'chav' supposedly being any sort of acronym. Not saying it isn't but nobody I know has ever used that way, at least not in conversation with me. So not quite 'common knowledge'
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Ballerina wrote: »
    I don't really see what's so offensive about the word either - when I was at school people also freely identified as 'chavs' (back in 2005ish when it was all about burberry, hoop earrings and gold jewelry). I didn't see it any different to 'goth' or 'greb' or 'townie' - which were also used at the time.

    This. However I'm the bigot, apparently.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    im not saying chav is derogatory. Im saying that its a description of a type of person. If youre implying that to use that descriptive word is an insult in itself, then you are the one Anti - that type of person.
    Id consider skive a bit of a chav. I dont think hes horrid. From what i have known of him over the years, i have a lot of time for. Bit chavvy though. my ex SIL - complete chav. Sweet girl, but loved the orange foundation and her boyfriends ALWAYS wore their tracksuits tucked into their socks. Tulisa off telly. chav. Got a hell of a lot more money than me and not a single parent or uneducated. Just a very urban thing.

    Being realistic and aware and having lived in england most of my life, I can distinguish between certain groups people and i notice social classes. I know who i lean towards and who i dont. It doesnt mean if i was in a position of employing people or offering them services I would discriminate. I believe in human rights, not class rights, but I still have my eyes open around me.
    Its like pretending you didnt notice someone was black, or you honestly didnt notice that womans tits in front of you.

    Nice manners, but afraid i know youre bullshitting.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I really think it depends on whether you're calling people a chav or being called a chav as to whether it's offensive or not. Having a dodgy accent and velour tracksuit bottoms at a semi posh school meant people called me a chav, and yeah, I found it offensive.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    and I was brought up on a council estate and bullied to hell by the shell-suit massive whose parents would not have been out of place on jeremy kyle because i was NOT like them and was brought up by low income middle class, ie university educated but poor boho types. Was called all sorts of inverted snobbery names.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    just thinking about it more. I honestly just think there are different meanings and its tricky.

    It is used in both senses.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    i wonder if in glasgow the neds are all in uproar about their unfair portrayal, or the scallies in liverpool.

    im pretty sure they dont give a fuck what the middle classes call them
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I know someone who uses 'chavvie' in the same way people use 'mate'...he's in his 40s now so I don't know if its a generational thing where he comes from or what.

    when people talk disparagingly of 'chavs' I can see why it could be taken to be offensive. of all the people I've known, the most friendly, straight-up and generous tend to be chavish to some extent...
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