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When people 'go on' about your mum and dad it's not to attack you as a person, it's to remind you that problems can be caused by different types of people, not just one demographic, so you can't solve the problems by getting rid of one group. Benefits in general are very expensive for the country and anyone who claims them without a legitmate reason is going to be resented.
Many foreigners will work very hard, for cheap, which probably keeps wages lower too.
Now I don't think there should be agencies which only employ say... Polish people, but this is because I believe we should have a fair and open market. People should not be given jobs by nationality, but by how hard working they are and their CV.
All my family work and I have worked for ten years (I'm twenty six) and have worked alongside people from all nationalities. I hate to say it, but I have noticed a difference with work ethic between Brits and immigrants.
If we want our services to run well, we need to keep recruitment competitive.
As for the BNP... People tend to forget there have been terrorists who are BNP members/ex BNP members who have or who planned to use explosives to kill black and gay people.
Do an internet search and find out how members of the BNP are linked to racist attacks...
ETA: I work in an area of London which is around 35% nonwhite and live in a 27% nonwhite area and have never felt intimidated or unsafe...
yup, many come over with decent qualifications but are stuck doing manuel work because those qualifications arent recognised over here. i dont think all of it is down to a complete differentiation between worth ethic, employers know they can take the piss and exploit those who may not have a legitimate visa (like some cash in hand jobs). works both ways really.
Well to be fair, I'd say that most end up doing manual work because their English isn't good enough to do more advanced work.
So they do really have enough employees to cope with demand?
Lyric, I wouldn’t pay any attention to God of Schmuck. He’s liable to say absolutely nothing using rather a lot of words. I also wouldn’t worry about people bringing up your parents as a rebuttal to your ideas about immigrants and benefits. I think you’ve made it clear that you’re not necessarily comfortable with the way your parents choose to live their lives, and for what it’s worth, I think that’s admirable. As for your stance on immigrants, immigration and benefits: it’s a complex issue that takes more than just an ‘immigrants good’ or ‘immigrants bad’ approach. You’ve used some stock phrases that I hear quite often when this debate arises, and I urge you to go and do a little research around the issue if it’s something you feel strongly about. I suspect that the statistics about immigrants and benefits don’t really tally up with your assumptions. I understand that there are some people who have experienced the rough side of immigration, and their experiences aren’t to be swept aside and dismissed, because, in my opinion, that kind of attitude plays right into the hands of people like the BNP, a party whose history is pretty gruesome - something again you can find out with only a cursory amount of research. I’m starting to fee a bit like I’m lecturing you, so I shan’t go on, but take a little time and explore the issue; examine claims people make, both for and against immigration.
Uggg this is SUCH a generalisation.
In fact I can't even construct a sentence to express why this annoys me so much.
I'm having a hard time working out whose views piss me off more, yours or Lyric's.
Can't you see that you're spouting the same kind of ill-informed, prejudiced, cab-driver ranting that Lyric is, just aimed at a different target? Her bogeyman is 'immigrants', yours is 'benefit-scroungers'. You're both equally full of shit.
You dont need to make up facts and figures when you generalise.
Yes you were speaking very generally, which is where the term generalisation comes from.
No its your use of "all" i have a problem with.
"They all dream of having the life of Lyric's parents!"
Not always and this is why this debate often descends into farce. Immigration is not a black and white issue, yet often it ends up as tree-huggers vs skinheads and anyone with valid points for and against in the middle is forced from the debate.
Single asylum seekers in the UK receive less than £40 a week. Ireland, Belgium and Denmark all offer better benefits**
** At the time of the report
I think that if anybody has done something as difficult and dangerous as trekking across Europe, sometimes facing dangerous conditions, then it must be for something more than "living the benefit dream"...
Though tbh, I think UK benefits aren't enough for Brits anyway, never mind refugees
Are you saying that the information that Asylum seekers are entitled to no more than £40 a week is a lie?
:eek2:
So which ones figures would you use? The ones from the BNP's website?
Campaigns organisations and charities have to be accurate with information.
Imagine if for example, Amnesty International published a report which was completely discredited. It would get negative media attention, it would lose support due to people losing faith in its reliability and this could put lives at risk.
Charities, like other business rely on PR and good press to meet their objectives.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2010/may/14/general-election-2010-fall-bnp
I don't think we'll ever get rid of them completely though.
The people you refer to fall into the second category.
Next week's post of the week
Exactly! Poor horses
Why are they attacking the police? What have the police done?
I am being 100% honest when I say that I have never heard anything as intolerant as that from the BNP supporters I know.
I would say a tolerant person is someone who is open minded enough to try to understand opinions that they don't immediately agree or feel comfortable with. Anyone who is that quick to judge so many people they've never met is intolerant, whether they are facists or anti-facists.
and tt makes sense that they would not say intolerant things. I'm sure they're well meaning and good people who don't see themselves as racists and think it is possible to vote for the BNP simply to send a message to politicians, as a protest, or because they actually believe the BNP has the best interests of the country at heart.
And that is precisely why they can be safely regarded as thick.
I actually think that many BNP voters are intelligent, but they use different skills in their lives to many of the people on here. I'm used to using the internet to research anything I find interesting or feel strongly about because I'm a student, and of course I have the internet. When I couldn't afford the internet, and my life was just about getting through the day as well as I could, I only thought about what I could see. If you're caring for a disabled reletive, for example, they need their medication given to them at the right time, they don't care about the process of making and testing it, so as a carer you don't either. You just give them the medication and get on with the next job. So, when a family of 7 from Iraq move into the biggest house in the area while you live with 6 people in a house with 3 bedrooms, you don't think about the fact that maybe that house was owned by a different part of the council, or they've changed their criteria for whatever reason.
It's often poorer people, without a good education, to see the full impact of immigration anyway. Immigrants, as we've established, often have low paid jobs, so they live in areas where the rent is cheap a lot of the time. They send their children to a local school, even though the povery in the area means many of the kids are already struggling, and the fact that they can't speak english properly means some kids will never catch up. Many of the people who believe immigration is good for the country don't live in areas with immigrants, they may own the companies many immigrants work for, but in general they don't have to deal with any of the problems immigration can cause.
The people who've never wanted immigration are the ones left to deal with its negative effects, and are immediately labelled racists when they complain. Most BNP voters don't hate immigrants as individuals, they just wanted to make an impact, and the debates that have taken place in the last few months have proved that it's worked. I wouldn't call that "thick".
Mighty arrogant to label your fellow man in such a dismissive way.
The people have spoken but you do not want to listen.
Please consult the Democracy Rule Book at your earliest convenience.
re the sentence I bolded, I'm not discussing the merits or otherwise of our democratic system. I'm simply analysing to my belief the kind of people who could ever vote BNP.