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In other words sitting on your arses.
You couldn't handle the heat, so you needed reinforcements.
We didn't have to answer that call you know, but we did....
You do the maths mate
I add one plus one and lookie!
I see the U.S. actually landing on Omaha Beach, Normandy, VE Day, D-Day, VJ Day...among others.....
Yup...it all adds up....
fashionably late ?
Wanna take a guess at how long we left Hitler in charge of Germany even though we knew what he was like.
Wanna take a guess at how often we appeased him while he was rebuilding the German army.
Wanna take a guess at how long we waited after he reoccupied the Sudetanland?
Wanna take a guess at how long we waited after Hitler made a non aggression pact with Stalin?
Fashionably late I guess.
We turned up when it mattered? We turned up when it mattered TO US...The Americans turned up well before it mattered to them. Yes they got attacked in the Pacific but they made the CHOICE to come and help us over in Europe.
As for them not doing anything....Well they fucking well armed our soldiers for us when we left all our stuff lying on the sand after that nice little jaunt at Dunkirk..which incidentally, should have seen the entire BEF wiped out to a man if it werent for Hitlers optimism about the British. Ive seen the posters that were put out to the American public, the ones begging for weapons..The Americans provided them...They also did a hell of a lot more.
Of course they just left us to get on with it at the start, IT WAS FUCKING EUROPE...Weve been fighting amongst ourselves for thousands of years...Interesting how most critics of America are always so keen for the US to keep its nose out of other countries affairs today but slate them for staying out back then.
Listen...We didnt get involved with Hitler until we were directly threatened. We sacrificed Czechoslovakia in the name of appeasement because we werent directly threatened...
Hitler was our fault in the first place....We should count our blessings that the Americans decided to lay down their lives in defence of us and ours. How many US ww2 veterans have you spoken to Ebb? You go and speak to one and ask him how he feels about your comments.
Say what you will about the USA, without them we would not exist.
I'm fully aware had they not stepped in we would of been fucked, I am grateful for what they did and I don't hate america, I much prefer them to our european 'allies'. However, they seem to have this idea that they were doing us an uneccessary favour from their perspective, its bollocks, they were looking after themselves and had we not taken on Germany and had they had conquered us, then after re-grouping they would of possibly / probably of been setting their sights elsewhere in the world. We can only specualte what could of happened next, but the fact still remains as the German machine was gathering pace we stood up to them and made it an issue, had we not then the rest becomes irrelevant. We did, America eventaully followed and between us we won, brilliant, for which I am grateful to them, but i dispise this attiutude of theirs that it was all about them saving us.
I truly cannot believe what I am reading here....You have a go at the USA for doing exactly the same of us..The only reason we squared off to Hitler first is because we were closer.
PS, not many Americans have that view...Probably about the same as the number of Brits who think we won the war alone. :rolleyes:
lol even I'm aware we wouldn't of won the war alone.
O.K I recognise what you are saying there is true, but they were decisions made then, now we do have hindsight and its the quote used above from gi_janearng which annoyed me, perhaps my response wasn't worded very well, i did go off on a tangent, but at the end of the day they did have to get involved and not as a favour to us, I've heard the saying somehwere 'if it wasn't for America you Brits would be Germans' - true, but they don't seem to recognise that 'if it wasn't for Brits they may well be German'.
Yes but you are missing the point...THEY DIDNT KNOW THAT AT THE TIME
Oh and do you really think the millions of US soldiers came over in order to protect the USA sometime in the future? HELL NO!. The US soldiers came over to fight for all the good reasons we hear of...You think all those farmboys from bumfuck, Kansas came over because they were worried about the safety of the USA should the UK fall to the Germans? No, they came over to fight for our freedom, they came over to die for our freedom.
The motives of government is very different to the motives of soldiers.
I'm arguing with gi_janearng WHO DOES KNOW THAT NOW
I doubt very much that without the directions of the governemnt they would of all packed their bags and made their own way over here to die for us.
gi_janearng said exactly what I did..Those men did 'not have to answer that call'......At the time, nothing was forcing them to do anything. They didnt know their own country was in danger..They didnt have to come, yet they did.
Yes because we all know that what the government tells its people and what the government actually wants are always the same thing right.
Yes, thanks many of us will be grateful forever, but don't get sanctimonious. I read last week that we still have five years worth of payments to go before we clear that little debt.
You see, those arms weren't given to us, you sold them.
The same reason our government convinced us to go to war when Hitler invaded Poland...for freedom and all that bullshit.
Yep. Not one word, not even called up any reservists.
That's what we have a standing army for, so that the majority of people can continue their normal lives. Or do you suggest that everytime our forces act, we should start conscription and open up the ranks instantly?
Funnily enough I knew that. People from 67 nations were killed. Yet very few of those nations have soldiers on the ground...
No, your nation was attacked. Some of my countryment were killed in that attack. There is a difference.
Actually we didn't wait to be called. We volunteered.
And you? Enjoying Thailand are you? Seen many Terrorists there?
We each have a role in society, at the moment, my Govt hasn't issued a "Your country needs you" plea....
Only to sort out the internal problems we have, I work for my Govt already you see. Maybe I don't fight, but neither do I just take...
Well the timing was a bit of a coincidence, immediatley after Pearl Habour en all.
WTF are you smoking tonight? You are going off on some bizarre tangents..
Are you saying that the US government convinced US citizens to go fight in Europe because a base 5000 miles away was attacked by a totally different group?
No I'm asking whether the timing of their decision to convince those troops was a coincidence with regards to pearl habour.
Maybe i got the whole context wrong, excuse me if I have. But basically you will find these terrorists hiding everywhere.
Even found out that a terror-network were producing fake passports here in Denmark (45 minutes away from me actually). Who would have thought of stuff like that happening in li'l ickle Denmark?
As I dont know greenhats reason for being in Thailand I won't
make assumptions... But if it is for military reasons, then I am not sure that he would tell you what exactly is happening there within his field. And I don't think that we have the right to start doubting terror network in Thailand, if he has been stationed there for that reason.
Of course it wasnt....That was a contributing factor to the US governments decision to declare war. Once again, the US citizens who went to fight in Europe did so in the belief that they were fighting for our freedom.
Can you please get to the fucking point...You keep going round in strange circles..
I'm sure the Russians would have something to say about that.
Maybe they believed that, but it doesn't mean they were, the government acted after it became apparent their freedom was under threat, not ours. The governemnt made the decisions, not the troops, those Americans came here to fight primarily because their freedom was threatened
QUOTE]Originally posted by Balddog
they came over to fight for our freedom, they came over to die for our freedom.
[/QUOTE]
your right they came here delluded, but thats irrelevant, they are directed by the governemnt, its what the governemnt of the USA was fighting for thats relevant, the soliders weren't free lance. They took instructions, not from us, whether they wanted to be here is questionable, whether they would of come if Pearl Habour had not of happened is even more questionable.
I think the US would have entered the war regardless of Pearl Harbour....You seem to be arguing with yourself here mate....First you say that the US joined in because they could see themselves being at threat from Hitler in the future, and then you go on to say that the US only got involved because of pearl harbour..Which was it?
The Us soilders came here to fight for their freedom, their government intrested in their freedom directed them to do so
They joined in becasue they were under threat full stop.
How about our soldiers? When we declared war on Germany...Were our soldiers fighting for selfish reasons too? Were they fighting only to defend our nation and were their notions of fighting tyranny and injustice just crap?
The US govts real reasons were self defence but the reasons they instilled in their soldiers were those of justice, freedom and anti-nazism...The soldiers were fighting for what they believed as right.
Really? Can you explain to me how Hitler threatened America?
A detailed strategic evaluation please. One that includes assessment of naval, air and ground forces and capabilities, as well as economic evaluation of the impact of The Third Reich.
The reality is that Germany and Italy were no threat to the United States, and would not have the ability to threaten the United States in the foreseeable future (viewpoint of 8 December, 1941). The United States could have stayed out of the war in Europe and allowed Britain to waste away, and the Russians to defeat Hitler. Would have been tough on you lot, but it sounds like that is what you would have preferred.
Millions of weapons were donated by American citizens to arm your Home Guard. Those weapons cost the UK not one pence. Those weapons now sit at the bottom of the North Sea where your government dumped them after the war.
Ah, now the reality appears. You don't intend to serve unless forced to by conscription.