Home Politics & Debate
If you need urgent support, call 999 or go to your nearest A&E. To contact our Crisis Messenger (open 24/7) text THEMIX to 85258.
Read the community guidelines before posting ✨
Options

Homeowner arrested after burglar falls from window.

17891012

Comments

  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Whowhere wrote: »
    Depends who you're dealing with. If it's a drug user who needs the money for their habit, then yes try and treat them (although they still need to be punished for breaking the law in the first place).

    However that still doesn't solve the problem of people who steal simply because they want more and don't want to pay for it. I can think of at least 5 on my area off the top of my head who are our most prolific theives but don't have a drug problem.

    You solve that problem by having a fair and equitable society that isn't obsessed with consumerism.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Blagsta wrote: »
    You solve that problem by having a fair and equitable society that isn't obsessed with consumerism.

    Yeah: Society made them do it.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Yeah: Society made them do it.

    Why do you think countries where there are wide disparities of wealth have higher crime rates?

    Why do you think Japans crime rate has gone down since 1946 where as ours has gone up loads?
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    budda wrote: »
    Why do you think countries where there are wide disparities of wealth have higher crime rates?

    Why do you think Japans crime rate has gone down since 1946 where as ours has gone up loads?

    Why? lol
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    budda wrote: »
    Why do you think countries where there are wide disparities of wealth have higher crime rates?

    Why do you think Japans crime rate has gone down since 1946 where as ours has gone up loads?

    I don't doubt that's the case; I just don't think that it's that black and white, is all. There'll be a myriad of reasons why people steal, and I instinctively baulk at any suggestion that discounts the notions of personal responsibility and accountability.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Blagsta wrote: »
    You solve that problem by having a fair and equitable society that isn't obsessed with consumerism.



    lol erm ok. Back in the real world I think we realised a few thousand years ago that utopia won't ever exist except in the world of Star Trek.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Whowhere wrote: »
    Back in the real world I think we realised a few thousand years ago that utopia won't ever exist except in the world of Star Trek.

    We did? When was this?
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I don't doubt that's the case; I just don't think that it's that black and white, is all. There'll be a myriad of reasons why people steal, and I instinctively baulk at any suggestion that discounts the notions of personal responsibility and accountability.

    Of course, and I wasnt suggesting that people who rob or steal are somehow blameless, its just I think we have created a society in which these things are more likely. There is always a big difference between understanding why people do things and agreeing with them doing them.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Yerascrote wrote: »
    We did? When was this?

    Ever since we gave it the name Utopia (it's taken from Greek and means 'place that does not exist')
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    budda wrote: »
    Of course, and I wasnt suggesting that people who rob or steal are somehow blameless, its just I think we have created a society in which these things are more likely. There is always a big difference between understanding why people do things and agreeing with them doing them.

    There's a myriad of reasons and inequality is only one of them. Japan for example is a more homogenous and deferrential society, where low level crime and anti-social behaviour is frowned on. It also has much tougher sentences than the UK (it retains capital punishment for example).

    Also historically the UK has not been law-abiding. commentators as early as Elizibethian tmes mentioned the British (or rather English) predelicition for drinking and fighting. It's probably no coincidence that the British were the first country to have a professional police force (in Ireland rather than England).

    People have this view of a golden age when England was a crime free paradise and little old maidens cycled to church without fear of molestation by violent thugs and Dixon walked the streets dealing with offenders with a clip round the ear. In actual fact Dixon was brutally gunned down in the film he first appeared in and during the late 19th century most police were firearmed trained and had easy access to them, even if they weren't carried routinely.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Yeah: Society made them do it.

    "There's no such thing as society - merely individuals and their families"

    silly me
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Whowhere wrote: »
    lol erm ok. Back in the real world I think we realised a few thousand years ago that utopia won't ever exist except in the world of Star Trek.

    Have you actually got anything interesting to say?
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    People have this view of a golden age when England was a crime free paradise and little old maidens cycled to church without fear of molestation by violent thugs


    relevance?
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Blagsta wrote: »
    "There's no such thing as society - merely individuals and their families"

    silly me

    Huh?
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Blagsta wrote: »
    relevance?

    Read the two paragraphs before for context...
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Huh?

    It's a quote from Thatcher, she was the one who advocated Individualism and introduced rampant Consumerism into our society. Perphaps a reason why there's an increase in burgulary?
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Yerascrote wrote: »
    It's a quote from Thatcher, she was the one who advocated Individualism and introduced rampant Consumerism into our society. Perphaps a reason why there's an increase in burgulary?

    May be a reason, but it's also because we now have more disposable consumer goods which are easier to sell.

    In the 1930's it wasn't worth breaking into to more than a small number of homes, because there wasn't thing which could be easily carried and sold. Nowdays most people have CDs, DVDs, jewellry etc...
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Read the two paragraphs before for context...

    Nope, still can't see it.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    May be a reason, but it's also because we now have more disposable consumer goods which are easier to sell.

    In the 1930's it wasn't worth breaking into to more than a small number of homes, because there wasn't thing which could be easily carried and sold. Nowdays most people have CDs, DVDs, jewellry etc...

    No shit Sherlock.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Blagsta wrote: »
    No shit Sherlock.

    I don't get you Blagsta - 99% of your posts make you out to be a twat or an idiot, often both at the same. But every now and then you can make intelligent points and engage in debate... P'haps if you tried it more often people might be more receptive to your posts.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I don't get you Blagsta - 99% of your posts make you out to be a twat or an idiot, often both at the same. But every now and then you can make intelligent points and engage in debate... P'haps if you tried it more often people might be more receptive to your posts.

    He's a wind-up merchant. Always has been.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I don't get you Blagsta - 99% of your posts make you out to be a twat or an idiot, often both at the same. But every now and then you can make intelligent points and engage in debate... P'haps if you tried it more often people might be more receptive to your posts.

    Whilst I don't agree with 99% I do agree that you seem to have suddenly decided to be a right twat in this thread Blagsta - seriously, what the fuck? You just came on tonight and decided to be willfully prick like?

    Please take a deep breath man, and stop being such a dick.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I don't get you Blagsta - 99% of your posts make you out to be a twat or an idiot, often both at the same. But every now and then you can make intelligent points and engage in debate... P'haps if you tried it more often people might be more receptive to your posts.

    If you make an idiotic post, I'm gonna reply in kind. All I see from you is idiotic posts.

    meh
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Jim V wrote: »
    Whilst I don't agree with 99% I do agree that you seem to have suddenly decided to be a right twat in this thread Blagsta - seriously, what the fuck? You just came on tonight and decided to be willfully prick like?

    Please take a deep breath man, and stop being such a dick.


    What the fuck? get a grip man
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Blagsta wrote: »
    If you make an idiotic post, I'm gonna reply in kind. All I see from you is idiotic posts.

    meh

    :shocking:

    Newsflash

    "Pot calls kettle black"

    :shocking:
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I get annoyed by blinkered fools and having the same arguments over and over again. Time for a break probably.

    meh
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    You get annoyed by people not falling into line behind your arguments and accepting what you say uncritically...
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Flashman - of course there was no golden age, and of course comparisons between countries are troublesome because of the differences in culture and set family structures.

    But there are certain things that could be done, and systems which could be changed which I think would reduce our problem drug/alcohol intake and the crime rate. And I'm not even convinced this would need much more money.

    - Increase in rehabilitation budget for criminals (yes an up front cost but a medium term saving)

    - Increase in mental health budget and treatment (same as above, reduction in time off work, violence, drug/alcohol abuse etc.)

    - Change in education system so it is a mixture of vocational and achedemic, removal of pure focus on exams (again some costs up front but better trained kids are better trained adults who feel more confident in themselves and better adjust to being an adult and getting a job)

    - Increase in social housing budget (again short term costs but once people actually felt they had something to loose, an area they can be proud of things like vandalism would decrease and social cohesion would increase)
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    budda wrote: »
    Flashman - of course there was no golden age, and of course comparisons between countries are troublesome because of the differences in culture and set family structures.

    But there are certain things that could be done, and systems which could be changed which I think would reduce our problem drug/alcohol intake and the crime rate. And I'm not even convinced this would need much more money.

    - Increase in rehabilitation budget for criminals (yes an up front cost but a medium term saving)

    - Increase in mental health budget and treatment (same as above, reduction in time off work, violence, drug/alcohol abuse etc.)

    - Change in education system so it is a mixture of vocational and achedemic, removal of pure focus on exams (again some costs up front but better trained kids are better trained adults who feel more confident in themselves and better adjust to being an adult and getting a job)

    - Increase in social housing budget (again short term costs but once people actually felt they had something to loose, an area they can be proud of things like vandalism would decrease and social cohesion would increase)

    I'd agree with the first three (though I think the fourth is untrue), but they aren't to do with income disparity, but how resources are used
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I'd agree with the first three (though I think the fourth is untrue), but they aren't to do with income disparity, but how resources are used

    Fair enough, though I'm curious as to why you think giving people better social housing wouldnt be good for communities, frankly if I had to live in some of the social housing in London I'd be pretty angry about the world.

    You're right though it isnt directly about income disparity, but it is about leaving a large minority at the bottom and not doing what we can to help them.
Sign In or Register to comment.