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Nobody has denied that.
Being drunk does make you more vunerable. Another fairly simple concept.
Undestanding and realising that fact, doesn't mean that you have apply blame to those that do get raped.
The two ideas are not mutually exclusive.
It's common sense, and it applies to plenty of other crimes.
Of course.
No blame should be aplied to the victim in those circumstances either.
In a perfect world nobody should have to apply caution and think about ways of avoiding becoming a victim of any crime.
But then this isn't a perfect world and it never will be.
It should never be regared as something women SHOULD do because then blame might be applied to them, but advice on how women COULD do their best to avoid rape isn't a bad idea.
If you believe that someone who leaves their car unlocked yadayada, then you believe that someone who gets stupidly drunk is to blame for being raped. You can't have it both ways.
I agree with Skive above.
Yes, they do things like that in schools over here. Afaik there are sex education classes where they also teach young ones about the "etchics" of sex, that you shouldn't trespass anyones personal space etc etc etc...
I asked you a question based on what it would appear that you were saying. I was not putting words in your mouth. The english was strange.
Also, I don't really think it's true that you can only argue one way in the car/vagina unlocked analogy, why can't I have a different view on theft as a crime than I do on rape as a crime? If I think that rape is always morally wrong but theft isn't I'm taking differring views on the 'criminal', so why can't I take differing views on the victim?
So do you think if I left my sat nav on show and it got nicked I some blame would lie with me?
It's not a bad analogy.
Hows about assault?
Would it be ok to actively advise blokes about the dangerous of drinking to much incase they're assaulted in town?
I still can't get around the problem you have with the idea. Nobody here is offereing it up as the solution to rape. Everybody's knows that most rapes occur by aquaintances and familly members, but some of us just think that it's something that shoulnd't be ignored.
Being aware of dangers and the actions you can take to prevent them is something we apply in every other walk of life, why not rape?
You're being far too simplistic and you know it. Noone is thinking about blaming the victim simply because they had too much to drink, but stating the clear and simple truth that if you're careful about how much you drink and the circumstances you find yourself in, the chances of harm coming your way are lower.
This advice won't stop the disgusting examples given where someone has abused trust but I'm completely failing to understand why you and others think that encouraging people to drink sensibly is a bad thing, especially when you yourself work in the NHS and see the after effects of too much alcohol on a regular basis.
This is NOT about blaming a victim of rape or any other crime because they were drunk, it's about hopefully preventing a crime from taking place. I don't see how anyone can argue that is a bad thing. Or would some of you rather we dont say anything in case we offend someone?
No I don't. I think it's a terrible analogy.
Why?
If you're apply that to rape then it surely it means -
"If I go out and get drunk and I get raped then some blame lies with me"
I can't believe that's what you think based on your posts but that's the only way any of us in the office have been able to understand the comment.
BTW, pretty bog standard travel advice to women travelling alone abroad is, don't go to a bar on your own and get drunk. The implication is pretty obvious - that in doing so you would greatly increase your risk of getting conned, robbed - or even raped. Is the source of that advice saying if you do go out and get drunk and get raped - it's your fault? I don't think so. Is advising someone to carry a rape alarm saying to people that don't and get raped that it's their fault? No.
I'm don't believe that though. That was the point I was making.
If I left my sat nav on show and it got nicked. No blame should be applied to me.
From my own point of view, and working on an advice website, I absolutely believe that general advice around safety and behaviour isn't something that is a problem.
My issue is that as soon as you target that advice towards a particular crime you distort the message you are saying. Advice around alcohol should be about responsible drinking without having to link it to rape. When that happens I think that's where stereotypes and issues that allow rapists to be acquitted start to grow.
I think the same thing happens with targetting drinking information towards violence when aimed at men - there's an assumption that if you are drunk and in a fight you were partly to blame, regardless of the facts.
Well, a fight is a two-way thing whereas rape isn't. But that's true in some cases.
I guess it's all about perspective though; people would advise that for any type of violent crime, being sensible about alcohol can help in some circumstances. This is often touted as advice as there is a drinking problem in the UK - maybe even the world but I'm not that far travelled. People do get habitually drunk. So it's even more relevent here.
I would guess that rape occurs less than something like abh or gbh (that's a guess though, as I said) as it's a more serious crime. However, it is discussed so much more often, thats why in these threads people say one way could be the alcohol factor. If you look at some threads where people have been involved in abh / battery / assault or whatever, people have often said less sympathetically about how drink influences people and makes them vulnerable.
When we talk about rape, it is natural to say what could be done to combat rape specifically, even if those things are not exclusively beneficial in prevention of rape. I hope that makes sense?