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Does God exist?
Former Member
Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
I thought i might as well add this classic forum debate topic here.
As you all know, religion has more effect on us than you think. Or maybe not, because i don't know what you think. It controls a part of our life, a bit of conversation and mind-simulations when you are bored. There's always going to be the question: Does God exist? Or maybe: What happens after life? And: What created this thing called Tellus. Or Earth, just boasting a bit. I'll section these three questions and press the red cross if you're bored.
warning: I did not create this to influence other forum applicants to convert to X religion, and if you feel yourself being easily influenced, just dont read this at all.
1) Does God exist? Well, if we answer no, there's the question why. Why did we even think of something like up and down. Now we scientifically know that there is no hell under the ground, if it's not ethereal of course, which is what christians hang on to at the moment. And there is no heaven above us, except if it's ethereal, again. This is quite reasonable because of the lack of information there was at the time religions were created. Sorry there, religions weren't created, or that remains to be solved. What would you think when you saw these enomous clouds and thunder and maybe once and a while volcano eruptions, thunderstorms, maybe tsunamis and earthquakes. Look at the sky, and what would you genuinly think if you did not know what it was. If you did not know what rain was, what hail was or you name it. No, you wouldn't think that they were clouds, of course not.
2) What happens after life? What do you think? That you become unconcious of things around you and you are simply dust? Maybe you believe in buddhism, the nirvana string. That if you have been virtuous this life, you will move forth up the string, and the opposite, down the string. Maybe you believe in satanism, that indulgence is not a sin, and satan is around us. That things can be demoniacal and the opposite. Maybe you're an aethist or an agnostic, determined or lost.
3) What created Earth? Well, what did? Big Bang? God? Big Bang is just a theory, but of course god is also. Did big bang really create earth? Did the explosion of a primavel atom create these universes. Galaxies are moving away from eachother, and the more time that occurs, the more evidence are unrevealed. But this theory will never be proven right, but it hasn't been proven wrong yet.
Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Bang
What about God? Is he proven right? That He with his godlike powers gifted a women with pregnancy so He would represent god on this earth. But! We can be fairly certain that Jesus was not born the 25th of december. This battles the validity of Christianity, that it was maybe just a story of a lost mind. Of course there are other religions.
For christianity:
http://www.doesgodexist.org/
Against christianity:
http://www.museumofhoaxes.com/hoax/forum/forum_comments/3131/
Feel free to post here on what you feel about this, that i am very wrong or a llittle bit too realistic or so right that you'd rather call me on my phone than turning lights on and off.
As you all know, religion has more effect on us than you think. Or maybe not, because i don't know what you think. It controls a part of our life, a bit of conversation and mind-simulations when you are bored. There's always going to be the question: Does God exist? Or maybe: What happens after life? And: What created this thing called Tellus. Or Earth, just boasting a bit. I'll section these three questions and press the red cross if you're bored.
warning: I did not create this to influence other forum applicants to convert to X religion, and if you feel yourself being easily influenced, just dont read this at all.
1) Does God exist? Well, if we answer no, there's the question why. Why did we even think of something like up and down. Now we scientifically know that there is no hell under the ground, if it's not ethereal of course, which is what christians hang on to at the moment. And there is no heaven above us, except if it's ethereal, again. This is quite reasonable because of the lack of information there was at the time religions were created. Sorry there, religions weren't created, or that remains to be solved. What would you think when you saw these enomous clouds and thunder and maybe once and a while volcano eruptions, thunderstorms, maybe tsunamis and earthquakes. Look at the sky, and what would you genuinly think if you did not know what it was. If you did not know what rain was, what hail was or you name it. No, you wouldn't think that they were clouds, of course not.
2) What happens after life? What do you think? That you become unconcious of things around you and you are simply dust? Maybe you believe in buddhism, the nirvana string. That if you have been virtuous this life, you will move forth up the string, and the opposite, down the string. Maybe you believe in satanism, that indulgence is not a sin, and satan is around us. That things can be demoniacal and the opposite. Maybe you're an aethist or an agnostic, determined or lost.
3) What created Earth? Well, what did? Big Bang? God? Big Bang is just a theory, but of course god is also. Did big bang really create earth? Did the explosion of a primavel atom create these universes. Galaxies are moving away from eachother, and the more time that occurs, the more evidence are unrevealed. But this theory will never be proven right, but it hasn't been proven wrong yet.
Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Bang
What about God? Is he proven right? That He with his godlike powers gifted a women with pregnancy so He would represent god on this earth. But! We can be fairly certain that Jesus was not born the 25th of december. This battles the validity of Christianity, that it was maybe just a story of a lost mind. Of course there are other religions.
For christianity:
http://www.doesgodexist.org/
Against christianity:
http://www.museumofhoaxes.com/hoax/forum/forum_comments/3131/
Feel free to post here on what you feel about this, that i am very wrong or a llittle bit too realistic or so right that you'd rather call me on my phone than turning lights on and off.
0
Comments
That’s not to say there’s not a god, I don’t have faith myself, but there is no tangible evidence for or against a creator, there is still space for a creator in most modern theories of the formation of the universe.
If there is a god, I still believe in evolution and the formation of the universe many billions of years ago by some action, (which may not necessarily be the big bang, there are other fairly sensible theories out there too…) rather than him/it/her creating it in 6 days and all that romance.
Also follow current widely held theories about the formation of planets/stars etc after the formation of the universe, by conglomeration of matter etc.
Life, and even the creation of the universe could well be an entirely random event, I don't really think us as humans are significant in the wider picture...
Religion is a nice idea, but I need proof damnit
Organised religion: No faith in it at alll.
Still the answers are
1) Dunno
2) Dunno
3) Dunno
What seems most probable is -
1) No
2) Not much
3) Sometimes stuff just happens
Look at the evidence (from a Christian perspective), an ancient book, that provides no actually proof but a collection of stories that are told to tell us how our morals should be, sounds like the first ever Law book, i think a lot of the stories are idiotic though i like the parables and they're really useful, though the general teachings just smack off arrogance and most of it's followers smack of arrogance, as do most atheists, i don't disocunt the fact that there might be a God, an eternal force present within ourselves and everything around us if you will, and i always maintained that if there is a God, he'll see the goodness within your heart, a real God wouldn't expect you to follow a religion or go to a holy building everyday to pray to him, he'd see your true goodness and thats your path to salvation or whatever
was the matter always there though, how did the matter come about?
could you picture the universe without matter, would it exist?
matter is energy & vica versa, so it is perfectly possible to have a "universe" with no matter in it.
of course, then it kind of wouldnt be a universe as we know it :chin:
what would it look like though?
it wouldn't "look", because energy doesn't emit anything, as it is energy that is emitted from things like line emission in gasses, or particles in potential wells etc.
energy doesnt reflect, it is energy that is changed and transfered when matter reflects, you can't see energy, you can only see the result of energy change, therefor if there was nothing but energy, there would be nothing to see
it would be really boring
Threads like this tend to attract bigoted Christians who try and convert people and bigoted atheists who look down on people with differing ideas on life to them.
1) When looking at religion and spirituality, I tend to take an interpersonal approach when tackling the existence of a deity, archetype or myth. I think that this 'God' or indeed 'Goddess' exists to us if we believe it to. I know that doesn't make much sense... But take for example the idea of prayer. The reason organised religion exists (and more recently, spiritual consumerism... In my opinion) is that it gives an energy form, something for us to visualise, to relate to.
I wouldn't go so far as saying that I believe in a sentient God. I believe in the Jungian idea of a pool of consciousness however, but how we view this energy/Chi/God/ect is how it exists.
2) I believe in reincarnation as a fact. Everything seems to have cycles, nothing disappears. But each to their own.
3) Fucked if I know... I'm happy to be here. And who cares who created earth? It's 'who created beauty?' that counts.
I don't care either way, if God is a logical man, he's not be supprised people don't beleive in him when they look about and think how fucked up the world is, and how religion has been made into an exploitative, hateful, capitalistic machine that does naught but ill. Infact, if he does, i'd say he is pretty depressed his creation fucked up so badly. Poor chap.
I think God, if he exists, has given up on humanity a looong time ago, and I can't blame him for it. Probably when religion started to be used as an excuse for killing others or started to become a money spinner.
God didn't create the problems we have today, we created them ourselves and only we can solve them, it's pretty simple. There are exceptions like natural disasters that make me question the existence of God, though there are antithesis to this that can be argued
however i dont believe in a god myself i just dont know and hopefully i wish i could inspend mylife trying to explain these things which we just dont know yet like what really happened at the begining of the universe as we know it, and i think those who believe in a god are avoiding the big job of trying to find an explanation - scientific methods alays try to explain things further and never stick at anything, whilst imo religion is a spiritual thing not a physical thing though ive never felt need for it
If God interviened to give you your bike back, don't you think he'd also be doing a little something about the 3rd world?
However those who believe they have 'the answer' are dangerous, scary and normally bigoted people.
'But,' says Man, 'the Babel fish is a dead giveaway isn't it? It could not have evolved by chance. It proves you exist, and so therefore, by your own arguements, you don't. QED.'
'Oh dear,' says God, 'I hadn't thought of that,' and promptly vanishes in a puff of logic.
'Oh, that was easy,' says Man, and for an encore goes on to prove that black is white and gets himself killed on the next zebra crossing.
Most leading theologians claim that this arguement is a load of dingo's kidneys, but that didn't stop Oolan Colluphid making a small fortune when he used it as the central theme of his best-selling book Well That About Wraps It Up For God.
it's not that straightforward, you can't second guess god.......the 3rd world is not some natural phenomena, it's inflicted indirectly by us in the 'developed' world, you could say the same thing about wars, famines etc.........btw all these things are mentioned in the bible, a self-fulfiilling prophecy that must come to pass.........imo of course.
I don't think she is interventionist, but she's there. There's too much that cannot be explained without having God in the equation.
As for which God, I think all the Gods are basically interpretations of the same thing.
I don't see where how you can draw distinction between the two. Depending on your meaning of phenomenum, and i take it you mean naturally occuring, then neither bike theft nor third world povety is a natual occurence.
I don't think that lack of explanation infers a diety in the slightest. There have been plenty of things that man has been unable to explain that later have been.
I didn't say that though.
I said that there is too much that cannot be explained without factoring in the presence of a deity.
i'm saying that when god made the world, he didn't make a 3rd world, it's something that has developed out of man's greed.......that's the whole point, god gives man the right to autonomy and choice.......you're right bike theft isn't a natural occurence, some toe rag came and chopped the bike chain........i'm saying that i do believe in the power of prayer, if it is god's will then your prayers will be answered, maybe not in the way you expected.......mine have countless times, more often than not when i pray for others and not myself i find........i don't think you can draw a clear distinction between when god will and will not intervene.........i'm not saying it's gods will that millions of people are starving, i do believe that we are all put on this earth to learn lessons, if god comes down and makes everything perfect then what's the point?..........
you mean the actual event or why do i think god answered my prayer?.....