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Cats do have feelings. I can assure you of that.
To be honest i couldn't care less if cats feel anything seeing as i'm never likely to ever come across one. No animal deserves to get it's fur blasted off, and shes obvously a nutter but whats stickin her in prison gonna do? Hardly gonna reform her is it.
Where do you live, Antarctica?
No, probably not. What good does prison do anyone? However, that's a whole other thread innit.
Nah. Just not many cats around here.
So, just because luck would have it that we got to the top of the evolutionary ladder first, that gives us the right to knock ten bells of shit out of anything that is not the same as us? To torture an animal in a boiling hot washing machine as an act of 'revenge' on a boyfriend is just downright evil - and she if the prisons could have held her (no thanks to overcrowding), they should have put her away.
At what stage does animal cruelty 'warrant prison time'? Or do you think that imprisonment for animal cruelty should never take place?
Where's that then? The moon?
Ok, fair enough, but I do wish to point out when I think people are discussing something out of perspective. So don't tell me not to do that.
I don't need "a story" because I'm not on trial. The reason I post is to hear other peoples' views, otherwise I would just keep my own to myself and assume I'm always right.
My view isn't that all animal cruelty is the same. In fact I do distinguish between torturing and killing a cat and angling, I'm a regular angler myself and I want to know how people distinguish between such acts.
Well this is where the definition of intention comes in. An angler knows that his actions will result in the torture of a fish (if fish can feel pain) and most anglers consider the most exciting part of fishing "the fight" - pulling in a hooked fish against its will i.e. causing it pain and distress. I am interested in why you distinguish that from torturing an animal for another reason.
(As for numbers, millions of people fish every year. Apparently it is the largest sport in the UK)
Lol don't make out that i agree with animal cruelty when i've already said i don't.
I just don't see it as important as other crimes. Yeah it's bad and i never said she shouldn't be punished for it as it is still a crime. I just don't see animals in the same way as humans. Simple as that!
And that's your problem, not ours.
How? Are you a cat?
Lol ta for that. If there was ever any misunderstanding in my mind that that was your problem and not mine then you've cleared it right up for me.
Thanks
I am sorry, but most of the hardships in this world ON humans is brought BY humans. And for 90% of the time, we express horror on the other threads at how issues relating to other humans are so terrible. Human issues get most of our attention, most of the time.
But this once, when we raise an issue on the inhumane and evil actions towards a cat, we are suddenly branded uncaring about human beings.
So the less than 1% of the time we spend debating human issues generally, a voice of concern for the welfare of animals is poo-poo'ed as irrelevant. Who speaks for them? Can we not get angry on their behalf?
Ok, you pointed out that you thought people had blown this out of proportion and that there were other issues. That's totally fair enough. Is there any need to labour the point? It obviously is important to some of us or we wouldn't bother our arses discussing it (or attempting to). Doesn't mean we don't think other issues aren't important, too.
When did I say you were on trial? Drama queen.
Are you trying to suggest animals are incapable of experiencing anger, sadness, joy, distress, anger, envy and many other feelings?
I have an animal that feels fear, it feels excitement, it knows boredom and sure has shown me a lot of defiance lately.
Eyes can deceive.
I am suggesting that some animals are incapable of experiencing those things, yes.
I'm trying to work out where people draw the line, why, and why they are so incensed that other people don't intuitively know where that line is.
Tie a cat down and start kicking it, it will screech.
Kill a kitten in front of it's mother and the mother will show emotions of sadness.
They feel pain... Doesn't take a genius to figure that out (what's your point?).
Surely if you don't think cats have feelings, you think we can abuse them how we want?
Sorry... Just the jist I feel from that post.
What animals? I'm especially wondering about animals that belong to humans here. I already know that flies aren't very emotional animals.
I draw the line at HOW the death is delivered. I don't care if it's a cat or a fish, I don't see anything fine with torturing it to death.
If somebody kills an animal quickly (bullet to the brain) on purpose without the owner's permission I think monetary fines are good and acceptable. It's sad but at least the animal died quickly. IF the said animal was tortured brutally and died because of it I think the damage goes beyond paying the other some money. I know of a girl who lost a horse she had owned for less than a year after she was betrayed and lied to and later found out that her horse had died a terrible slow painful death. This is something you don't get over easily! It's something you cared for, spent time on as well as a lot of money. For somebody to inflict that on somebody I think is pretty severe and outright disgusting.
That shows that animals have sensitivity to their environment - not that they feel emotions. An jellyfish has sensitivity to its environment, so does a starfish, a salmon, a sparrow, an alligator, a cat, and a whale. Do they all feel "emotions"?
I'm not trolling, I'm actually interested as to how people can get so angry at somebody expressing an opinion (for instance Toadborg making no distinction between a cat and a fly) when they have drawn an unexplained line somehwhere.
Some people will draw the line at slightly different places than others. Whether inconsistent or not it is generally agreed that some animals such as mammals of certain intelligence and who have been pets and companions of humans for tens of thousands of years are a tad more important than an ant.
Well if by "people" you mean women such as the one originally in question, there is no doubt that she knew where that line was and crossed it -- as I think most people who inflict cruelty on animals [in the manner she did] do. If she hadn't known where the line was and had been unaware of the innate cruelty of her actions then obviously she wouldn't have revealed her actions to her partner on the telephone with the sole intention of hurting and upsetting him as some kind of currency in trying to make him come home. If she hadn't know where the line was, she surely would've thought that he might've returned home and not been at all bothered to find his cat in the washer.
To be honest I think the fact that she used a defenceless animal as a pawn in some sick game with her boyfrined is even worse than had she tortured it purely for her own fun. In her eyes it was a totally disposable and inconsequential way for her to exact revenge and gain the attention of her signifigant other. If that's not one fucked up person in serious need of an immediate mental health evaluation then I don't know who is.
But if flies don't feel emotions what is wrong with torturing them to death, if it gives pleasure to a human being?
But thats not to do with the suffering of the animal, its to do with inflicting suffering on its owner (i.e. a human).
Have you not considered that its an issue which has quite an emotional charge for a lot of people? So is therefore not out of perspective?
I said some animals, not all animals.
If people draw the line at different places (and this is therefore a fairly arbitrary distinction) why are you getting so angry at somebody who disgarees at where tat line should be drawn? And demanding that people who disagree at your line be sent to prison?
Fish too have been pets and companions of humans for tens of thousands of years...
Will you quit with the straw man arguments?
Thanks.