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Woman who put cat in washing machine escapes jail

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  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    carlito wrote: »
    No, I'm not, but there should be some sense of proportion. This thread was started less than three hours ago and already has four pages of hand wringing and calls to burn the woman at the stake. Looking down the list of topics on this forum I cannot see one thread about the many wars we are currently engaged in, murderous or torturous regimes our country supports, world poverty, etc.

    But post a thread about a depressed woman killing a cat in wales and you have spontaneous collective hysteria.

    You haven't read this thread? Very little has been mentioned about the woman - most have been responses to Toadborg's rather worrying view on this ...
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Blagsta wrote: »
    Does one caring about one preclude caring about the other?

    Well, exactly.

    It's deeply offensive of you to suggest that because people here take issue with animal cruelty that they consider it a bigger issue or more important than human torture, murder etc. Not to mention complete bollocks. As for "hand-wringing", "collective hysteria" and calls to "burn her at the stake"... well, you definitely have a flair for the dramatic, I'll give you that. I'd say the most hysterical reply in this thread has been yours. This topic is about animal cruelty and the methods in which we do/don't deal with it. If you have no interest in the topic and want to debate any facet of our foreign policy then go start a thread about it. Just because you don't give a fuck about the story doesn't mean that it isn't troubling to anyone else, or that it shouldn't be discussed.

    Also, to be honest I don't know how you've got the nerve to berate us for spending time questioning the views of someone who seems to have quite a twisted perspective on this issue. It is a perfectly valid use of time in my view. However, since you consider writing letters to be an altogether more worthy use of your time why don't you practise what you prattle on about instead of merely extending your redundant preaching to this topic.

    As for the fact that she channelled her rage at her boyfriend into inflicting torture and death on an animal, yes that point has been made already, I think we're pretty much all aware that that is the case. I also think [hope?] we can all agree that this is not the behaviour of someone who is compus mentus, and therefore she needs help to be able to deal with her emotions in a way that is not endangering the lives of other beings - whatever type of being they may be. Ignoring relatively small mental problems like those this woman has is deeply irresponsible.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Namaste wrote: »
    Actually, some of Amnesty's letter writing campaigns have lead to the release of political prisoners. You write directly to them and whether they receive the letters or not it places pressure on the government to release them.

    I would have though that while letters help, its the pressure that people put on their own governments to apply pressure that gives us these good results, not the letters themselves?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    briggi wrote: »
    Well, exactly.

    It's deeply offensive of you to suggest that because people here take issue with animal cruelty that they consider it a bigger issue or more important than human torture, murder etc. Not to mention complete bollocks. As for "hand-wringing", "collective hysteria" and calls to "burn her at the stake"... well, you definitely have a flair for the dramatic, I'll give you that. I'd say the most hysterical reply in this thread has been yours. This topic is about animal cruelty and the methods in which we do/don't deal with it. If you have no interest in the topic and want to debate any facet of our foreign policy then go start a thread about it. Just because you don't give a fuck about the story doesn't mean that it isn't troubling to anyone else, or that it shouldn't be discussed.

    Also, to be honest I don't know how you've got the nerve to berate us for spending time questioning the views of someone who seems to have quite a twisted perspective on this issue. It is a perfectly valid use of time in my view. However, since you consider writing letters to be an altogether more worthy use of your time why don't you practise what you prattle on about instead of merely extending your redundant preaching to this topic.

    As for the fact that she channelled her rage at her boyfriend into inflicting torture and death on an animal, yes that point has been made already, I think we're pretty much all aware that that is the case. I also think [hope?] we can all agree that this is not the behaviour of someone who is compus mentus, and therefore she needs help to be able to deal with her emotions in a way that is not endangering the lives of other beings - whatever type of being they may be. Ignoring relatively small mental problems like those this woman has is deeply irresponsible.

    :heart:
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Teagan wrote: »
    I would have though that while letters help, its the pressure that people put on their own governments to apply pressure that gives us these good results, not the letters themselves?

    Well the letters put pressure on the government. For example, a man is locked up in Burma and constantly receives 20 letters a day addressed to him. Whatever they say, the government in Burma will realise that this person is popular and will be more inclined to release the person.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Namaste wrote: »
    Anglers and culling foxes is entirely different to torturing an animal for fun.

    Is it?

    Angling is hooking fish and removing them from their natural environment (i.e. torture), in most cases just for fun. I.e. its torturing animals for fun.

    I'm not talking about culling foxes, I'm talking about killing them for fun, which some people do. As well as birds, rabbits, rats, etc.

    Lots of people torture and kill animals for fun, its in our nature as other animals. If you locked everyone up who did it we'd have to let even more paedophiles and murderers out of our prisons than we already have done.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Namaste wrote: »
    Well the letters put pressure on the government. For example, a man is locked up in Burma and constantly receives 20 letters a day addressed to him. Whatever they say, the government in Burma will realise that this person is popular and will be more inclined to release the person.

    I'd never thought of it like that. Makes sense I suppose :thumb:
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Namaste wrote: »
    Actually, some of Amnesty's letter writing campaigns have lead to the release of political prisoners. You write directly to them and whether they receive the letters or not it places pressure on the government to release them.

    OK, fairynuff.

    However I'd like to know how Carlito knows that people on here aren't doing that?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Namaste wrote: »
    Well the letters put pressure on the government. For example, a man is locked up in Burma and constantly receives 20 letters a day addressed to him. Whatever they say, the government in Burma will realise that this person is popular and will be more inclined to release the person.


    Ah ok. Yeah, I guess so ... :)
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    carlito wrote: »
    Is it?

    Angling is hooking fish and removing them from their natural environment (i.e. torture), in most cases just for fun. I.e. its torturing animals for fun.

    I'm not talking about culling foxes, I'm talking about killing them for fun, which some people do. As well as birds, rabbits, rats, etc.

    Lots of people torture and kill animals for fun, its in our nature as other animals. If you locked everyone up who did it we'd have to let even more paedophiles and murderers out of our prisons than we already have done.

    I used to be a hunt sab.

    Is it now OK for me to have a problem with this woman killing a cat?

    Good.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Blagsta wrote: »
    OK, fairynuff.

    However I'd like to know how Carlito knows that people on here aren't doing that?

    He obviously assumes we're all akin to "crazy cat woman/man" out of central casting. Love animals, couldn't give a hoot about humans etc. Obviously unable to grasp that - as you said before - caring about the rights of animals and the rights of humans are not mutually exclusive.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    carlito wrote: »
    Is it?

    Angling is hooking fish and removing them from their natural environment (i.e. torture), in most cases just for fun. I.e. its torturing animals for fun.

    I'm not talking about culling foxes, I'm talking about killing them for fun, which some people do. As well as birds, rabbits, rats, etc.

    Lots of people torture and kill animals for fun, its in our nature as other animals. If you locked everyone up who did it we'd have to let even more paedophiles and murderers out of our prisons than we already have done.

    You said "farmers who go out and shoot foxes", not specifically fox hunting. Some people do go out killing foxes and animals (and imo) they should be locked up. If they enjoy culling them it is a different matter.

    It isn't normal if a lady kills a cat for fun, you can't compare it to fox hunting. Both are equally sick, but one is cultural and the other completely defies culture.

    And by the way, caring about animal welfare does not mean we don't care about other issues. I'm sure as a hard working and experienced human rights campaigner yourself, you would not be so patronising as to make such a judgement.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Blagsta wrote: »
    OK, fairynuff.

    However I'd like to know how Carlito knows that people on here aren't doing that?

    Well I hope he's working extra hard to make up for what we aren't doing. lol
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Teagan wrote: »
    You haven't read this thread? Very little has been mentioned about the woman - most have been responses to Toadborg's rather worrying view on this ...


    That this woman does not deserve a prison term?

    Why is that rather worrying? Only people who are a clear danger to society if allowed on the streets should be in prison, does this woman fit this category?

    I find it interesting that the people suggesting that this woman be severely punished are the same people who seem to be more willing to show understanding to those with mental difficulties and to criminals etc

    Very odd.........
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Toadborg wrote: »
    That this woman does not deserve a prison term?

    Why is that rather worrying? Only people who are a clear danger to society if allowed on the streets should be in prison, does this woman fit this category?

    I find it interesting that the people suggesting that this woman be severely punished are the same people who seem to be more willing to show understanding to those with mental difficulties and to criminals etc

    Very odd.........


    I would hope she will receive help for her mental health issues while in prison. I doubt it though, which is a shame. Mental health and crime is another thread though, but is a subject I have been quite vocal on in the past.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    carlito wrote: »
    Well I do, and you do comment on it, but this is completely out of perspective.
    We have a sense of perspective. Nobody here is saying killing an animal is as bad as killing a human. But most of us believe putting a cat through a washing machine cycle and killing it as a result amounts to unnaceptable animal cruelty and should attract a custodial sentence.


    No, I'm not, but there should be some sense of proportion. This thread was started less than three hours ago and already has four pages of hand wringing and calls to burn the woman at the stake. Looking down the list of topics on this forum I cannot see one thread about the many wars we are currently engaged in, murderous or torturous regimes our country supports, world poverty, etc.
    Nobody has said she should be burnt at the stake. The large number of posts in the thread is the result of one poster not seeing the act as something that wrong and suggesting killing a cat is no worse than killing a fly.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Toadborg wrote: »
    That this woman does not deserve a prison term?

    Why is that rather worrying? Only people who are a clear danger to society if allowed on the streets should be in prison, does this woman fit this category?

    I find it interesting that the people suggesting that this woman be severely punished are the same people who seem to be more willing to show understanding to those with mental difficulties and to criminals etc

    Very odd.........

    So you should not imprison burglars, car thieves, people that swindle old women out of their money etc just because no violence was used?

    And if you do not send a signal out that wanton animal cruelty is wrong, to the exent that you might even land up in prison, that gives everyone a free-for-all top do what they like to animals?

    A prison sentence would have been a signal of a deterrence.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Toadborg wrote: »
    That this woman does not deserve a prison term?

    Why is that rather worrying? Only people who are a clear danger to society if allowed on the streets should be in prison
    Oh really? Would you be saying that about a perfectly agreeable, pacifist, non-violent fraudster who releaves you or your business of tens of thousands of Pounds?
    I find it interesting that the people suggesting that this woman be severely punished are the same people who seem to be more willing to show understanding to those with mental difficulties and to criminals etc
    Very odd.........
    Bollocks.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Blagsta wrote: »
    OK, fairynuff.

    However I'd like to know how Carlito knows that people on here aren't doing that?

    Didn't say that they I did...just used it as an illustration of how out of perspective this thread is.

    Glad to have actually got something that could actually make a difference to human lives dicussed though...well spoken Namaste.

    Perhaps you guys are right though that I have no real business criticising you for discussing this case if thats what you want to do, if so I apologise for interrupting. I just found it indicative of the distortion of compassion (maybe compassion fatigue?) and interest in human affairs that such a topic can be discussed so passionately and exclusively on a day where, for instance:

    Ten liberal reformists are arrested under terrorism laws in an authoritarian, torturous, murderous regime which our government supports and deals with:
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/6331767.stm

    Hundreds of poor die and millions are left homeless in a country we encouraged to embrace free market capitalism:
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/6330523.stm

    Crisis emerges over resistance to a brutal dictatorship emerging out of the remains of one of our colonial ventures:
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/6329993.stm

    Our closest ally puts up a smokescreen over further breaches of human rights in Guantanamo bay:
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/6326767.stm

    But actually, fuck all of that, almost 6 months ago some woman in Wales killed a cat.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Christ, you're a self righteous prick.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Blagsta wrote: »
    Christ, you're a self righteous prick.

    No need for personal abuse now is there?

    As I said, apologies for going off topic.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    carlito wrote: »
    Didn't say that they I did...just used it as an illustration of how out of perspective this thread is.

    Glad to have actually got something that could actually make a difference to human lives dicussed though...well spoken Namaste.

    Perhaps you guys are right though that I have no real business criticising you for discussing this case if thats what you want to do, if so I apologise for interrupting. I just found it indicative of the distortion of compassion (maybe compassion fatigue?) and interest in human affairs that such a topic can be discussed so passionately and exclusively on a day where, for instance:

    Ten liberal reformists are arrested under terrorism laws in an authoritarian, torturous, murderous regime which our government supports and deals with:
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/6331767.stm

    Hundreds of poor die and millions are left homeless in a country we encouraged to embrace free market capitalism:
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/6330523.stm

    Crisis emerges over resistance to a brutal dictatorship emerging out of the remains of one of our colonial ventures:
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/6329993.stm

    Our closest ally puts up a smokescreen over further breaches of human rights in Guantanamo bay:
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/6326767.stm

    But actually, fuck all of that, almost 6 months ago some woman in Wales killed a cat.
    Oh for fuck's sake. Way to miss the point- again. :rolleyes:

    If all we did on a politics forums was discuss cases of animal cruelty you could say we're lacking a sense of perspective. BUT SINCE 99.9999% OF ALL THREADS HERE ARE ABOUT HUMAN ISSUES, NOT ANIMAL ISSUES, YOU ARE TALKING UTTER BOLLOCKS MATE.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Teagan wrote: »
    So you should not imprison burglars, car thieves, people that swindle old women out of their money etc just because no violence was used?

    And if you do not send a signal out that wanton animal cruelty is wrong, to the exent that you might even land up in prison, that gives everyone a free-for-all top do what they like to animals?

    A prison sentence would have been a signal of a deterrence.

    Why do you only relate 'danger' to physical violence? The crimes you outline are all harmful and not easily preventable. If there is a significant surge in animal violence due to this woman not being put in prison then you may have a point but there won't be.......
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    carlito wrote: »
    No need for personal abuse now is there?

    As I said, apologies for going off topic.


    Well if you're being a prick, I'm gonna tell you.

    If you want to start threads on those topics, go right ahead. Caring about one thing does not preclude caring about others.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    carlito wrote: »
    Didn't say that they I did...just used it as an illustration of how out of perspective this thread is.

    Glad to have actually got something that could actually make a difference to human lives dicussed though...well spoken Namaste.

    Perhaps you guys are right though that I have no real business criticising you for discussing this case if thats what you want to do, if so I apologise for interrupting. I just found it indicative of the distortion of compassion (maybe compassion fatigue?) and interest in human affairs that such a topic can be discussed so passionately and exclusively on a day where, for instance:
    Not everybody believes that animal rights are trivial, just because you do doesn't mean that everybody else does.

    If you want to see human rights topics discussed, discuss them... But the majority of threads that appear on these boards centre around the mainstream media. There has been a lot about gay rights, that is a human rights issue... As is rape, disability rights, climate change causes poverty and that is discussed a lot. Immigration, social services, gypsies... We do discuss things which affect people's lives all the time.

    We've discussed Guantanamo a lot actually (I'm sure Aladdin and one time had a sig to do with Guantanamo ages ago).

    The fact is, thesite pulls in people from all different backgrounds and students of all different academic disciplines. There are 194 countries in the world and it is difficult to know what is going on in each and every one of them. Not many of us have backgrounds in human rights and development, not everybody has the time to read through every article. I haven't seen you start any threads.

    At least two people on this thread are vegetarians and care about animal welfare, you can care about animal welfare and the wefare of people too you know.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Toadborg wrote: »
    Why do you only relate 'danger' to physical violence? ....

    What did you mean by your statement :-
    Toadborg wrote: »
    Only people who are a clear danger to society if allowed on the streets should be in prison ...

    I am kinda confused ... ? Sorry.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    carlito wrote: »
    Didn't say that they I did...just used it as an illustration of how out of perspective this thread is.

    Glad to have actually got something that could actually make a difference to human lives dicussed though...well spoken Namaste.

    Perhaps you guys are right though that I have no real business criticising you for discussing this case if thats what you want to do, if so I apologise for interrupting. I just found it indicative of the distortion of compassion (maybe compassion fatigue?) and interest in human affairs that such a topic can be discussed so passionately and exclusively on a day where, for instance:

    Ten liberal reformists are arrested under terrorism laws in an authoritarian, torturous, murderous regime which our government supports and deals with:
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/6331767.stm

    Hundreds of poor die and millions are left homeless in a country we encouraged to embrace free market capitalism:
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/6330523.stm

    Crisis emerges over resistance to a brutal dictatorship emerging out of the remains of one of our colonial ventures:
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/6329993.stm

    Our closest ally puts up a smokescreen over further breaches of human rights in Guantanamo bay:
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/6326767.stm

    But actually, fuck all of that, almost 6 months ago some woman in Wales killed a cat.

    So what are you doing 'wasting' your time on this thread when you could have kicked off a few regarding your nominations above, if you felt so strongly about it? Obviously, you couldn't be all that arsed ...

    And anyway, I am quite sure Aladdin did not expect this topic to blow up like it did ... but that's 'debate' for you.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Exactly - there's nothing stopping someone starting any thread they want - it hardly seems fair or appropriate to start criticising people for starting one thread rather than magically knowing what another poster would prefer to talk about.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Jim V wrote: »
    Exactly - there's nothing stopping someone starting any thread they want - it hardly seems fair or appropriate to start criticising people for starting one thread rather than magically knowing what another poster would prefer to talk about.

    :yes:

    Especially when you imply that that person has little concern for human rights issues.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Namaste wrote: »
    :yes:

    Especially when you imply that that person has little concern for human rights issues.

    Hey - I didn't say that, I just said that this was being discussed out of perspective, as four pages had been written on it without a single post on any other topic today.

    But point taken, apologies if I derailed the thread. :o
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