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Religious people know they are full of shit.

Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
Discuss.

I was having a "debate" with some godbotherer who came knocking on my door, and instead of my usual of getting them to worship satan, I decided to be more confrontational. (What, me? :p )

About halfway through I could see it in his eyes that he knew it was all bollocks and he was basically desperate for someone to convince him his rubbish was just that, so he could get some freedom.

Then I realised that every other religious type I have ever met didn't really believe what they were shovelling either.

So, do you think anyone really believes in religious teaching or am I right to claim that no one does?
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Comments

  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Ohhh controversial :D
  • Teh_GerbilTeh_Gerbil Stalin's Organist Posts: 13,327
    They probably know deep inside that it is a lie to keep them happy.

    But like other drugs forced down to sedate people, they crave that feeling. The certainty, the hapiness it brings. Just too weak to face the truth. We all have these things, it is like a comfort blanket to a child. We love the blanket and the feeling of security.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    You could see it in his eyes? Maybe you'd rather he wasn't sincere in his beliefs so you wouldn't have to face the uncomfortable reality that other people have a different view of the world from you?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    You could see it in his eyes? Maybe you'd rather he wasn't sincere in his beliefs so you wouldn't have to face the uncomfortable reality that other people have a different view of the world from you?

    Ah sorry, he kept things that he was uncertain of in the same place he thought of god. I've seen it in every other christian untter I have ever met, seen on the tube.

    Oh, it's not that I am uncomfortable in other people having different views than I do, just that I get uncomfortable when they only pretend they hold views and know that they are really spouting shit. People who believe in religion tend towards being very sad broken people.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    biggest pile of tripe you posted yet klint.

    you haven't of course taken into account the thousands who have been willing to die ...just for the right to believe in their god ...for the right to read the bible ...
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    People who believe in religion tend towards being very sad broken people.
    another croc of shit ...it is has been known for many years that those with a faith in god ...survive the worst things easier ...heal and recover better.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    you haven't of course taken into account the thousands who have been willing to die ...just for the right to believe in their god ...for the right to read the bible ...

    You don't need to die for it if it's true, no one holds any emotional regard for facts, facts are neutral. You do need to do amazing and wonderful things and mass murder if it's false, because how else do you prove that what is false it's true when you have no other recourse?

    Liars always protest too much, this is no exception.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    another croc of shit ...it is has been known for many years that those with a faith in god ...survive the worst things easier ...heal and recover better.

    Totally and utterly wrong. Prayer has been shown over and over again to delay recovery, as has a belief in :shocking: Sin :shocking: and a big beard in the sky.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    You don't need to die for it if it's true,
    .
    you've lost the plot.
    thousand have been offered freedom if they disown their god ...thousands have refused and been killed for it ...where are your lies in that?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    People who believe in religion tend towards being very sad broken people.
    i don't know about those who believe in religion but i do know about those who have believed in god ...stubborn strong and even heroic.
    a far cry from todays play station generation.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    Ah sorry, he kept things that he was uncertain of in the same place he thought of god. I've seen it in every other christian untter I have ever met, seen on the tube.

    Oh, it's not that I am uncomfortable in other people having different views than I do, just that I get uncomfortable when they only pretend they hold views and know that they are really spouting shit. People who believe in religion tend towards being very sad broken people.
    "It is not the healthy who require a doctor, but the sick"

    Someone fairly famous said that.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Religious people know they are full of shit.

    Now you're just stereotyping every religious person, aren't you? :rolleyes:

    I for one disagree - I have a friend who is very religious and he isn't full of shit. Yes it's hard to understand some of the stuff he talks about, but he hardly talks crap...
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    Totally and utterly wrong. Prayer has been shown over and over again to delay recovery
    Recovery from what?

    Prayer has been shown in clinical studies to benefit patients in hospital.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I think this is more the case with organised religion, rather than religion in general. I think most religious people believe in the things they say. But I think that a lot of religious people will say they believe something that they don't really, because that's what their religion teaches. Kind of like when a politician disagree's with his party, but spouts the party policy anyway, because it's his party.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I think this is more the case with organised religion, rather than religion in general. I think most religious people believe in the things they say. But I think that a lot of religious people will say they believe something that they don't really, because that's what their religion teaches. Kind of like when a politician disagree's with his party, but spouts the party policy anyway, because it's his party.

    You think that some of the stuff they 'believe' is forced upon them?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Religion as I understand it, works like this -

    when you are very small, people you love and trust a great deal and NEED to depend on to survive tell youall about htis wonderful god bloke, who watches you all the time, but can not be sensed.

    What this means as a youngster is that either - your family is all fucking mental, is cruelly lying to you OR you are broken in some way, because they can all sense things you can't. Then you are told that only the good people can sense the god, and your a good boy/girl aren't you?

    Goodbye rational processing of reality, hello irrational beliefs and schizophrenia.

    The thing is, that rational processing does not stop, it is everyone's ground state of being, what has to fill the void between what is true - i.e. what you can sense and what you need to be there in order to be a good lad is emotion.

    This emotional basis for religion explains all the killing and shit, because any time the idea is challenged that original dilemma is brought back to the surface, and the horrible truth that mummy and daddy fucked you over for a social fiction has to be dealt with.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I think this is more the case with organised religion, rather than religion in general. I think most religious people believe in the things they say. But I think that a lot of religious people will say they believe something that they don't really, because that's what their religion teaches. Kind of like when a politician disagree's with his party, but spouts the party policy anyway, because it's his party.
    No, that's just what differentiates a religion from a cult.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    No, that's just what differentiates a religion from a cult.

    Nothing?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    About halfway through I could see it in his eyes that he knew it was all bollocks and he was basically desperate for someone to convince him his rubbish was just that, so he could get some freedom.

    Alternatively what you could see in eyes was the desperate longing of someone who wants to get away from the chap who is busy lecturing them that not only does God not exist, but neither does the UK and the taxman.

    Yeah sure some people probably claim to believe in God, but don't, others so strongly believe in him they've suffered torture and death for him. And I suspect there's an even bigger majority who just aren't sure either way.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    Religion as I understand it, works like this -

    when you are very small, people you love and trust a great deal and NEED to depend on to survive tell youall about htis wonderful god bloke, who watches you all the time, but can not be sensed.

    What this means as a youngster is that either - your family is all fucking mental, is cruelly lying to you OR you are broken in some way, because they can all sense things you can't. Then you are told that only the good people can sense the god, and your a good boy/girl aren't you?

    Goodbye rational processing of reality, hello irrational beliefs and schizophrenia.

    The thing is, that rational processing does not stop, it is everyone's ground state of being, what has to fill the void between what is true - i.e. what you can sense and what you need to be there in order to be a good lad is emotion.

    This emotional basis for religion explains all the killing and shit, because any time the idea is challenged that original dilemma is brought back to the surface, and the horrible truth that mummy and daddy fucked you over for a social fiction has to be dealt with.

    I would just love to forward this to one of my mates, but he'd kill me. :lol: !
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Alternatively what you could see in eyes was the desperate longing of someone who wants to get away from the chap who is busy lecturing them that not only does God not exist, but neither does the UK and the taxman.

    Nah, I only asked him questions - like how do you know you believe in god? and how do you know when you are totally uncertain?

    I just fed him back his own crap, basically.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    Religion as I understand it, works like this -

    when you are very small, people you love and trust a great deal and NEED to depend on to survive tell youall about htis wonderful god bloke, who watches you all the time, but can not be sensed.

    What this means as a youngster is that either - your family is all fucking mental, is cruelly lying to you OR you are broken in some way, because they can all sense things you can't. Then you are told that only the good people can sense the god, and your a good boy/girl aren't you?

    Goodbye rational processing of reality, hello irrational beliefs and schizophrenia.

    The thing is, that rational processing does not stop, it is everyone's ground state of being, what has to fill the void between what is true - i.e. what you can sense and what you need to be there in order to be a good lad is emotion.

    This emotional basis for religion explains all the killing and shit, because any time the idea is challenged that original dilemma is brought back to the surface, and the horrible truth that mummy and daddy fucked you over for a social fiction has to be dealt with.
    A cynical view, and one that probably says more about you than anyone who has ever come to your front door carrying a bible.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Sofie wrote:
    You think that some of the stuff they 'believe' is forced upon them?
    Well I just think that some are made to feel guilty if they don't agree with every little bit of the church's teachings, so they convince themselves that they're all true, even the bits that deep down they don't agree with.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    A cynical view, and one that probably says more about you than anyone who has ever come to your front door carrying a bible.

    Meta comment - when a patient is uncomfortable with the area of conversation, they will try to break away from it by either exploring tiny irrelevent details, or by going much larger and viewing the conversation as a whole and commenting (usually negatively) on that aspect.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Teh_Gerbil wrote:
    They probably know deep inside that it is a lie to keep them happy.

    And you know it's a lie? :confused:

    I've had many conversations with Christains and I can honestly say they've never doubted their beliefs and some of them make good valid points.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    Nah, I only asked him questions - like how do you know you believe in god? and how do you know when you are totally uncertain?

    I just fed him back his own crap, basically.
    i bet he could'nt wait to get the fuck out of there!
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    when you are very small, people you love and trust a great deal and NEED to depend on to survive tell youall about htis wonderful god bloke, who watches you all the time, but can not be sensed.

    It's called faith.
    klintock wrote:
    What this means as a youngster is that either - your family is all fucking mental, is cruelly lying to you OR you are broken in some way, because they can all sense things you can't.

    Wrong.
    klintock wrote:
    This emotional basis for religion explains all the killing and shit, because any time the idea is challenged that original dilemma is brought back to the surface, and the horrible truth that mummy and daddy fucked you over for a social fiction has to be dealt with.

    Where are you getting this mummy and daddy shit from?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    Meta comment - when a patient is uncomfortable with the area of conversation, they will try to break away from it by either exploring tiny irrelevent details, or by going much larger and viewing the conversation as a whole and commenting (usually negatively) on that aspect.
    Say what?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    i'm not in the least bit religious,but i don't see the point of slagging it of for the sake of it.whatever gets them through the day is fine by me.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    What this means as a youngster is that either - your family is all fucking mental, is cruelly lying to you OR you are broken in some way, because they can all sense things you can't. Then you are told that only the good people can sense the god, and your a good boy/girl aren't you?

    And yet again you're stereotyping religious people. And get your facts right first - glad you think that everyone who is religious is mental... :rolleyes:
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