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i had 100000 in student loans!! so yes i think i know a little something about it, i shared a 1 room flat with 2 others, as we all worked in the same place and tried to arrange shifts so we wouldnt be there together, i have done the whole bag of rice thing cause thats all i could afford. its now 5 years later and i have payed off my student loans in full ( because i lived in a shared flat and ate pretty much nothing but rice ). my mother was a secretary, and my father an insurance salesman, so ya i didnt come from a rich background, i earned everything i have. and i still think people should pay for there own education.
of course im saying it had no value ( to the people i mentioned, to people whio have an actual interest in the subject then yes of course it has a value )
actually teachers still recieve a free teaching degree
and if you will read my posts, i do say on a number of occasions that people with actual interest in the degree subject arent wasting thier time. its the people who just take that degree because they didnt know what else to take, and it looked the easiest option are wasting their time
Nope, but the debt she chose to take on can be measured financially. If it wasn't going to benefit her financially, then she chose to take the debt on knowing it wasn't going to pay for itself - like lots of other things people want in life.
You've said you could be in your chosen field without the degree, and you're moaning about having to pay for it. Tell me how it is benefitting you?
I see lots of value in it, but I also see a society that would be financially poorer, and a much larger gap between the well-educated and poorly-educated.
But the real point is why should I have had to go into a well paying job just so I could pay of debts. I was lucky yo get educated before paying for your degree came into being. I'd have thought twice about Univeristy if it was going to saddle me with major debt by the time I was twenty-one
it doesnt have to be a " well paying job " just a decent paying job, the cost of paying for your education isnt exhorbirant ( depending on the degree, but the degrees that cost more also have a higher income associated with it, so that evens out ). You have to pay for everything you want in life. if its a degree that you really want, then pay for it, just like everything else in life
Problem with that is that the market pays well for scarcity and badly for value. Another way of looking at this is to stop the ridiculous practice of awarding degrees based on classroom knowledge and look for ways of rewarding people who can actually do stuff.
not everyone who graduates goes into the highest paying jobs they can get, with my chemistry degre i could possibly get a job in the city, i dont want to work there, at the moment im contemplating the RAF or going into research (phd) which both dont pay too greatly but i want to do that
you still havent made a position on this topic though, do you or do you not think students should pay for their education, or should the taxpayers?
Are you advocating that the service(of education) provider should be forced into slavery ? :nervous:
seeker
Provided by who exactly ?
seeker
What,if anything,should dictate what education "we" receive ?
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You paid off £100,000 student loans in 5 years and you think you had it hard? Fuck off.
So people being educated has no value? OK, glad we know where you stand.
So you do measure things in terms of financial benefits to the individual. Glad to know where you stand too.
Having a degree is a good thing on a CV.
How would free and equal access to education result in a poorer society and " a much larger gap between the well-educated and poorly-educated"? Run taht one by me again.
Again, it comes down to whether you think there are more important things than the financial rewards to individuals. I happen to think there are.
You haven't personally offended me, but I do find your views quite reprehensible.
You do know that money could be an optional game, right? It's not a fact like gravity, it's an idea waiting to be overhauled.
And a lot of the time irrelevant to the job. Not "professional" degrees of course, but you see a lot of jobs that ask for graduates just as a kind of general filter without really needing it as a requirement.
If you do something that few people can do, you get paid more. if you do something which anyone can do, you get paid less. The financial reward for a task is based on scarcity, not value. Working sewers? Priceless. Kicking footballs? Worthless. Who gets paid most and why?
Oh and do we really want the banks and the government deciding what everybody does? I know I don't.
I do pay for education through taxes.
In general the student will benefit form having their degree, they can expect to earn more and thus should certainly pay a part of the cost of university themselves.
However there is also a clear wider benefit to society from having a well educated population. People without degress benefit form the people around them that do and thus society, through taxes to the state should fund part of this education.
The most important question is one of balance.
Completely state-funded education and completely student funded education are both inapproporiate in my eyes.......
Let's extend this argument. Abolish all state provision in education. Nurseries, primary schools, secondary schools and colleges all charge full funds provided by anyone who wants to set up. What percentage of kids do you reckon would go to school? 100%?? In the Victorian times we had a similar system, church schools ran on Sundays and charged an affordable rate to parents and taught the basic 3Rs. The attendance rates were appallingly low and so were the education levels. That is the consequence of a charging system in education and on a level of principle that is why it should not have been introduced.
News for you - the UK has a different political culture. If there's one thing I hate its people saying it worked in so and so so lets do it here.
You can't just plonk and idea or system that works in one country into another and say "It worked over there so it'll work here". The issue is far more complex than that.
Also you are starting to draw lines under how much education someone can receive. You're saying people can have a high school and college education but that's your educational limit. No more state funded knowledge for you.
Education is a right, not a privilege.
We're not talking about the rest of the world are we?
But this blatantly flys in the face of the evidence of the last 10 years or so.
University has become more expensive yet more people have continued to attend. So where is your evidence?
You also deny the fact that people take loans to pay, no upfront payment under the top-up schemes.
I know plenty of people from continenetal European countries such as France and Germany where the higher education is pretty much free and they are amzed by how much better the universities are here compared to there. Why do you think that is?
This is quite obviously a ridiculous statement.
Is the govt of Mozambique guilty of human rights abuses because they cannot educate everyone?
Or is it because they are a poor countyr and they can't do everything?
If higher education is a right then surely everyone should be able to go regardless of ability? Do you agree with that?
Don't you think it's a lack of education that may well have contributed to the state of Mozambique?
Just because education is a privilege in some countries doesn't mean shit.
No of course poor countires aren't breaking "Human Rights" laws by NOT HAVING THE FACILITIES to educate people. That doesn't detract from every persons right in that country to an education.
I believe that everyone has a right to an education. Yes. It's very different to "anyone should be allowed into any level of education at any time", as well i suspect you know.
So before you don't think about what your posting, next time, please do.
No, its about access not ability.