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making maths optional at 14

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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    well it doing maths improves problem solving which you seem to be lacking then, or you jsut forgot the formulas or something
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    See I disagree that everyone would just choose subjects for an easy life. I think people will do the subjects that THEY enjoy and therefore find easy, which is different to doing something for an easy life.
    I dont know what the argument is, Theyve had options in place for years and years so people do get some choice over what subjects they take. Anything anyone needs in the future can always be retaken at a later date if necessary. Sometimes I just think that those teenage years are the WORST time to learn anything.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    actually basic skills are best learnt 11-18

    mosy psychological people tend to agree
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by rainbow brite
    See I disagree that everyone would just choose subjects for an easy life. I think people will do the subjects that THEY enjoy and therefore find easy, which is different to doing something for an easy life.
    I dont know what the argument is, Theyve had options in place for years and years so people do get some choice over what subjects they take. Anything anyone needs in the future can always be retaken at a later date if necessary. Sometimes I just think that those teenage years are the WORST time to learn anything.

    The older you are the harder it is to form new neural pathways and therefore learn. It's possible, but it's harder, hense specialisation is better if left later.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    doesnt matter if a job requires the qualifications it asks for or not

    at an interview you are very likely to be told to go away if you dont have a maths qualification of any kind, if it so forth asks for one
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by lukesh
    this is where Labour are crafty... they are more likely to pass an easy subject than pass which boosts the 5 A - C pass rate which makes Labour look good but it doesn't... the 5 A - C should be based on Maths, English and Science ONLY as you get 2 GCSE's for English and Science. It shouldn't include the others like Art which is easy to pass.

    It depends what sort of person you are. I had B in English and Maths, A in Science


    ...but I only got a C in art.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Fiend_85
    The older you are the harder it is to form new neural pathways and therefore learn. It's possible, but it's harder, hense specialisation is better if left later.
    There is that, but there are other things that help you learn as well as neural pathways. I may have had loads of newly forming neural pathways as a teenager, but i didnt do great at school. The huge amount of subjects taken was just too much, coupled with the emotional turbulence of the teenage years, I didnt find it conducive to learning effectively.
    I realise thats only anecdotal evidence, but I dont believe im the only one, by any stretch of the imagination. I believe learning programmes should be more tailored to individuals.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by rainbow brite
    There is that, but there are other things that help you learn as well as neural pathways. I may have had loads of newly forming neural pathways as a teenager, but i didnt do great at school. The huge amount of subjects taken was just too much, coupled with the emotional turbulence of the teenage years, I didnt find it conducive to learning effectively.
    I realise thats only anecdotal evidence, but I dont believe im the only one, by any stretch of the imagination. I believe learning programmes should be more tailored to individuals.


    Learning tailored to individuals is a lovely idea, but totally impossible to implement.

    You've also admitted yourself that you didn't do well at GCSE because you didn't try, perhaps not the best example in this particular arguement?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by rainbow brite
    There is that, but there are other things that help you learn as well as neural pathways. I may have had loads of newly forming neural pathways as a teenager, but i didnt do great at school. The huge amount of subjects taken was just too much, coupled with the emotional turbulence of the teenage years, I didnt find it conducive to learning effectively.
    I realise thats only anecdotal evidence, but I dont believe im the only one, by any stretch of the imagination. I believe learning programmes should be more tailored to individuals.


    doin well at the actual exams isnt the same as actually having some idea of whats going on in the subject, like i know how to read between lines of a novel and analyse it, i jsut cant do it, like i cant write essays either, no matter how much help ive had
    i still learnt something from my english gcse

    school up to 16 is there to provide every student with basic skills and knowledge to get them through life, unles they want to do something more specilised, which is what coleges and universities, and vocational training is there for
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Fiend_85
    Learning tailored to individuals is a lovely idea, but totally impossible to implement.

    You've also admitted yourself that you didn't do well at GCSE because you didn't try, perhaps not the best example in this particular arguement?
    1. Why is it impossible to implement. They already do it to a degree with the options at 13.

    2. I didnt do well at GCSE because i didnt try that hard - well I think thats exactly the point of this whole thing. I didnt try because I was doing subjects I didnt enjoy. If I was doing subjects I enjoyed, then I would have passed. (by the way I got my 5 Cs and above so I wasnt a complete drop out LOL)
    The subjects I passed were the ones I really enjoyed, Art, Drama, textiles, English, English lit.
    I also think that having people doing lessons when they dont want to be there, is counter productive to the rest of the class too. Its a lose lose situation.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by rainbow brite
    1. Why is it impossible to implement. They already do it to a degree with the options at 13.

    2. I didnt do well at GCSE because i didnt try that hard - well I think thats exactly the point of this whole thing. I didnt try because I was doing subjects I didnt enjoy. If I was doing subjects I enjoyed, then I would have passed. (by the way I got my 5 Cs and above so I wasnt a complete drop out LOL)
    The subjects I passed were the ones I really enjoyed, Art, Drama, textiles, English, English lit.
    I also think that having people doing lessons when they dont want to be there, is counter productive to the rest of the class too. Its a lose lose situation.

    1. no they don't, I learned the same way the rest of my class did, that's hardly tailored to my learning needs, considering dyslexia and dyspraxia involved.

    2. Not trying was your choice, and a careless one at that, I didn't soley do subjects I loved, but I tried at all of them.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Fiend_85
    1. no they don't, I learned the same way the rest of my class did, that's hardly tailored to my learning needs, considering dyslexia and dyspraxia involved.

    2. Not trying was your choice, and a careless one at that, I didn't soley do subjects I loved, but I tried at all of them.

    did your school not do options at 13 then? Have they done away with that in the last 13 years since I left school?
    Im not saying its completely tailored, but there is some allowance made for individual learning needs.

    3. Not trying was my choice - Im not asking to be judged as you seem to be doing. Im glad you tried, thats fantastic for you that you are so well disciplined.Im not sure what the relevance is, because im not trying to say im better than you or anybody. Im trying to show you that there are a lot of people that its a waste of time for - therefore it should be optional. There will always be people who put their all into everything they do, even if they hate it. Unfortunately im not one of them, and if I hate something, I find it incredibly hard to motivate myself.
    The debate isnt about me though, I am using myself as one example, Ive also used my sister in law as an example. It wouldnt have made any difference if she`d tried or not. She`d have been better off going to hairdressing college at 14. She didnt need maths or science for that.
    There is some allowance made for individual tailored learning, but not enough.
    Yes its a good idea to have a knowledge of maths and its a fabulous idea to get a second language, but its not essential in everyday life and I cant see why it should be compulsory - after all its a fabulous idea to get a degree too, but it shouldnt be compulsory and it isnt.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    there were no real options at 13, i picked german or spanish alongside french.

    Even when you get to make your own choices you still have the same learning style, in that sense there is no tailored learning

    I'm sorry if I seem to be judging you, I don't mean to.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Fiend_85
    there were no real options at 13, i picked german or spanish alongside french.

    Even when you get to make your own choices you still have the same learning style, in that sense there is no tailored learning

    I'm sorry if I seem to be judging you, I don't mean to.
    ah, when i was at school, we had options at 13, to choose what we were going to study for GCSE. They had the compulsory ones of maths english and sciences, and then the other subjects were divided up into blocks of about 3 which you could choose one in each category. (if i remember correctly)
    I think it was an OK system, but I think it should go further than that and they should let the kids who just arent interested, have the option of going into work training or apprenticeships.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by rainbow brite
    ah, when i was at school, we had options at 13, to choose what we were going to study for GCSE. They had the compulsory ones of maths english and sciences, and then the other subjects were divided up into blocks of about 3 which you could choose one in each category. (if i remember correctly)
    I think it was an OK system, but I think it should go further than that and they should let the kids who just arent interested, have the option of going into work training or apprenticeships.

    See there's me getting number confused

    At 11/12 i picked my other foriegn language

    then there were GCSE options. The way my school did it was, one humanity, one language, one art, one technology, one other, as well as double science, eng lang, eng lit and maths.
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