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Sooooooooooooooooo
Former Member
Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
Currently in Israel, and as the situation here is pretty cooled down comparing to last time I visited, I decided to open a can of worms, just to see some action in some kind of way.
Will Sharon prove that Likud is the way to gain peace? Things are nowhere near perfect, there's still hell of a lot of way to go, but as mentioned the situation is a lot calmer and seems to be nearer the right direction than before.
So now I am wondering what the oracles of the site think?
Shalom (hopefully) and Take care.
I'll be back in "dull" Denmark in two days. See ya!
Will Sharon prove that Likud is the way to gain peace? Things are nowhere near perfect, there's still hell of a lot of way to go, but as mentioned the situation is a lot calmer and seems to be nearer the right direction than before.
So now I am wondering what the oracles of the site think?
Shalom (hopefully) and Take care.
I'll be back in "dull" Denmark in two days. See ya!
0
Comments
Be careful. Come on safe.
you lucky lucky girl! hope you have a great time and a safe one.
as for the road map ...hasn't realy begun yet.
Things are indeed quiet Jacqueline, and let's hope they stay that way. But for that to happen there has to be real progress, and it'd seem that once again Sharon is lagging behind in his promises.
As things stand the Palestinians got as rotten a deal as you could get, and unless some real concessions are made soon Hamas and others will lose patience. Sharon must, once and for all, release those Palestinian prisoners as part of the roadmap accord and tackle the infernal settlements and the Apartheid Wall.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/leaders/story/0,3604,1003208,00.html
I think the two need to sort it out amongst themselves with less outside interference, I don't think Bush's (even though his intentions may be good) or the UK influence helps much as Palestinians would view him with suspicion as they think of him as (justly or unjustly) pro Israel.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/3089569.stm
:rolleyes:
I think we both agree that all liklihood is that the violence will once again erupt within a few months at the rate things are going.
What Saddam did as well was to give millions in aid to the Palestinians (since they lack the billions of Dollars per year aid the other side gets). And since the fall of Saddam a lot of people have been in an even greater precarious situation.
And I hope you do not object to Palestinians getting an education. It's not if they have much of a chance in their own "country".
But let's stop talking about Saddam here, since as I said it is completely unrelated to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.
I too believe violence will soon resume Clan. Call me a cynic but Sharon tactics seem all too apparent to me. Obtain maximum amount of concessions from the Palestinians (as if they had much to offer anyway :rolleyes: ) while giving fuck all in return and wait for a return to violence so he can justify not dismantling the illegal settlements or the Apartheid Wall of Evil.
If you researched how much money Washington has given to actually fund acts of violence itself, youd not be considering payments from Saddam to be all that big an issue (and certainly not an issue that plays any influential role in the cycle of violence).
The cycle of violence is supported sufficiently by the refusal of both the Israeli government or its Washington financiers to abide by nearly 30 years of UN resolutions and end the occupation and wanton killing of Palestinian men women and children.
When and if that ever comes to pass, then and only then do I believe youll see real progress toward peace.
I think the peace process will progress because Hamas and Hezbollah (Syria) know the US will come into their country and kick their ass if they don't. Don't you think that was the good outcome of the Iraqi war? I do. It made Saudi Arabia get serious about fighting Al Qaeda.
pnj, if the US perpetrated overt violence against Palestinian organisations which fight against the unceasing assault of Israeli oppression, occupation and outright slaughter then Washington would be universally revealed as completely in bed with Israel and in no way a credible broker for peace.
It would essentially be political suicide for the Bush admin (or any admin) to undertake such an action and they know it. Furthermore it would provide perhaps the biggest feather in the cap of radical extremists and undermine completely the supposed WoT leading to an even greater backlash in the future.
Stop applauding Washington and Tel Aviv, and start looking past all the bogus "terrorist" labels that US media is so fond of applying to this and other global conflicts or youll never comprehend the real evil in play in these situations.
at least there is some progress.
Im inclined to agree with you as well MR, just more smoke and mirrors.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/3095765.stm
The mentality behind the kind of replies you're coming with are the ones slowing down the peace process.
Add to that the clearly one sided brokering by Washington which singlehandedly fuels the Israeli machinery of random and sustained massacre, and you have a recipe for the eventual resumption of violence when the Palestinians see that all their concessions are merely met with maintenance of the status quo on the other side.
The mentality which panders to that rather than decrying its hypocrisy is the mentality which has undermined the process at every turn. It is the mentality of the Likhud and Washington negotiators and the only one which is responsible for continuing the debacle.
Both sides have had their share of grief, and continually face hardships caused by "the others"- Constantly pointing to it, instead of working on something mutual, will of course make the gap wider.
The fact is that as things stand the Palestinians have an immensely rotten deal. Sharon's strategy is to continue to ignore his obligations with regard to the illegal settlements, the Apartheid Wall, the right of return for refugees, the liberation of prisoners, the full withdrawal of troops and the return of ALL occupied land as per 1967 borders and endless UN resolutions.
Even if a full and permanent peace accord was signed tomorrow and the Palestinians given what's left of their land as it stands today, they would have a territory surrounded by concentration camp-style walls and with Israeli settlements, roads and army posts having fragmented their land and reduced it by a very considerable amount.
So when the ceasefire is finally broken in a few weeks/months by malcontent Palestinians dismayed at the lack of progress on these vital issues, Sharon will try to claim the high ground and say "we stop the siege on their towns, we remove the roadblocks, we even give them police cars, and this is how they repay us".
Etc etc ad infinitum.
Then of course, the international press was all too happy to play party to the farce and broadcast Israeli claims that it was the Palestinians fault. We're just back at the same game all over again.
Perfect display of how peace plans get broken.
Simply no want of getting forward, but rather going back to where we were.
But I'm telling you: unless the Israeli government gives some real concessions soon (and we're not talking about their obligations, which should not be used as negotiating chips) the ceasefire will be over soon. And when that happens, think very carefully about who should be blamed for it.