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So we agree then.
I agree they are paid long term, but my point is that they were never meant to be
You are spot on, the whole situation has been caused by the lack of cheap social housing because it was all sold off by the consevatives. I can't see anyway back from that now.
The other consequence of this is that social housing is now rationed to those most in need, which results in a segregation.
Surely he was never a Tory? I researched him, his beliefs and his lryics as part of a study into the politics of the 70's and 80's
I think many people would agree with that, but the problem is that it leads to the idea that people on benefits need to prove that they are genuine, often by fitting into a certain criteria. I can see why people think that would prevent people cheating the system, but the more rigid the criteria is the easier it is to learn and make sure you fit into. It's often those who are genuine that suffer because they can't tick all the right boxes, and they don't lie about it, at least not at first.
As pathetic as this sounds, and it is absolutely no excuse, when you are expected to fit in with such a stupid system you lose all respect for it, so you forget the moral aspect.
Gardening, decorating for the elderly or disabled that kind of thing im sure there are a whole range of jobs that could be found it could even be tailored to the persons relevant skills in some cases.
Ths would at least save money within the system as the local councils would save money.
I think that in the states you have to take part in this kind of scheme to get benefits. Plus you would not get out of the work habit or lose any work ethic that you may have had before.
I know that everyone knows this, but when people say they'd be better off on benefits they mean financially rather than in any other sense. I think a lot of people, even if they come from families who don't work, would rather feel proud of something than live off other people's money, even if they don't know it until they try it. Most children can see hear their parents talking about what they did at work, even if it's just that someone said something interesting. If your parents haven't worked, you might not see the positive aspects to it, so you'll need to experience it for yourself.
But at least there'd be skilled people doing LouiseK's plan
(Which actually isn't wholly bad)
I'd be better off on benefits, apart from financially.
Yes. Because even though I have a job, albeit part-time, but a job nonetheless, I would still be forced into doing something like this. Since when did being unemployed but being fit for work turn into slave labour? That is EXACTLY what Labour is currently doing with New Deal. You have to work in a charity for X amount of weeks, then if need be, the rest of your 3 month term in a commercial environment... working for your job seekers.
This comes back to breaking the system and getting away with it. I know a few members of my family don't do these New Deal courses for 3 months, but their money doesn't get stopped, I never turned up for one day (Due to illness for the record) during my first set and I got disciplined with losing £100 (2 weeks worth of JSA). Which put me in a WORSE situation because I had to borrow money to go onto these fucking job placements!
I'm currently working as I said, I have a contract of 14 hours, but at the moment my hours are fluctuating between 6/8/14 a week, I get maybe the full amount once a month if I'm needed.
Now because I'm part-time, I'm still classed as unemployed by the Job Centre, so they class me as having ALL the time in the world to look for jobs. I don't want to find another job, I just need the SUPPORT for when my hours dip below X of my contractual hours, otherwise I can't pay my debts! So they top up my money.
I stuck to the system, did what they wanted, NOW I GET NOTHING. I still sign on and have since January (Got the job through the job centre themselves and got offered the job in December) but I don't get any money from them! I've been living off nearly £20-£25 a WEEK since January.
And in 2 weeks time I am being sent on these courses, guess what they want me to do? Work full-time for my Job seekers (Which I'm NOT getting right now!) and then work my REAL job on the weekends so it doesn't interrupt with the full-time work. How they expect me to WITHOUT MONEY is beyond me.
And guess what will happen if I don't go? I won't get Job seekers... Oh the system is totally helping me.
I think unemployed people should volunteer, but not for more than the number of hours they would be working to earn what they get in benefits.
The New Deal course I went on seemed almost intended as a form of punishment, rather than support, comments like "the next stage is really boring, you should really try to get a job this week" were idiotic so I can see why people just give up.
I think the system needs to take into account that if someone has no skills or experience they are not going to get a job however many they apply for, so something else needs to be arranged for them.
This is why they go back to college instead and get a qualification. Or they get employed by someone to train them. This is what my mum did both times when she was starting out. (first time 19 years old, as a nursery nurse & second time as a care assistant)
You should be signing on because you're genuinely looking for work, not because you have a couple of hours in a job and don't intend to look for anything else whilst other people work full time to support you.
I for one believe in reducing work hours and putting up wages, but that isn't the way things are. The government want people off Jobseekers and in to work.
I know people who work more than one job to support themselves... Are you looking for another part time job?
Right now I would be better off quitting the job and going back on Job seekers full-time. What a amazing system!
Anyone who is claiming job seekers is saying they have no job, therefore they must be unemployed, including those part-time because they *must* be looking for full-time regardless of their circumstances.
The law, in its majestic equality, forbids rich and poor alike to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal their bread." Anatole France
I don't mean to sound harsh... But I work with people who are studying degrees and postgrad courses on top of their 36+ hour weeks. They manage their time for their course, they have social lives on top of it and they come out with really good grades. I don't see how you should be any different.
You can still do 20+ hours of study a week, by studying in evenings and days off.
I know university hours are similar to that, but they still have set-time slots to do studying, along with time for work. Either one usually being routine and regular.
My friend has a part-time job usually working overtime, is in her last year of a very intense course and has a dissertation to do. Upmost respect to her for what she does but me, personally, no way could I do that. I have barely enough energy to see me through the last 2 weeks of my degree.
Before I go off on a rant and whinge about myself and with all respect to Java- we dont know his situation. It's great that your friend manages that but it doesn't make it immediately applicable to everyone else.
I know I couldn't do 40 hour working, then studying. My brain would be fried by the time I got home. I wouldn't learn anything. I've tried that before, it got to the point of having to study during my lunch-times when I was still alert and full of energy.
Right now I set aside every minute of every day, from the moment I wake up, to go asleep. I can relax a bit on the studying and work more hours, but by 31st December, if I don't have the pass I need, I will have to go through this ordeal every 3 years to keep my qualification. If I complete it this year I get it for a life-time.
Again, I know people who I work with who are doing degree and postgrads. Sometimes you have to...
If you wanted it that bad, you would (for the record I have been looking at postgrad courses to do around my job.... If I felt I had security in it, I'd be doing one right now).
Are your work colleagues doing home/distance learning?
One is doing a postgraduate through Birkbeck, so she has evening classes (Birkbeck is a university which specialises in evening courses). The other is doing Open University.
Surely, you could get another part time job.
168 hours a week... 36 for work? 56 for sleep? It still leaves you at least 70 hours to study.
ETA: I don't mean that in a patronising way, but time management is possible if you think positive about it.