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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    In my view, no one should be obligated to do so.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by monocrat
    In my view, no one should be obligated to do so.

    well noones obligated to do anything we have free will. its just a guideline for a fair society.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    What has free will got to do with anything?

    There's no reason why a person should 'treat others as they want to be treated'.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by monocrat
    What has free will got to do with anything?

    There's no reason why a person should 'treat others as they want to be treated'.

    well what do you suggest is a better alternative as a basis for morality?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I think morality is subjective in nature.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by monocrat
    I think morality is subjective in nature.

    well thats possibly true in terms of the moral conclusions that people draw but couldnt it be argued that there are certain fundamental principals of morality that are everpresent no matter what stance you take. whether or not you come to the same conclusions as others by following these principals, the fundamental principals are there none the less.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by octopus of doom
    well thats possibly true in terms of the moral conclusions that people draw but couldnt it be argued that there are certain fundamental principals of morality that are everpresent no matter what stance you take.

    Such as? OK, most might think killing is wrong, but is homicide really wrong in every instance?
    whether or not you come to the same conclusions as others by following these principals, the fundamental principals are there none the less.

    I disagree. These 'principles' denote an absolute morality.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by monocrat
    Such as? OK, most might think killing is wrong, but is homicide really wrong in every instance?


    I disagree. These 'principles' denote an absolute morality.

    well the principal that it is wrong to take an innocent life is one that i think everyone can agree on. the extent you take it too depends on your point of view for example abortion etc. however that principal is universally agreed on. it is only the implimentation that differs.

    perhaps there is no absolute morality in terms of something that would exist independent of human society. but i think that we have evolved a morality that is inate in us and we know that it is not good for society for example to go about killing innocents.

    without this inate sense of right and wrong wherever it came from whether it is existent independent or whether it is a human construction, society would be unable to function, and we wouldnt have for example a legal system.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by octopus of doom
    well the principal that it is wrong to take an innocent life is one that i think everyone can agree on.

    Is it? Tell that to suicide bombers in Palestine.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Tell that to the IDF first and perhaps there wouldnt be suicide bombers.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by octopus of doom


    perhaps there is no absolute morality in terms of something that would exist independent of human society. but i think that we have evolved a morality that is inate in us and we know that it is not good for society for example to go about killing innocents.


    There is no 'absolute morality' because no evidence of it exists in nature.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Clandestine
    Tell that to the IDF first and perhaps there wouldnt be suicide bombers.

    Suicide bombers must logically think it moral to do what they do.

    That disproves an 'inate absolute morality'. In my opinion, morality is learnt and everybody has a different moral code.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by monocrat
    Suicide bombers must logically think it moral to do what they do.

    That disproves an 'inate absolute morality'. In my opinion, morality is learnt and everybody has a different moral code.

    well im not disagreeing with that i did say within human society, im not talking about the natural world, morality is a human construction as a means to protect society. we are advanced pack animals and morality is what makes us do whats best for the pack, as it were.

    of course morality differs and as i said, the difference in moral behavior is through implimentation rather than the morals that we have evolved as humans. suicide bombers for example dont consider the people they kill to be innocents. this is the difference in interpretation that i am talking about. however the principal remains.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by octopus of doom


    of course morality differs and as i said, the difference in moral behavior is through implimentation rather than the morals that we have evolved as humans. suicide bombers for example dont consider the people they kill to be innocents. this is the difference in interpretation that i am talking about. however the principal remains.

    But you said ALL people know that killing innocents is 'wrong'. I gave an example which destroys that theory.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by monocrat
    But you said ALL people know that killing innocents is 'wrong'. I gave an example which destroys that theory.

    as i said, the difference is in the interpretation. suicide bombers for example dont believe that they are killing innocents, so they consider what they are doing morally right. however they would consider their own people innocents so think its wrong to kill them.
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