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Age Verification - Upcoming Change

2

Comments

  • independent_independent_ Community Champion Posts: 9,340 Supreme Poster
    edited March 13
    I think I made a similar point on another thread a couple of days ago @Faolan, though I admit I can't remember which. In addition, if the replies need research from whoever, surely that's info they should already have. Or is it like the over 25s policy... a policy that's being introduced while unfinished and not fully researched?

    Edit: It was this very thread! Duh. I said similar to this on saturday.
    “Sometimes the people around you won’t understand your journey. They don’t need to, it’s not for them.”
  • FaolanFaolan Posts: 191 Trailblazer
    @independent_

    It’s shocking matey this new management.. and the longer they’re leaving us stewing, the more tense were getting & overall it’s making the community teams job harder

    The communication has been terrible, there’s absolutely 0 valid reason why we should have to wait 2 weeks + for answers on our questions regarding massive community changes which directly impact us.

    Did they think we wouldn't have questions or something ? Lol.

    I agree, it’s info they should already have to hand. Clearly they don’t😂
  • independent_independent_ Community Champion Posts: 9,340 Supreme Poster
    @Faolan you're totally right. The longer this goes on, the longer we're waiting for the big questions to be answered, the longer there is for bad feeling to develop and arguably smaller issues elsewhere become much bigger too.

    Maybe I'm looking at it through rose tinted glasses and I know I keep referring to the mix of old, so excuse that, but I was having a look at an old thread recently where lots of questions were being asked and discussion had. The thread was quite heated in the end, but people certainly didn't have to wait this long for answers. I wouldn't even say this is a heated discussion between us members, but it is growing and eventually it's gonna become pages and pages of thoughts which need answers. So like you say making the job of the community team at least 10 times harder than it needs to be.
    “Sometimes the people around you won’t understand your journey. They don’t need to, it’s not for them.”
  • independent_independent_ Community Champion Posts: 9,340 Supreme Poster
    edited March 13
    @Faolan I’ll give the logo thread a read too, as a screen reader user I’d completely overlooked it :joy:

    FWIW, this is the thread I am on about: https://community.themix.org.uk/discussion/3597167/the-importance-of-being-genuine/p3

    It was the big issue at the time and the elephant in the room, and at the time many didn’t feel it was being dealt with perfectly, but nothing is perfect. But it’s an example of how communication used to be. If anyone feels they don’t want this linked for whatever reason (perhaps one of your own posts)) please let me know. But it does feel important.

    Edit: looking again, the first 2 responses on page 1 illustrate my point perfectly.
    “Sometimes the people around you won’t understand your journey. They don’t need to, it’s not for them.”
  • Amy22Amy22 Posts: 5,093 Part of The Furniture
    Faolan wrote: »
    @independent_
    You’re right.. because even the logo change had a few of us feeling miffed. It’s a tiny change but on top of these big changes that haven’t been properly discussed, it does feel big. For a lot of us, we made the mix our home, and it feels like SHOUT is trampling all over that for their own gain… with little to no thought about those of us who love / loved this place.

    I remember changes happening before and V being ready and open for conversation. It felt safe and transparent. Why can’t we have that anymore?

    I really really hope future investors are seeing this, like hearing it straight from the service users voices

    With how things are going, I really cannot see the mix lasting another year. The decline since the merger has been rapid.

    I’m kinda gutted Chris handed The Mix over to people who have let it get this poor. It’s sad like, it used to help so many people out of dark places 💔

    I definitely feel like Shout have been more dominating and taking control of the mix changing it for their own personal gain in a way. So your definitely right with that because I have noticed that a lot recently and its worrying. The worst part is how atrocious the actual communication is because we haven't been given straight proper answers or an apology at all which is shocking
    Just a person who likes pop culture and films
  • toffuna101toffuna101 Posts: 2,039 Boards Champion
    WHAT.
    i have just come back to this website today and im reading all of this and im absolutely shocked. why do i have to insert my id or take a picture of myself? this is not good... i look like a 12 year old...
  • shannon_164shannon_164 Community Champion Posts: 1,396 Wise Owl
    it’s really helpful actually seeing answers to some of the several questions that have been asked, thank you!!

    i still do however think that this is very much so going to create new barriers for many people in terms of accessing services, and understandably so. i know if i was met with this requirement, i wouldn’t sign up and im sure many people would be the same.
    What if someone tries to fake their age or catfish?
    Yoti has built-in tech to spot fake or stolen photos. If someone tries to upload an edited image or someone else’s pic, the system won’t accept it. And if they use ID, only real, official documents will work. This makes it really hard for someone to lie about their age or pretend to be someone they’re not.

    just a question around this aspect, let’s say susie is 28 but she has a sister who is only 15, what is there to stop susie from getting her sister to take the selfie or uploading her sisters id as it wouldn’t then be a fake id nor would it be an image of someone of google etc.

    i’m just genuinely curious about that part as it doesn’t at all make it impossible for someone to pretend to be someone they are not really?

    also, this part too
    How does Age Verification work?
    If you’re already a Discussion Boards user, this won’t affect you! But if you’re new and signing up, you’ll need to verify your age

    just out of curiosity, why are current members excluded from this? what’s to say that there aren’t members on here that are currently faking their age to be able to access the service, as that is very much a possibility.

    i personally think it seems a bit silly how it will only apply to new members and not current members - surely it should apply to everybody or nobody…?

    thanks <3
  • toffuna101toffuna101 Posts: 2,039 Boards Champion
    ok thanks for clearing things up.
  • independent_independent_ Community Champion Posts: 9,340 Supreme Poster
    Social media sites are not using this. Not one single one I use has implemented this (and I use or have used lots).

    Thank you for the answers, I appreciate that and it clears some stuff up, but my opinion still stands unfortunately.
    “Sometimes the people around you won’t understand your journey. They don’t need to, it’s not for them.”
  • KatieKatie Community Manager Posts: 426 Listening Ear
    Hey everyone,

    Just hopping in to clear some things up about other services using Yoti :)

    So in terms of other platforms using this one example is Meta who have started introducing Teen Accounts on Instagram for users under the age of 18. They also use Yoti to check their users' ages and they initially applied it to new users before gradually implementing it for existing teen accounts. You can find out more about this on Instagram's website here and on Yoti's website here

    Supermarkets (such as Asda and Morrisons) have also been conducting trials to verify customer's ages at self-checkouts (click here for more info), and for those who have a Yoti Digital ID, you can use it at various convenience shops, post office branches and payzone stores as a form of ID. For more information on this and to check your local area click here

    In terms of services similar to ourselves, Childline use Yoti for their Report Remove service which helps those under 18 in the UK to confidentially report sexual images and videos of themselves and remove them from the internet. Individuals can confirm their identity using Yoti so that Childline have more legal powers to remove images in as many places as possible.

    In short, other places are using Yoti and whilst we might be one of the first youth-focused services bringing this in, others will need to bring in similar checks to follow the laws (Online Safety Act 2023 and GDPR).

    Please do keep asking questions and letting us know your thoughts. We're listening and we will get back to you :)
  • shannon_164shannon_164 Community Champion Posts: 1,396 Wise Owl
    thank you @Katie - that’s really helpful 🙂

    the part that really doesn’t make sense though i guess is why this will only apply to new members? surely it should be all of us, current or new, or none of us?

    what is there to say there aren’t people on here currently that are faking their age? they will continue to get away with it as this won’t apply to them since they aren’t a new member therefore it defeats the purpose in a way?

    if legislation applies to everyone, which is does, i don’t understand how current members aren’t going to have to undergo the same process as what someone only joining will have to.

    thank you <3
  • KatieKatie Community Manager Posts: 426 Listening Ear
    Hey @shannon_164 :)

    So it's a pretty complex process and we're going to be rolling it out in stages. The first stage will be for new applicants, and during this stage we'll also be testing the set-up.

    The plan is to roll it out to all users, because you folks are right, it should be all Discussion Board users. However, as we'll be actively testing to make sure it's all working as expected we're going to be doing it in stages. When we have more information around the dates we plan to do this we'll be sure to let you all know!
  • toffuna101toffuna101 Posts: 2,039 Boards Champion
    what about for the people who look younger than they actually are? i know they can just have id but i honestly dont want to submit my id.
  • independent_independent_ Community Champion Posts: 9,340 Supreme Poster
    Ok I concede, i did not know about instagram. I suppose being over 18 I had never come across it.. and can my local asda bring in the ID thing lol. I didn’t know about childline either, again perhaps a consequence of my own age.

    It does feel like a barrier to mental health support, again the government not thinking things through
    “Sometimes the people around you won’t understand your journey. They don’t need to, it’s not for them.”
  • KatieKatie Community Manager Posts: 426 Listening Ear
    @toffuna101 Yoti's AI is really accurate so this shouldn't be a problem, but in those cases we would recommend proving your age with ID. If this doesn't feel comfy for you, we're more than happy to discuss this with you privately :) If anyone is concerned about this, you can send us a dm over at @TheMix or pop us an email community@themix.org.uk

    We'll also be able to test this during stage one when we first roll it out to test if new users' experience any issues if they look younger than they actually are :)
  • toffuna101toffuna101 Posts: 2,039 Boards Champion
    ok thanks.
  • independent_independent_ Community Champion Posts: 9,340 Supreme Poster
    Also applies if someone looks older than they are. I’ve all but stopped getting ID’d anywhere, apart from the odd over cautious bar person or checkout person. If someone is 24 it might think they’re 26, but then again i suppose a 24 year old is more likely to have appropriate ID than a 13 year old.

    Do you know what types of ID they accept @Katie? Is it just passport, driving license etc or do they accept PASS cards?
    “Sometimes the people around you won’t understand your journey. They don’t need to, it’s not for them.”
  • toffuna101toffuna101 Posts: 2,039 Boards Champion
    yeah i agree. it applies when its the other way round as well. im only 16 and the only proper id i have is a passport.
  • KatieKatie Community Manager Posts: 426 Listening Ear
    @independent_ So based on a Yoti Digital ID they accept any of the following: driving licence, passport, Citizencard, Post Office PASS card or a Young Scot Card. So I believe it will be the same for us :)
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