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Of course you can, I never suggested otherwise. I expressed disagreement with you was all.
What if a shop was robbed by black people, every day for a year?
It'd be nice to go on being liberal indefinitely, but there has to be a point at which the buck stops. Whereas you become indignant at the fact you may be tarred with the same brush as other people, I think it's often a necessity. If a shop was being robbed repeatedly by middle class, white men in their twenties, I wouldn't feel outraged at a maximum of two mid-twenty year olds being allowed in at one time. In my eyes the shop keeper is protecting him and his own. I’d introduce myself to him and let him know a little what I was about, separating myself from his preconceptions.
I'm not advocating intolerance and prejudice.
I'm not all that far out of my teens, the illusion that what todays youth are experiencing is in someway unique, is just that, an illusion.
Do you have any thoughts on the questions i posed in my previous post?
Without wanting to seem rude, this has been covered a million times before on these board and i suspect it'll be same tripe regurgitated again. It's basic 6th form philosophy, at best.
It does seem lik that to me.
Despite being white, I'm the same.
Steady on there, civilised discussion and all.
OK for the sake of argument, let's gown down the path again.
To me a black person is a person who would descibe themselves as black.
A middle class person is a member of the socioeconomic class which resides between the upper and lower class. The are likely to be a professional with a middle of the road, and resonably expendible, income.
Sorry, i am trying to keep up :razz:
I agree, there is a decision that needs to be made by the business. They needs to weigh up the pros, cons, moral and ethical factors of any given situation and make an informed decision on that. I think where we disagree is that you don't believe that it's possible for the outcome of this deliberation to limit the amount of children in your shop, whereas i do.
You're way off in your understanding of the rationale behind the examples you've cited.
A person who is black. The same as i define someone who was white.
To keep the analogy exact, however, shouldn't we also be examining how i define school kids as well?
You mean Rosa Parks?
Yep. Does it only apply when they're in their uniform? And if not, how do you know who's a school kid and who isn't? Or do you just use your judgement and try and guess who's 'most likely' to steal?
I assume that you accept a property owners right to deny anyone access to their property, based on whatever criterea they want? That's a perfectly valid position. And my position is that I would refuse to give my custom to shopkeepers that exercised this right in a way that I deemed unethical, so there you go. However, they do not own the street outside the shop, that's public property. As public property, any member of the public deserves to be treated equally on it by the authorities. A group of people, of any age should only be moved on if they are actually causing harm to another person. Them being a certain age is not nearly enough of an indicator that they are planning to commit a crime of some sort.
If you're going to draw paralells between cases of discrimination then you've got to make sure they're exact and that you're basing your newly found assumptions on fact. Black people weren't discriminated against in America because people were spun the line that they were "being troublemakers", they were discriminated against because they were seen as lesser human beings.
Thanks!
Do you agree with police curfews for under 16's?
If i own a shop in which i'm having an extreme amount of theft from kids at the local "Tea-Leaf High", then of course i'm going to limit the numbers of kids coming in from that school. It's all i've got to go on. Unless you're suggesting i personally get to know all 800 of them as individuals? Which is obviously pretty ridiculous because i have a life to lead and a business to run.
I think people see the word "dicriminate" and immediately throw there arms up in the air screaming "oh the inhumanity of it all". Discrimination comes in many forms and is sometimes a good thing, sometimes a bad thing and an awful lot of the time, necessary.
Yes, all children are treated like lesser human beings and the comparrison between them and the American civil rights movement is exact. :eek2:
I haven't thought about it a lot to be honest, but i can see what you're getting at. I think that in some extreme cases it could probably be reasonably argued for, in some specific, localised areas.
I think we're getting a way off the original topic here, but i also think that the odd flash in the pan story on the BBC or in the papers isn't enough for me to forget about all the positive things that kids have as well. There are plenty of things available to kids these days that simply weren't available to me as a child. The very fact kids have a medium such as TheSite to debate and air their views is more than i had.
A couple of kids get told they can't play hopscotch and suddenly kids the comparrison between that and the civil rights movement is drawn. I think you need to be careful not to make martyrs out of todays youth, because i reckon that's way off the reality of the situation.