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I don't think you understand the seriousness of the situation. In Aberystwyth university alone, 23 exams have been cancelled. Not rearranged, Cancelled. Some of those are final year exams... no exam, no mark, no graduation.
We've been going on and on about this for weeks, I hoped that the recent media coverage would actually make people realise that the lecturers are not bluffing, because they damn well are not bluffing. Every lecturer in my department would rather go out on full strike than accept a pathetic pay deal.
This matter is serious. It is already happening. Get your head out of the sand and actually understand that.
Of my own lecturers I know a couple aren't, a couple are and a couple I don't know about. The two lecturers marking my dissertation are though and it is a compulsory element for the overall degree.
This nonsense made me giggle as well -
Freedom is always the answer.
That is until some rich kid's daddy takes Oxford/UCL/Cambridge/LSE university to court to get their grades, then the government will realise.
exactly
we're all doomed.
a) It is preposterous to think that they would get a 25% increase, not a bad starting point for negotiations , they have got 12.5% before exams start, why don't they accept that then see what the situation is like in a couple of years time when they can properly assess the impact of top-up fees.
b) People choose to work in a university because it is a nice, fairly comfortable job. If the pay is so scandalous then WHY ARE YOU STILL DOING IT? If you are so amazingly talented then go and get a better job. The fatc is that many lecturer particulalry in arts are very unlikely to do any better outside of academe and there is no sign that the falling real wage for the last 20 years has had any impact on the quality of staff.
c) The comparison to a primary school teacher. Why should lecturers get paid more than a primary school teacher? The latter is I imagine a harder job and potentially adds a lot more value than a lecturer does.
d) People who complain that they are striking at a sensitive time are rather missing the point of a strike.
e)The NUS is a disgrace for not representing its members interests.
f) The hypocricy of the lecturers supposedly being against fees then demanding as much as possible from them and the NUS being against fees then supporting the lecturers in their demands for more pay is quite stunning. When are they going to admit that the interests of these two groups are completely opposed?
However, i cant see how the NUS supporting the Strikes has any positive outcomes whatsoever.
SG: Are you proposing abolishing Unions?
these are values over 3 years....
not everyone picks their career because of pay, we'd have no teachers or nurses if this was the case
they're both equally valuble imo and lecturing requires somewhat more training than primary school teaching - you need to be at the end or have done a PhD which takes 7 years minumum at university, that is a long time of dedicating yourself to a subject. Primary school teaching needs a batchelors degree, half of that degree is just doing a placement anyway, i know i have a friend in a course for it
exactly, if strikes didnt hurt universities it would be pointless
the NUS never has, id be all for the UCLU (my universities union) to leave the NUS, the NUS just rips off its members so people can get into politics
the vice chancellor's wages have gone up loads in the past few years, and the university sector has taken crippling cuts in pay for regular staff over the past 25 years (less than inflation for 25 years) so the union is trying to redress this balance - fair dues and they get my full support, you can't honestly expect a universities to improve its teaching when it's staff who often do both research and teaching, get paid better for research and sod all for teaching - yes, good researchers provide inspriation to many students, but good teaching out of lecture support help a lot also, especially on a course like mine which at one point i was in from 9-6 without breaks with the last 5 hours of it being a long lab session which doesnt help when your ill
my university every year has a vote on leaving the NUS, the NUS is for wannabe politicians who dont have student interests at heart, only their leaders image
most student unions would co-operatewithout the NUS anyway as the NUS is such a joke
Where did your post just go?
Anyway.......
What has extra pay got to do with the quality of teaching? Extra money won't suddenly turn lecturers into amazing teachers overnight. If you want a better standard of university teaching than introduce teaher training for academics, that would really make a difference on people going into academe!
The fact that pay has been cut during a period of massive university expnasion and growth all throughout the economy shoudl tell you something. Academe is a very popular job because it is a rewarding and not too diffivcult career choice.
Why should academics get paid as much as people doing some shitty grind for a job they are enjoying, and if they don't enjoy it then why are they doing given how talented they are supposed to be?
If someone can show me that the fall in real pay has been matched by a fall in standards then they might have a point but a very much doubt this is true, quite possibly the opposite in fact........
being an academic an easy choice :yuck:
you havent seen how stressed some of my lecturers are
and imo the fall in standards has been covered by the fact, most graduates dont go into their field directly, most people in maths and physical sciences go into banking......
Yes it is
I work in a university department, I know people who work for banks etc and from that I am reasonably sure that it is not that hard. Working in a university dpeartment is certainly less stressful than working in the city for example.....
Do you have any proof for a fall in standards? Was it ever not true that most graduetas don't work in their field?
Your don't have to bring home the bacon as part of a team, it's all paid for by theft so all you have to watch for is internal politics and backsniping.
And let's face it, in an age when there is byzantine health and safety regulation, a decent standard of living for most and a healthy black and grey economy to keep both of those running there is no point in having a union.
This being the case, unions have to stir shit to justify their existence.
Yet the Unions arnt exactly in favour of Labour are they? of course they're going to be left leaning though, there not going to be demanding no minimum wage and no breaks. they want whats best for the workers. However in the case of the AUT this is effecting who they should be helping, the students.
Theres nothing better to keep competition out of a market than violently imposed rules. Take the rules away and it would sort itself out in no time.
Oh diddums.
Who ever thought they'd see the day a student was completely self-absorbed and self-interested instead of thinking of the bigger picture :eek2:
No they haven't.
12% over three years is a nice headline, but it equates as 4% anyway. And that doesn't take into account "modernised" working practices- i.e. you get a 4% pay rise for doing 25% more work.
And?
Not as selfish as the VC who helps himself to £250,000 salaries.
Paid.
Oh, and no you haven't.
It's not putting anyone's education in jeopardy. Most graduate employers know who they want anyway, and often use projected degree marks at sift anyway. Everyone else can wait a few weeks to get their scrolls, big deal.
The people causing this are the VCs who are creaming off huge wedges of cash and not funding the people who are delivering the services. Same old same old.
...and waaaaaaaaaaaaay less paid. Your point was?