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Actually, no-one can claim it's "bollocks". Unless, of course, they've got a super-advanced understanding of metaphysics and can destroy the theory that there is no freedom of will.
I have trouble accepting you are such a person.
Whatever.
Oops, I slipped, and I just landed in the girl from accounts. Didn't mean to, honest.
Metaphysics is bollocks anyway.
What's "bollocks" about it?
So you choose love, say you wouldnt cheat but would have sex with someone else if your partner said you could? See?? isn't that easy? Isn't that simple to do. Instead of being holier then thou and using cheap insults at me.
The film is not irrelevant at all, isnc eits based on reallife. The main story is fiction, bu tthe issues and conversations with in it are real.
lipsy - a very poor cheap shot. And considering you have said on here that if you wer eina relationship for a few years and then saw someone you simply "fancied" you wouldnt help yourself. I think we can guess where you stand on sex vs love.
:rolleyes:
Like all philosophy, it's great to talk about over a bottle of wine or three, but it's not actually got very much impact on real life. Diverting, but nothing more.
Can you avoid putting your cock in a girl that's not your lass? Yes. If you don't then you've made a conscious decision to cheat.
Walkindude, you don't have a girlfriend, stop taking your ideas from rather poor fiction. Life isn't that simple. Life never is. One day you'll realise it.
Really. So politics, psychology and law aren't rooted & based in philosophy? :rolleyes:
Original point still stands i'm afraid.
However life isn't as simple as that, I'm no longer at your stage of life, so my answer is no longer the clear cut one you so easily give. I still wouldn't cheat, but there are situations where I believe I would choose sex over love, and end a realtionship so I could have sex without cheating. In the end your question is crap. It is as simple as "would you choose to have air or water?" (to which my answer would be, while I know the "right" answer is air, I'd choose water)
A film can ask questions, not give you answers. You presented it as the latter.
You remain insulting. I doubt you have even the rudiments of the necessary mental framework that would allow you to properly evaluate any "grown up" position on the issue
That's merely one school of metaphysical thought, compatibilism - which is largely regarded as evidently flawed. Incompatibilism asserts the opposite.
antidisestablishmentarianism
Yep gets our vote too
Cheers Katralla :thumb:
It isn't anything like choosing between air and water, you don't need sex and choosing to have sex with some random person when your already in a loving relationship is just being weak I think.
The film can ask questions and give insights. Thats what I said.
the question is sensible and real.
I know this isn't politics and debate, but at least try to remember what you've said - even if you can't manage the other participants.
The question may be real but it isn't really sensible. And that is a valid answer to your question.
I get no pleasure from this, For your enlightenment I've tried to show that there are more aspects than you may have considered, and despite your rudeness (which I have repaid in kind) I've continued to answer your questions in case it was an issue of me failing to explain the points I was raising clearly enough - including going into some quite painful areas of my life, however I'm now convinced that it is either unwillingness, or inability on your part; I am sorry I misjudged you, and I shall cease to waste my time. You join ginner in my ignore list.
Regards,
CR
Did you guys take any notice of this at all? If anyone else wants to post their views on this then feel free, but if you two carry on with your personal insults then I will close it. :grump:
No offence mate ... but you've sort of given the impression of doing that yourself whether intentionally or not.
You also don't need love.
Look lets be honest this is not a black and white question like you seem to think. Firstly everyone has a different idea of love and a different capacity for it...I have one friend who regularly falls in and out of love with girls and another friend whose only ever been in love with one girl who he's been with for years. You can't set a limit on what it is, define it and then ask which is better ... its a ridiculous question.
And as others have pointed out sex is a hugely important part of love and again how important it is to love varies from person to person.
I don't understand why you can't accept some people have a different approach to or view of love than your own? Or how you can't see that sex and love are often inseparable to the point where the question is impossible.
From what you've said you are a bit of an old romantic, fair enough its good that you've got the relative importance of these things to you sorted in your own mind but don't judge others if they don't hold the same views. Just because someone isn't sure whether they'd choose love or sex doesn't mean they're a sex-crazed-heartless-cheating-bastard!
The film is just an expression of the director's feelings on the subject ... it has no more authority than anyone's posted opinion here.
It really isn't ... sex or love? What does love include ... love inside of friendship, between family members, for a pet, for a hobby, for music? Sex is a specific term for a bodily function and love is a vague concept that all sorts of things get lumped under.
Define love for me (and also exactly how I feel about love ... because I'm not very sure) and I'll give you an answer. Until then its a ridiculous question.
Love is epic, love is everything. Love is what drives forward species, sex is simply the mechanics of it. Love is in all things. Love is centreal to anything thats big. Even in religion,t he empathises is on love, not sex. While the bible maybe filled with little sex capades and the church obessed with it. Its Love thats the key. The quote in the Bible is "God is Love". Love is God! Love is is on par with the chreator. Now if you belive in God or even if you don't it shows how big an dhow powerful love is. Love forms relationships fo rlifetimes, Love saves life, Love makes people sacrifice themelevses, Love stops moves people.
Sex, is pleasurable, is biological, is passionate, its intimate, its clinical, it parts people, destroys relationships, makes realtionships but is it ever epic? Is it so linked to a quality of life? Does it make people feel the same as being love? Is it ever been on par with a creator of all life?
I don't think so.
Maybe you can be in a realtionship and be swept off your feet but do you cheat really? Only if your not in love with the one your in a relationship with. I mean I giess there is love and in love for sure. And then what about if you'd lose your family coz for some reason you would if you stayed having great sex with some1 else. Then wha do you choose?
Its just things to think about.
I mean would you cheat on your wedding day? the night before? the honeymoon?
people who, claim they are in love, thats why they get married and then do acts like that so how do they love that person?
thats what I am getting at.
No one is going to back down and say "oh, you're right, I've just changed my entire way of thinking because of your inspiring monologue" so there's no point in anyone getting in trouble over it.
Just agree to disagree.
If you can have the same kind of love for your mother and father (i.e. as a parent/family member) and yet love them differently why is it impossible to have same kind of love for two people (i.e. romantic/sexual) and love them differently but at the same time?
The reason that I'm continuing this is purely because as many people have said this whole discussion is purely on the individuals opinion ... there is no right or wrong answer and yet you seem completley unwilling to admit that any other point of view than your own could be correct.
For instance you say
If two people are in an open relationship its not for you to accept or not if its cheating or not. Your values and opinion on love have no bearing on that at all ... its only their own that count.
You've made your view perfectly clear ... but it seems like having made your view clear your determined to show everyone who has a different view that your's is in fact the 'right' one. Its not ... its just the right one for you.
Right i have far too many essays to do so that's it for me ... i think this is pretty exhausted anyway
Yes, it really is hopelessly simplistic. It cannot have an answer because it is so ridiculously simplistic.
They're not cheating if the two people concerned don't see them as cheating.
So why do you see it as cheating? Because it doesn't sit comfortably with your naive view of the world?
No, it really isn't.
Love doesn't change anything. Don't believe the bollocks written, it doesn't fix anything or solve anything.
No, again you're hopelessly wrong. Only two mammals in the world mate for pleasure, and not many more stay together after the mating season. many insects eat their partners, in fact.
But what is epic?
Sex is fun, enjoyable and makes babies. That's all it does.
The feeling of relaxation after a good hard shag is one of the nicest going.
Sometimes, but you can love your partner and still cheat on them. It is possible. Just because you don't or haven't doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Stop being so naive.
Eh?
What are you on about?
The reason why a lot of people don't cheat is because they don't want to hurt their partner, and they don't want to lose them. They know that a shag isn't worth losing them.
That doesn't mean you can't love someone and still want to have sex with someone else.
A nonsense statement.
You can. End of discussion.
I am not forcing my views on anyone. Its called a debate and the quotes you ripped out on my point on relationships being 2 way missed out the line at the end that said it was just a theory.
Kermit- saying its ridiculously simplitistic does nothing, proves nothing and says nothing. A pointless statement.
My view on cheating is not naive. Relationships are defined in terms of fidelity and faithfullness, marriage, its the whole point. 1 on one. Even if you get permission from your partner to fuck someone else, it is sill cheating purely by definition on sociteys standards. Anyway, has any realtionship in the world ever truely successfully worked out where there has been more then 2 people involved? Really I'd like to know coz everyone I have seen where even when they say its all happy, it eventually turns and at least one person is not happy in the whole thing and truely never was.
Yes it does. Love is epic and changes thing. Loves keeps some1 with their partner when that partner is an alcholoic or drug addict and is so bad to themselves and their partner, but the person that loves them stays with them and helps them through it. Love lets people sacrifice themselves for their partners, love make speople does crazy romantic things, love makes people happy, love makes people feel complete. For the love of another people have gone on quests, fought to the death and more. Love i sin religion for crying out loud. Love is that powerful. Love inspires- just look at how many love songs their are in existance.
Insects?? Basic lifeforms who's sole function is to live and reproduce. Basic genetic elements? Thats a crap arguement kermit. More then 2 mammals mate for pleasure and even more mate for life. The question of love in species reproduction is debatable yes, but if love is not a natural bi-product to ensure survival of the species then where did it come from? what is it? Could it be its more powerful then the need to survive?
Note, I said you CAN love your partner and cheat. What I said was you must not be IN LOVE with them. Thats the difference. Read what I write. It is not naive.
My last example was a love vs sex idea. You love your family but your having sex with someone they don't want you to. They say you must choose between your family or your shag partner. There is love vs sex scenerio. What do you choose?
Its not a nonsense statement. I started this whole thread after reading a persons confession of fucking around on their honeymoon. How can they be in love or in this case even love thier partner to do that??
Its not end of discussion kermit, You really have a god complex. You do not make descions, you do not decide what is right and what isn't, you do not decide when a discussion is ended simple because you don't agree. Grow up for god's sake.
If people can't handle a discussion that goes deeper then whats the best sex they had or how many different ways they can slag of america and say everything is a conspiracy then don't come on the thread, but if you want a civilised discussion on a real subject then please feel free to post.
Yes, I agree with you partly Walkindude. Why are you together with that partner if you want to have sex with someone else? Because you are sexually unsatisfied? Work it out then.
A relationship is between two people, not another person IMHO.
If you were truly in love with someone, you would not cheat - only if there was some sort of sexual satisfaction deficit. Sex and love are two different things. If it was, why do married people cheat? Why do people who are madly in love with each other cheat?
That is a very hard question to answer. You need both to feel whole IMO.