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It's not often that I say 'well done' to The S*n...

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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I totally disagree that it's a deterrent because I think the root cause of animal cruelty (and child abuse for that matter) is a rather warped view of right and wrong, independent of the consequences of the action committed.

    I probably wouldn't ask the same questions if I baby was put through a spin wash because I couldn't care less if the person was battered to death in the town centre with unspecified heavy objects but I think there is a difference between animal cruelty and child abuse. Locking up a child abuser does protect other children (usually the other children in the family), but locking up an animal tormenter makes no difference imho. You can stop people owning animals but you can't stop them producing more children very easily.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Kentish wrote:
    I totally disagree that it's a deterrent because I think the root cause of animal cruelty (and child abuse for that matter) is a rather warped view of right and wrong, independent of the consequences of the action committed.

    I probably wouldn't ask the same questions if I baby was put through a spin wash because I couldn't care less if the person was battered to death in the town centre with unspecified heavy objects but I think there is a difference between animal cruelty and child abuse. Locking up a child abuser does protect other children (usually the other children in the family), but locking up an animal tormenter makes no difference imho. You can stop people owning animals but you can't stop them producing more children very easily.
    But you were asking whether sending people to jail would help at all, as a deterrent, to stop the offender doing it again or to protect the public? Those are valid question but they are certainly no crime-specific.

    Either you believe that sending people to jail is a good idea (to deter, to prevent reoffending & to protect) or you don't. The type of crime really does not come into the equation.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Of course it does. Some crimes aren't receptive to a deterrent - crimes of passion for example will happen regardless. They are only punished because we must be consistent.

    Animal cruelty whilst awful is the product of a society in which these people are created.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Quick point I would like to raise -

    Most serial killers, sociopaths and other dangerous types of that ilk start off injuring animals.

    So aside from the obvious cruelty issue theres another good reason to not let this kind of thing happen.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    sociopaths
    That's the word I'm looking for. Lost causes.
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    Teh_GerbilTeh_Gerbil Posts: 13,332 Born on Earth, Raised by The Mix
    They should be treated like any murder would be. It's a fucking disgrace this is allowed to go like this, and they just get off so lightly.

    Overcrowded Jails? How about those dicks in government stop closing them eh? Maybe build some more? No, we are too fucknig busy fucking up Iraq. For fucks sake.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    If you can do that to a cat, you can do it to a person, and as klintock says the link is quite obvious and quite common.

    If you don't think that animal cruelty is serious, then that is a completely different argument. If you think boiling a cat alive is only worthy of a fine and a meaningless banning order then you should say so.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    People aren't born psychopaths, they are made psychopaths.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Blagsta wrote:
    People aren't born psychopaths, they are made psychopaths.
    I don't think it's as simple as that, I think some people just like hurting animals.

    Whilst environment has an impact, if every kid from a shit background starting kicking cats then there'd be none left.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Kermit wrote:
    I don't think it's as simple as that, I think some people just like hurting animals.

    That's a meanignless statement. Why do you think they do? Were they born like that? Is it genetic?
    Kermit wrote:
    Whilst environment has an impact, if every kid from a shit background starting kicking cats then there'd be none left.

    Did I say that everyone from a shit background becomes a psycho?
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    SkiveSkive Posts: 15,286 Skive's The Limit
    Kermit wrote:
    If you can do that to a cat, you can do it to a person

    Rubbish.

    I shoot rats for fun, but it's doesn't mean I could shoot people.
    Weekender Offender 
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    People aren't born psychopaths, they are made psychopaths.

    Yup. By themselves.
    I don't think it's as simple as that, I think some people just like hurting animals.

    Anyone can learn to, this is the frightening thing. I have a friend who quit working in an abbatoir because "he started to like it". I know bailiffs who started off feeling bad about taking other people's stuff and pushing others about who now love it.
    Whilst environment has an impact, if every kid from a shit background starting kicking cats then there'd be none left.

    Nah. It's not sociological. If you get a rush of pleasure from doing something, I mean anything, you are more likely to do it again. What the original circumstances were really doesn't matter, once the pleasure has been linked in the person's going to continue to do it.

    This is true of any fetish or compuslion, from smoking to having to put your pants on in the morning. Some serve you, some don't. Few people have much control over these processes, or are even aware of what they are and how they operate.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I do worry about you klintock.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Really, why?

    (but thanks, I guess)
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Blagsta wrote:
    People aren't born psychopaths, they are made psychopaths.
    Indeed. And once they have become one, they tend to stay that way.

    Animal cruelty is serious, but on a different level from child abuse.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    Would you be asking the same questions if it had been a baby instead of a cat put inside a washing machine?

    Without reading the rest of the thread I would just point out how absurd that statement is.

    If you can't see why then I worry for you.........
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    If you think that torturing a cat to death doesn't deserve a custodial sentence, I worry about you much more than you could possibly be worrying about me...

    Do read the thread. No one is saying killing of a dog or a cat is as bad as killing a baby or that it should deserve the same severity of punishment.
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