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Biology VS Homosexuality

Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
I'm interested in this subject, as a Biology student.

I think everyone is constructed as a variety of chemicals, and if they cause them to be attracted to the same sex then so be it.

The question I'm asking is, where does religion come into proven science? What difference does an XX VS an XY chromosome component make on the ability of a person to bring up a child - ie, two XX parents?

And some people suggest that if it was "natural" for people to conveive, they seem to forget that evolution occurred RANDOMLY over millions of years, natural selection etc.

My simple question is, biologically and scientifically, what is the argument against homosexuality? Leaving aside the bible.... which most straight people don't abide to anyway...

A further question - do people have a natural instinct to hate someone or something? Is disliking gay people as an easy target, remembering we are all animals with natural instincts to thrive.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Re: Biology VS Homosexuality
    Originally posted by Nostromo
    I'm interested in this subject, as a Biology student.

    I think everyone is constructed as a variety of chemicals, and if they cause them to be attracted to the same sex then so be it.

    The question I'm asking is, where does religion come into proven science? What difference does an XX VS an XY chromosome component make on the ability of a person to bring up a child - ie, two XX parents?

    And some people suggest that if it was "natural" for people to conveive, they seem to forget that evolution occurred RANDOMLY over millions of years, natural selection etc.

    My simple question is, biologically and scientifically, what is the argument against homosexuality? Leaving aside the bible.... which most straight people don't abide to anyway...

    A further question - do people have a natural instinct to hate someone or something? Is disliking gay people as an easy target, remembering we are all animals with natural instincts to thrive.
    i believe we are way way above all other creatures on this planet. we have left animals behind somweher but still behave like them occasionaly cos we can't handle our own brilliance.
    the thought of snogging another blokes bristles sends shivers through me. the thought of gay sex also seriously turns me off ...but thats cos i'm straight. not becuae i have a problem with gay people.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Yes, but that doesn't really answer my question, you've just given a bigomistic approach, as opposed to the answer I was looking for. You just gave your personal opinion, which fails to answer my question, as, some people might like "snogging another man's bristles".

    We haven't really left "animals" behind, of which there are thousands of species... we are still mammals at the end of the day. If we've left them so behind in a world of utopia surely we'd include everyone - gay marriage etc.

    People become so preoccupied by a 2,000 yr old book and what they think people should do, without thinking about the science of it, which is my area of questioning.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Nostromo
    Yes, but that doesn't really answer my question, you've just given a bigomistic approach, as opposed to the answer I was looking for. You just gave your personal opinion, which fails to answer my question, as, some people might like "snogging another man's bristles".

    We haven't really left "animals" behind, of which there are thousands of species... we are still mammals at the end of the day. If we've left them so behind in a world of utopia surely we'd include everyone - gay marriage etc.

    People become so preoccupied by a 2,000 yr old book and what they think people should do, without thinking about the science of it, which is my area of questioning.
    you've fuckin' lost me mate.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    He wants a scientific answer.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by minimi38
    He wants a scientific answer.
    so do lots of researchers apparently ...no one seems to be getting very far.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by morrocan roll
    so do lots of researchers apparently ...no one seems to be getting very far.

    If you have no contribution, other than to offend gay people about same sex relationships, then don't bother.

    I'm sure they're not aroused by the things you find a turn-on, and vice versa. That wasn't really my question and was hoping for an intelligent response, not an in-depth account of what turns YOU on.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Nostromo
    If you have no contribution, other than to offend gay people about same sex relationships, then don't bother.

    I'm sure they're not aroused by the things you find a turn-on, and vice versa. That wasn't really my question and was hoping for an intelligent response, not an in-depth account of what turns YOU on.
    i'm pretty sure i haven't offended any gay people. i must have misunderstood the question.
    got to go to bed. to much indulgence and sunburn ...easrly rise on the cards.
    goodnight.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    What is the argument against homosexuality? None, apart from bigotry, hate and ignorance.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    There is no evidence that homosexuality is biological.

    It could very well be psychological.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    And?

    Even if it is 'un-natural', whats the difference?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by minimi38
    He wants a scientific answer.

    Pointless me replying in this topic then ;)
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by The Matadore
    There is no evidence that homosexuality is biological.

    It could very well be psychological.

    There is some evidence actually. But even if it is psychological, so what? It still isn't a matter of choice.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I'm all for gay parenting myself, but i think the main arguement is that is a child is missing a Mother or Father figure is had an adverse effect on the child, which really isnt much of a arguement as it would be the same thing for single parents?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    The limbic system controls the drives of all individuals within the species. One of the main drives is to procreate in order to preserve the species. Homosexuality has a sexual drive, but not to continue the species so nature dictates that they would not contribute to the gene pool. All natural, all science.

    I can't see how there can be any more social arguments against homosexuality. We developed a society, we developed the science to ensure our species will never die out (bar a major event) so science and nature has legitimised it (for humans) rather than hold unrealistic expectations like religion.

    Throughout nature there is a defined male and female role, but our society is so light years ahead of anything else on the planet that it doesn't really matter anymore.

    If anything, Religion is un-natural by forcing people to go against their natural drives (celibacy, peace, devotion to God). It's society's job to ensure drives are controlled and society is natural.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Blagsta
    There is some evidence actually. But even if it is psychological, so what? It still isn't a matter of choice.
    i'm sure for many people it is an inteligent decision.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    basically the scientific argument i see is that sex has a purpose for any animal - and that is reproduction. homosexuality doesn't acheive or contribute towards this primal need so it could be argued it's a defective human trait - it actually serves the purpose of destroying the race by reducing the amount of heterosexual - therefore reproductive - relationships.

    in reality this isn't the case, and homosexuality isn't 'taking over the world'
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by TheShyBoyInTheCorner
    destroying the race by reducing the amount of heterosexual - therefore reproductive - relationships.

    but we are quite happy to justify burning holes in the roof of the world and killing and maiming in the cause of freedom.
    we are willing to accept that in the ethiopian famine ...no food was growing but ...due to western help in the past by way of aid...the well irrigated luxury crops for t5he west ...tobacco and rubber etc ...were growing just fine. you can't eat them though.
    destroying ....how is the fact that a guy down the road who lives and loves with another guy ...threatening me even worse? i think not. i also think the political fight that gay people have put up has reaped them divedendsd the last5 twenty years.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I can't answer the biology/bible question, it would take too long.
    The last question is easier.
    Humans are like any other mammal, we are fiercely territorial. We mark out and defend our territory on even the most minute scale, from staking a claim to the remote control right up to seeing our troops march into Berlin.

    A result of this territorial behaviour is a fear and/or hatred of the unknown. We look out our window and see the majority, we see our friends, neighbours and colleagues. Chances are 90% of them are white, and straight. Many of us have, over the years conditioned ourselves to like and accept the other 10%. We are friends with black people, gay people, people of other religions. We do this because despite our territorality, and our fear, we are human. Unlike other mammals we can also show compassion.

    Yes many people will see a gay person and instantly develop their territorial trait, they will do as they see fit to rid themselves of the outsider. Other people will see the same thing, but it won't bother them. Our humanity will override our gut instinct and we will engage these people as any other.
    No other animal shows this, how many times have you seen a wolf attacking its prey, and just before the final blow giving up and allowing its victim to live?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Surely the biological arguemnt against homosexuality is obvious...

    Human males are not designed to have sex with each other, they are designed to reproduce with the opposite sex, thereby spreading their genes.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by The Matadore
    Human males are not designed to have sex with each other
    And yet they manage to do so very successfully. :D

    Does it really matter what the human body was 'designed' for? I trust those who use the biological argument against homosexuality have never, ever indulged in oral or anal sex with their partners. At the end of the day their wives' mouths were created for talking and eating, not for sucking cock...
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by The Matadore
    Human males are not designed to have sex with each other, they are designed to reproduce with the opposite sex

    Ho Ho Ho................... lmfao

    Its all about preferences, you like one or the other or in some cases you like a bit of both ;)
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Aladdin
    At the end of the day their wives' mouths were created for talking and eating, not for sucking cock...

    :lol:

    lmfao.........classic that one :lol:
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by morrocan roll
    i'm sure for many people it is an inteligent decision.

    I don't think it is a conscious decision actually. Most gay people I know knew they were gay, or at least different, from a very early age, before puberty usually.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by The Matadore
    Surely the biological arguemnt against homosexuality is obvious...

    Human males are not designed to have sex with each other, they are designed to reproduce with the opposite sex, thereby spreading their genes.

    Designed? WTF? :confused:

    Homosexuality exists on other species. Whats your explanation for that?
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    SkiveSkive Posts: 15,286 Skive's The Limit
    Originally posted by Blagsta
    Designed?

    Designed by the power of natural selection.
    Originally posted by Blagsta
    Homosexuality exists on other species. Whats your explanation for that?

    Almost all other species don't have sex for pleasure either.
    Weekender Offender 
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Natural selection is not "design". It is random mutations that might or might not be useful to survival. "Design" implies a plan.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Skive
    Almost all other species don't have sex for pleasure either.

    Sorry have I missed the point here because I'm not sure what you mean by this.

    Some pecies have sex for pleasure, some have "homosexual" relations. Now unless we are to believe that both of these are not determined by nature, but by personal preference, then sure both aspect of life are perfectly "natural"?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Re: Re: Biology VS Homosexuality
    Originally posted by morrocan roll
    i believe we are way way above all other creatures on this planet.

    Are we? Really?

    Take away oil and electricity and we're fucked. All we have done is learn to use many of our natural resources. I certainly don't think that this makes us any "better" than animals, just different.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Nostromo
    If you have no contribution, other than to offend gay people about same sex relationships, then don't bother.

    I'm sure they're not aroused by the things you find a turn-on, and vice versa. That wasn't really my question and was hoping for an intelligent response, not an in-depth account of what turns YOU on.

    Your high horse? Get off of it.

    What made his comments offensive to gay people?
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    SkiveSkive Posts: 15,286 Skive's The Limit
    Originally posted by Blagsta
    Natural selection is not "design". It is random mutations that might or might not be useful to survival. "Design" implies a plan.

    Take a look at this link ...I've just read this and found it quite intresting in how it explains homosexuality in the animal world.
    Weekender Offender 
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