If you need urgent support, call 999 or go to your nearest A&E. To contact our Crisis Messenger (open 24/7) text THEMIX to 85258.
Read the community guidelines before posting ✨
Options
Berg video another fraud?
Former Member
Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
I refer my fellow posters to the most pointed argument ive seen anywhere on the web to date on this growing controversy...
http://www.genmay.com/showthread.php?t=354134
Smells like another case of "wag the dog" to me.
(Please be respectful representatives of TheSite if you post there though please, since the majority of posters have shown little more than childish disrespect for the documented analysis provided by the original poster).
http://www.genmay.com/showthread.php?t=354134
Smells like another case of "wag the dog" to me.
(Please be respectful representatives of TheSite if you post there though please, since the majority of posters have shown little more than childish disrespect for the documented analysis provided by the original poster).
0
Comments
I am not sure - not convinced either way. I must read the information again, and look at some other source before I try and pass judgment on here!
Ultimatly, what we do know - is that Berg did die as a result of the war in Iraq - and for that we all must be sad.
http://www.kathymcmahon.utvinternet.com/mrn/NickBergEnemiesList.htm
Got this from a thread at Harmony Central. I don't normally buy into conspiracy theories but there are some good points here.
Wag the Dog is a very tactic in political mythmaking to further a given political agenda and the timing of this lends every credence to its contrivance.
With so many unaccountable mercs running about under our pay and in collusion with CIA operatives on the ground, it's entirely plausible that this was intended to elicit precisely the public outrage and demand for even more violent reprisals which are being heard across the US.
Just another example of "manufactured consent".
Hey, sorry I didn't mean to put this in the same boat as alien abductions or anything. A conspiracy theory was the only way I could think of describing it. You're right this has a lot more substance.
Yet fringe conspiracy theories is what you deal in.
Need I remind everyone that you maintain that 9/11 was perpertrated by the US government for its own shadowy ends?
I recall is was the usual corporate/republican/Bush/RIGHT WING interests that you think did it.
I cant believe anyone could believe this drivel (inculding the theory that the Berg video was fake). Yet some people are simply so closed minded regarding America and so convinced that is the Great Satan that they will believe anything made up by the European left.
I certainly hope it isn't the US behind this - but just as you can come up with arguments for why it is, I can come up with counterargumets for that.
It would be good to get that guy posting what he thinks on here.
All of them....together? I think the guy makes an interesting case, and I certainly wouldn't put it past the Yanks to do something like this to curry favour.
As for you Mat, those with any degree of intellectual honesty will indeed acknowledge that many suspicious inconsistencies still remain unanswered. Insofar as I suspect it was a manufactured event stems from considerable examination of all the key elements of the coverstory and the demonstrable military precision and ancillary domestic security standdowns which Al Qaeda never could have hoped to order.
This isnt fringe, merely deprioritised in the US public debate. As with late revelations that emerged concerning the covert activities in Vietnam which emerged with the leakage of the Pentagon Papers, do not be surprised if the unanswered questions are eventually exposed.
If you think you can credibly prove each of the suspect elements of 9/11 are indeed in keeping with the coverstory, ill be mightily impressed. Until then, I and many others will continue to press for a true independent and fully public enquiry as befitting those who died on that day.
Launching perpetual war in their name certainly does not honor their loss nor give value to their deaths. Serious scrutiny (especially in the face of repetedly exposed lies and deceptions by this administration) would go some way to rectifying that.
But i suppose you prefer to continue placing your unquestioning faith in proven liars.
I know some shady used car salesmen who would just love to have you in their showroom!
It does look like his done his homework though even though someone on there accused him of copying and pasting!
Maybe instead of being so far up your own ass, and blaming everything on "yanks", you'd start getting a grip and realise that there are several allegations of British soldiers not playing too nice either?
Apart from the royal wedding the Danish medias have been very occupied with the complaint of Danish soldiers serving in Iraq, who are claiming that the treatmeant of BRITISH soldiers led to the direct death of two Iraqi prisoners.
The "yanks" are not innocent, but please stop getting up on your high horse. Cause frankly, you don't belong there.
And does Denmark have an army? Traffic wardens don't make very good soldiers you know.
Number one, I didn't completely outrule the possibility of the fact that this has been staged to some degree.
Number two, stop acting holy.
Whether this is a legitimate claim, it makes you appear as the joke of this board with the constant conspiracy theories you comne up with.
Now either way -
He mentions the timing and whatnot - but since when have the terrorist ever bothered to get the sympathy of the world? When they flew four planes into an instant death?
He also mentions a gold-ring, but excuse me I know a lot of Muslim arabs who wear that. When describing the stereotypical muslim arab he's described as wearing gold-chains and rings, and wearing his cap on the forehead.
And why shouldn't arabs wear sneakers? The people of Iraq sure wear then when filmed.
Then there's the russian. As far as I know Czechniya (or however you spell it) have some groups which have some stuff in common with Al Qaeda, if I am not mistaking?
You're proving to be more and more of an idiot. Applaud yourself, cause surely no one thought that was possible.
Seriously, how downright stupid can someone be.
Perhaps instead of flinging verbal assault with every retort, you might stop and actually consider that someone with years of experience in the political arena might have merit in exposing the sorts of machinations which go on behind the surface of events you seem so ready to accept at face value.
Once again, the process of debate is thesis - antithesis - synthesis. Present a reasoned counter argument with supporting evidence and that evidence can be debated. As for what you cited, I agree that possibilities exist other than the explanation offered above, however, the evidence is sufficiently suggestive of something contrived (especially having watched the video and noted glaring discrepencies in the imagery) about the act as well as the political timing of its release at the height of the frenzy over the prisoner abuse photos to warrant more than the routine military "investigation" and likely whitewash or scapegoating.
As with my contentions on 9/11 the bottom line is that proper public and judicial investigations are imperative to get to the bottom of the serious credibility gap this administration has brought upon itself.
If one refuses to go back and reassess previous claims by those who have subsequently been caught repeatedly in their own lies, then one places one's faith carelessly in untrustworthy hands.
Questioning the actions of a government isn't stupidity, I'm sure someone with your fantastic educational and lifetime experiences would have realised that by now.
In case you hadn't noticed, America isn't our best friend. Sure Blair walks around telling Bush how good his arse looks, but most people on the street think this "special relationship" is a load of bollocks, a chance for the Yanks to walk all over us.
If I want to see America for what it really is I can, as does everyone else. As far as I can see the only reason you bum Bush so much is because he supports Israel and won't say a dead word against them.
"1) Most people replied by asserting that the execution occured as retribution to the abuse photos that had surfaced, but you have to ask yourself - do these terrorists, who are clearly capable of brainwashing people to the point where they are willing to kill and be killed for their beliefs, really have no concept of political tact? Here they are, the whole world screaming at the US for hypocrisy and injustice over these pictures, and they perform and publish this execution right in the heat of the scandal. In other words, these masters of brainwashing and spin and deception release a video of a despicable act just as the US, their sworn enemy, is being globally grilled. Does this make sense to you?"
Well, if this is the case, why have the alleged perpetrators not protested this via the media or their web sites? Just a thought ....
No, there's indeed nothing wrong with questioning a government and it's ations. But there is something wrong with taking upon yourself the act of "holier than thou", when you have nowhere to place it except your own "arse" - just like you do.
In your skewered world Britain is still an empire and does nothing wrong while the "yanks" (which is a stupid expression, as it refers merely to New Yorkers - but we'll forget that) have fucked up the world and Britains reputation. With or without Bush, your reputation is fucked when it doesn't have anything to do with London.
Hey, if you ask me, you're just bitter that American is a supermight today, and when people think of the traces of the British Empire they think of the chaos in Ireland and Ghandi.
In short, you're fucking annoying. And would have supported the acts of America right now, if Britain was leading the deal.
Bollocks, I'm not jealous of America. Why would I be jealous of a nation that has been and always will be the most likely cause of global armageddon?
When we went empire building we actually created something half decent for the masses. We spread eduction, health and industrialisation. The life expectancy of an Indian worker in the 1800's was higher than that of a city dweller in London, so what does that say?
Yes there were wars, but we didn't exploit a nations resources for ourselves, we put things back and helped those countries to grow. If those countries truly resented us, why do they choose to stay in the commonwealth, and why do we have our military and trade alliances with most of them?
Can you imagine the Bush administration giving each iraqi an American passport and saying "here you go, you're one of us now, you are a fully fledged citizen of the USA". Can you imagine them being given the same rights accorded to any other American? No, you can't because it'll never happen.
Bush is empire building, but instead of coming out and admitting it like we did, he spins a web of lies about WMD, terrorism e.t.c. to get us to follow him. How many terrorists were in Iraq? None. How many WMD's did we find? None. So what was our reason for invading?
And why is it the only country that truly believes in REBUILDING Iraq for the Iraqis and not for us is the UK?
I DID support the Americans, I supported them when I believed we were doing something for the greater good and preventing a madman from killing us all. All that belief which was stolen from us has done, is see the rise of a new madman who is desperately trying to secure enough resources to ensure America remains a superpower.
As for a nation's reputation, ours is fine thankyou. What sort of representation does Denmark have? being beaten in a war and giving us the little Mermaid? Apart from that all we ever hear about Denmark is in the Carlsberg Export adverts.
As for being fucking annoying, at least I don't follow a country so blindly because they just happen to like my religion.
But if you want to look at Denmark then maybe it'd be an idea to look at the kind act of Danes towards the Danish Jews? Show me one other nation who did the same towards it's citizens? You won't be able to, cause there is none.
Or in newer time, the Danish achievement to unite the greater Europe?
Now, those are acievements!
I don't have particular patriotic feelings towards Denmark, and don't particular negative feelings concerning Britain, in fact I absolutely adore London - just trying to display that the greatness of your country is not as great to the extent as you try to make it out to be.
Also you're spiting out bullshit concerning the whole re-building of Iraq. Again placing your country on a piedestal in which it doesn't deserve to be, or at least not alone.
And why mix religion into all of this? It's strictly political.
Still you continue to present no argument on the actual issue (have you ever done so even once in any thread on these boards?) but simply continue to attack people regardless of their position.
Could you kindly clarify for us all here precisely what your position is on the issue and try to demonstrate some consistency?
Its damned if you do and damned if you dont with you it seems.
I disagree with you on most isues and think you're too far-out. But to be completely honst, rather that than an idiot like WhoWhere who doesn't have a problem with what his government does, but holds the greatest contempt against the US, when they're in it together and doing the same.
And no, I have never praised any country, in the same styke as WhoWhere does. Frankly no country deserves that kind of praise, when it doesn't concern anything specific.
Youll find out soon enough just how conspiratorial international politics truly is.
Its the surface spin, touting itself as credible news, which gives you this false impression that issues, agendas, and policies run no deeper than the PR used to explain or justify them. Where power is concerned there is much illicit brokering that goes on behind closed doors which has no concern for the interests of average citizens like you or I.
The cry of "conspiracy theory" is the last bastion of those who most certainly have dirt to hide from the public. Slandering the messengers who endeavour to make those schemes public is the typical response from the political establishment and the media which upholds its status quo.
Frankly people thought Woodward and Bernstein were out on a limb too, yet who was eventually vindicated through persistent investigation and scrutiny of the Nixon admins lies and coverups?
And again, what revelations about government scheming and the extent to which Washington would go to advance its political and economic goals were exposed via the leaking of the Pentagon Papers during that same era?
The weight of precedent falls heavily in favour of my suspicions here and now, im afraid. Those out the limb are those who continue to gullibly swallow the claims of those in power (who desperately seek to maintain that power as well) and be warned, that limb is about to snap.
? No comments ?