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parents denied choice of gender for children
Former Member
Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
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I heard a bloke on the news this morning who wants to choose a girl because his last one was killed in an accident. That seems to me like he's trying to replace the last child, which will put a wierd strain on the relationship and probably be damaging for the child.
In the case of the guy who wants a daughter then obviously most people will sympathise but it suggests he wants a child for his own somewhat selfish reasons, in my opinion these are the wrong reasons........
The headline, a quote from this women was: "I AM SO HAPPY NOW. I FEEL COMPLETELY FULFILLED".
What the fuck???
Is this the reason why people want to choose the sex? To fulfill a dream (or rather, a disgustingly sexist programming) that establishes that no woman can be happy or "fulfilled" until she has children, and those children must be of both sexes to achieve the perfect nuclear family or something?
I'm actually not fundamentally against being able to choose the sex if there are very good reasons for it. But to do it to achieve some pathetic stereotype of perfect families and fulfillment is just shocking.
If you really could choose then the choosing could alter the natural 50/50 ish spread, really fuck up the demographics.
As the NHS got more privatised the issue could become one of consumer demand, fashions and fads for different genders, dangerous stuff!
It doesn't have to be, no, but it's probably more likely. For example, under China's one-child-per-family rule (this is still in force, yeah?), female infanticide is very common because parents are so desperate for a boy.
I don't agree with choosing the sex of your child - as Toadborg said, a child isn't a possession, and it just seems wrong to me. I can't seem to articulate why, I suppose it's just a case of playing God, and it worries me that these kinds of things are now possible.
Since methods to choose a child’s gender exist every decision is a choice. And banning it is a choice TOO but made not by parents but by the government. If parents want to have a girl but can’t choose because of government’s ban and get a boy instead this means the government has chosen their child’s gender. It’s disgusting!
And there was me thinking that genetics would decide. because it never happens that a person who really wants a girl gets a girl, does it? :rolleyes:
Unless Blair is even mroe dastardly than I thought, and injects pregnant women with drugs that make the baby be a boy if they want a girl, and a girl if they want a boy, that is.
It is IMMORAL to decide your childs gender as if you were deciding what new car to buy. Children are not a fashion accessory, if you are not prepared to gamble on the gender lottery then you shouldnt really be having children. If you want a boy and get a girl then its tough shit, if you want a boy and get a boy well done. But let nature decide.
Exactly !!
When I was expecting my Daughter I was hoping for a girl all the way through. I really did not want a boy for personal reasons which I wont go into, but the reasons were to me genuine. I would never had interferred with nature just to give me a girl, unless of course there were genetic reasons.
Not really because:
a) The parents took that risk when they decided to go ahead regardless
b) They could always go abroad
Personally I am more than happy with this ruling and look forward to the banning of all genetic work on humans
It's a tough one, because I can understand the reasons behind it.
I just cannot find it in myself to support genetic modification...
When it comes to research for cancer, Alzheimer's or other diseases, to grow organs for transplant or other such matters, I don't have any problem whatsoever with genetic embryo research.
I know what I think is practical, and I know what I think is dangerous where this kind of research is concerned, and my emotions lie somewhere on the overlap between the two......
Still a tough one. Like I said I can understand the benefits which may come from genetics. I just don't think that it is something we should "play" with...
Besides there comes a point when we have to ask if the human (or more to the point "western") drive for immortality is really a "good" thing? Cancer is horrific, as is Alzheimer's, but at the end of the day - even once you have used genetics to "cure" these conditions, those people will still die, just by other means. Will that be any less horrific?
Which conditions will ultimately bee "off limits"...?
There already schools of thought out there who believe human immortality can be achieved if the body is not damaged beyond repair- for instance in an accident. This might sound ridiculous and I don't think many scientists would believe for a second it could work, but on the other hand several have already said human expectancy could be dramatically increased, even doubled by gene modification.
I think we will just have to draw new lines on the sand as we move on. In the hypothetical case that one day we had a cure for all diseases, I guess we would just all die of old age (in which case be prepared to work until you're 85 and receive a pittance for a pension folks!). This scenario is not particularly welcome. But I don't think we will ever have a cure for all diseases. Cancer if anything seems to be getting worse, so on that disease alone the more research the better.
There are also the non-fatal conditions, but conditions that still make life hell, to be considered. Diabetes, MS... if a cure for those could be achieved by genetic research then it should be looked into.
Why?
Genetics has been suggested as the cure all for many conditions, millions of pounds are being thrown at it and for what? The genetics companies aren't doing this out of a sense of alturism, they are looking for the goose to lay the golden egg which will bring them vast profits.
In a system where taxation runs the health sector those profits are going to come out of our pockets. That one gripe.
The other one is to ask why these conditions actually need curing. Possibly the biggest reason that these conditions are so troublesome is because society cannot care for people properly. Is there anything wrong in putting the money toward looking after people rather than re-inforcing the idea that there is something wrong with them...
Choice would always be better than choice if you could be pretty certain that people would make the right choice, but do they?
parents do not own their 'future children'. They may make the choice to 'try' and have children but they certainly cannot choose to have children, it is unavoidably down to probability.
Furthermore it is not the parents who would choose what gender, they would request a doctor to do it for them. If the govt were to make it positively legal then they would be 'forcing' doctors to do it even if they did not want to, don't you agree?
Under no circumstance would the govt have chosen the childs gender, they would have chosen for it to be down to probabilty like it always has been. is there actually anything wrong with that?
parents do not own their 'future children'. They may make the choice to 'try' and have children but they certainly cannot choose to have children, it is unavoidably down to probability.
To which degree of probability? In the vast majority of cases if they want they got. And even when they can’t they may adopt a child. ( BTW adopting children people usually choose not gender only but also a lot of other things. Does this mean adoption should be banned?)
Furthermore it is not the parents who would choose what gender, they would request a doctor to do it for them. If the govt were to make it positively legal then they would be 'forcing' doctors to do it even if they did not want to, don't you agree?
Sorry I don’t understand this point. If a doctor believes to choose gender is wrong why he must do it?
Under no circumstance would the govt have chosen the childs gender, they would have chosen for it to be down to probabilty like it always has been. is there actually anything wrong with that?
Look here, when umbrellas weren’t invented banning them had no sense. But since they are and govt decides to ban them isn’t it a case of “to be down to probability” to get wet and catch cold? In new circumstances it IS choice, but one made by government not by yourself
I no speaky gobshite.
I am banned from killing another person. The Government chose to ban me from doing so. Its still A Good Thing, is it not?
Your point makes no sense. Why should a parent be able to choose what gender the child is, it is not natural and it makes children nothing more than a fashion accessory. I dont even think it should be allowed in cases of genetic defects, to be quite honest.
Its not a reactionary viewpoint, and its certainly unfair to compare it with IVF treatments. It shouldnt be allowed because it is morally wrong to pick and choose gender, it is interfering with nature purely for selfish reasons. It is no different to Monsanto developing "terminator" crops purely for profit- parents should not be allowed to determine their childs gender simply for profit or benefit.
But since genetics has been invented and it is possible to choose the sex of your child, banning them is very much an option...
As, apparently, is taking huge amounts of mind altering drug before posting on the site...
No it doesn't, it belongs to society.
Unless you consider all laws to be erroneous.
Society is an abstraction, it’s good in science but has no sense in real life. “Rights of society” is the same that green meridian or cubic metre of loyalty.
Personalising abstractions is sin, mess, mystics and delirium.
Of course all laws are erroneous!
Yes, they give life, and that is where their involvement ends.
But then it isn;t the preants who genetically alter, or select, the respective embryo. That requires the intervention of "society".
This might be because he has the ability to make the change - whereas the parents don't. That gives him huge power.