Home Politics & Debate
If you need urgent support, call 999 or go to your nearest A&E. To contact our Crisis Messenger (open 24/7) text THEMIX to 85258.
Read the community guidelines before posting ✨
Options

brits in Camp X-Ray

Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
what does everyone think about Moazzam Begg and Feroz Abbasi being tried by the U.S and possibly facing the death penalty?
«1

Comments

  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    None of the prisoners have any business being in unilateral US custody nor subject to unilateral US judgement in the first place.

    The fact that charges have not been pressed against most of the detainees added to the dispicable practices of secret evidence and secret military tribunals which deny all due process to the proceedings only further smears the character of the nation and exposes the Bush admin as no better than the regimes they decry.

    From the testimonies of those few who have managed to get released the goings on down there are in such flagrant breach of all human rights safeguards that im shocked #10 isnt applying the pressure it has doen so often towards other governments which ave arrested its citizens in the past.

    The cases of the nurse in Saudi Arabia and the Au Pair in Massachusetts some years ago spring to mind.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I think the whole camp X ray is disgusting and a complete violation of human rights.

    I would imagine that the people in there are traumatised but possibly relieved at the thought that their case may now be dealt with more publicly and so there may be a chance for them to speak out, THEN perhaps the world will realise what a shitty thing camp X ray is!
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    i'm not entirely sure, although i am extremely sick of the u.s interfereing with everything. They need to understand that they don't own the world
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Illegal imprisonment for 2 years, torture, no access to a lawyer, military trials, judge, jury and even defence lawyers appointed by the US government, threat of death penalty... The spirit of fascism is alive and well and residing in the White House.

    No doubt that amongst others, the American soldiers who gave their lives in WWII to fight that kind of evil will be turning in their graves in utter disgust.

    Anyway Dan, there are some more thoughts by several posters about the issue in this thread.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    fair trial

    although I thing the whole human rights thing has gone overboard recently, this is a definate violation.
    A lot of this prisioners may be terrorists, but everyone has the right to a fair, unbiased trial, lawyers etc.
    Jack Straw has been putting "pressure" on America apparently because the brits + the death penalty but I don't think that will amount to much.

    Does anyone know where all the suspects were "arrested"?
    Was it in America or were they picked up from all parts of the globe? If so surely one nation can't just go around picking up whoever it choses and throwing them in jail?
    Shouldn't this be a job for the UN?
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    sorry I'm new, didn't realise this topic was already posted!
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I'd like to see them dead if they are guilty of going to Afghanistan with the intent of killing American soliders. Especially, if they went there after the 9/11 murders. If they went there before 9/11 to train or something...then they are just screwed up people who don't deserve the death penalty.

    In either case, I'm glad they are where they are. A trial could force the US government to reveal sources etc. which could hinder our on-going fight with Al Qaeda and put Muslims who are helping us at risk.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by pnjsurferpoet
    I'd like to see them dead if they are guilty of going to Afghanistan with the intent of killing American soliders. Especially, if they went there after the 9/11 murders. If they went there before 9/11 to train or something...then they are just screwed up people who don't deserve the death penalty.

    In either case, I'm glad they are where they are. A trial could force the US government to reveal sources etc. which could hinder our on-going fight with Al Qaeda and put Muslims who are helping us at risk.

    and if they arent guilty, meh, whats a couple (thousand) deaths gonna matter, after all, america has god on its side
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Perhaps the delicate irony that American soldiers might be seen by most people everywhere as illegal combatants waging illegal wars of invasion and conquest (and therefore fair game under the US' own terms) has escaped you pnj.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Why do think Bush and co strongarmed the UN for yet another year of exemption for the the "rule of law"?

    So they can commit whatever heinous act of militancy they wish with impunity, that's why.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I don't care about people who don't care about the safety of innocent American citizens going about their lives in America. The reason for the death sentence in this case would be to prevent people this hateful and brain-washed from getting out to attempt murder against Americans again.

    To me, they also represent the garbage the UK has let in in the last few decades. They are worthless to anyone except other hateful, Muslim radicals.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    stop screwing over muslims and they will stop attacking you.

    you push someone hard enough, and eventually they will push you back. hence 9/11, although im not condoning the attacks.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    stop screwing over muslims and they will stop attacking you.

    Wrong. Arabs select the strongest horse. Saudi Arabia is kicking Muslim clerics out of the mosques who preach hatred of America and the West. That action marks the beginning of the end to groups like Al Qaeda.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Keep living in your fantasy world little boy. Continued militancy will only fan the flames of hatred and invite even greater numbers of terrorists.

    Perhaps when you grow up and realise that our foreign policy wrongdoings are what put us in this crisis in the first place youll realise just how little of what youve been programmed to believe matches with reality outside your cozy beachfront wonderland.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    PNJ...don't use the word Brainwashed lightly!
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I don't. And my fantasy hope is that there will be a free Palestine that Arabs and Jews respect and feel is fair and all of this senseless death will end. But until that happens, we must be protected against people who feel killing us will get them to their version of heaven.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Just like Bush then, who by killing tens of thousands of Afghans and Iraqis hopes to get into his version of heaven.

    You know, at least the Al Qaida terrorists don't go about saying "God talked to me and asked me to do it."
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I really can't wait for the day when the US is brought before the hague for war crimes. I support the idea of the EU, if only to make a superpower that can truly rival the US. Maybe we should admit Russia, Asia and the Middle East. :D
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    the hague for war crime

    Never happen. Belguim was going to try Blair and Bush and the US simply said: try that and we'll pull NATO's headquarters out of Belguim. Belguim backed down that day.

    The EU has economies of little or no growth. In fact, France's will probably contract for the second year in a row. The UK should avoid getting more involved with the EU.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Oh it will happen one day pnj. When we're rid of this irresponsible administration and get one which respects International Law and the accountability of nations.

    The threat of removing NATO was a laugh boy. Bush could no more do that than he can hope to win the war on terror through continual warfare.

    And youd best pay attention to our own economy, its in dire straights as well with ever increasing job losses and a spiraling budget deficit (largely being funnelled back into certain admin pockets via the MIC contracts). Your future is being sold away right under your nose while you mouth idotic uneducated nonsense about Europe.

    We are not above the law nor above accountability for international crimes committed by our leaders simply because we are Americans, to believe that simply demonstrates how little you truly do care about global peace and security and the rule of law yourself.

    Your dad must truly be shamed to call you his son. I pity him!
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Nah. He understands how 9/11 changed things. He just grabs the flag when we go to put it out to proof you can be liberal and an America.


    As if.:rolleyes:
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    9/11 changed nothing except the public's willingness to scrutinise the criminal an unconstitutional actions of the administration. The trauma which Washington has been manipulating and riding high on will wear off and when it does, the public will see just how extensively it has been betrayed by this admin and those around them.

    Then you can bet that investigations will ensue and heads will roll.

    And all those who defended these scumbags will bear the shame for their unquestioning gullibility while those of us who maintained the outcry for scrutiny will be thoroughly vindicated.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Then you can bet that investigations will ensue and heads will roll.

    That's happening with the Democrats in Congress and those running for the Presidency in 2004.

    Hope I don't give you a headache. I'm sooo not worth it.:crazyeyes

    "I'm not here on business baby...I'm here to have some fun."
    Bruce Springsteen. (dad's music:rolleyes: ) No. I like him 2.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Hey pnj, do you have one of these outside your house? :D
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Going back to Camp X-Ray and the death penalty ...

    If the death penalty is contrary to the European Covention on Human Rights (whatever protocol), and if that means that it is unlawful for a signatory to that protocol to extradite anyone to a country where they might face the death penalty (as is clear from the jurisprudence of the ECtHR and the practice of the UK in extraditing alleged murderers to the US) ... then isn't it equally unlawful for the aftermath of a joint US-UK military operation to result in the execution of those captured during it (especially citizens of countries which are signed up to the ECHR).

    The UK army was involved in the operation which led to these people being captured (I can't remember/don't know to what extent ... but were any of the people in Camp X-Ray actually captured by British troops and handed over to the custody of the Americans??) Since the UK army is controlled, in the end, by the UK government, surely it's unlawful for the UK army to do anything to violate the right to life in Article 2 (?) of the ECHR and the protocols attached?

    Time for another trip to the High Court to try to get some judge somewhere in the world to try to exert some judicial control over the Americans?

    Or is my logic flawed somewhere? Do point it out if it is!!
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by pnjsurferpoet
    I don't. And my fantasy hope is that there will be a free Palestine that Arabs and Jews respect and feel is fair and all of this senseless death will end. But until that happens, we must be protected against people who feel killing us will get them to their version of heaven.

    Is it just me, or did pissinthepot just manage to contradict himself in one paragraph?
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by duffy_2k
    Is it just me, or did pissinthepot just manage to contradict himself in one paragraph?

    Nope, not just you.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by RiSe & ShInE
    Nope, not just you.

    Is he normally like this? :eek2:
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by duffy_2k
    Is he normally like this? :eek2:


    I sure as hell hope not.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by duffy_2k
    Is he normally like this? :eek2:

    'fraid so.
Sign In or Register to comment.