If you need urgent support, call 999 or go to your nearest A&E. To contact our Crisis Messenger (open 24/7) text THEMIX to 85258.
Read the community guidelines before posting ✨
Options
Invitation to the Politics & Debate section of the site
BillieTheBot
Posts: 8,721 Bot
in General Chat
I know a lot of people don't go anywhere near the politics and debate part of thesite very often. Many people dont go anywhere near it at all.
However if you like a bit of a good discussion and/or have a vague interest in politics and good old fashioned discussion, then have a look in. Even if you have little interest in politics, you might end up learning something.
Have a pop in, you dont have to post, just do what I do a lot of and lurk and learn if you want to, however I do think its about time we had a bit more of an influx of the regulars (and the newer people here).
Come on, me and Stargalaxy promise not to bite (and to be honest, SG threads tend to get some of the better debate on there too).
Such things as opinions on the war in Afghanistan, theres a few thousands members on here, and a few hundred regular users, and yet less than 25 people have voted on this thread Afghanistan Discussion. Have a look and a read through some of the stuff on there and see what you think.
I partially thought of this thread to try and inject some more use into that Afghan thread, but also as a wider point of trying to get more people involved in this often under appreciated/used part of thesite boards.
However if you like a bit of a good discussion and/or have a vague interest in politics and good old fashioned discussion, then have a look in. Even if you have little interest in politics, you might end up learning something.
Have a pop in, you dont have to post, just do what I do a lot of and lurk and learn if you want to, however I do think its about time we had a bit more of an influx of the regulars (and the newer people here).
Come on, me and Stargalaxy promise not to bite (and to be honest, SG threads tend to get some of the better debate on there too).
Such things as opinions on the war in Afghanistan, theres a few thousands members on here, and a few hundred regular users, and yet less than 25 people have voted on this thread Afghanistan Discussion. Have a look and a read through some of the stuff on there and see what you think.
I partially thought of this thread to try and inject some more use into that Afghan thread, but also as a wider point of trying to get more people involved in this often under appreciated/used part of thesite boards.
Beep boop. I'm a bot.
0
Comments
In all seriousness though, I do read quite a bit in the P&D section. I'm not a big debater though so don't tend to contribute...but I agree, you do learn a lot just from doing that and it's always entertaining to watch the occasional insult-slinging between the regulars
i lurk too
it gets too aggressive there. i dont like it. have posted before but found a few of the replies rude and quite hostile. i'd prefer posting there and contributing to a discussion and finding out people's opinions. the 'debate' side of that forum is offputting, i feel unwelcome there if i dont have a firm/passionate opinion that i want to find to the bloody death.
:yes: feel the same
yess i agree too
haha yes! oopsy
So true!
I wander in now and again if there's something I'm particularly interested in, or if I feel like upping my blood pressure, but most of the time it feels a lot like this: :banghead:
The main problem I have is that it is populated by a gang of regulars who all know each other well, know each other's views and positions and have clearly been arguing with each other for years, and I think they have a tendency to only read and respond to each other's posts.
Perhaps there is an unconscious mindset among the regulars in there that you have to prove your worth and intellect as a debater before anyone will engage with you. Or perhaps the regulars are just so wound up and preoccupied arguing with each other that they don't have the time and energy left to interact with newbies!
But that's the thing that puts me off contributing any more than the little I do. Sometimes I have posted something I think is an intelligent and valuable contribution to the debate, only for it to be completely ignored by everybody! It seems it would take a long time and a lot of commitment to be taken seriously in there, and I don't know if I can be arsed!
Are you Blagsta in disguise?
I think what happens a lot is that people'll read a post that they agree with and think "yeah, that's a cogent argument", but won't bother with a reply just to say "agree" or "good post". It's certainly something I'm guilty off.
This forum, much like blogs, needs differing views in order to work properly. There are a fair few people on this board who think I'm a "waffling cocktrumpet", as I was called in one very flattering PM recently. Fair enough - as long as people also accept I'm entitled to believe they're a waffling cocktrumpet as well. As my signature shows, I get a fair amount of stick, something I'm fairly proud of. I must be doing something right.
I can't speak on behalf of everyone, but I'm ready to read views that don't correspond with my own. I've shown on countless occasions I'm prepared to go against the consensus on threads - some occasions it's worked, others it hasn't. Such is life, it does me no harm. Perhaps what P&D needs is to be extended to cover more areas. Not every debate needs to be about politics, and I reckon there's more than enough room for funnies in there as well. I try to stick some in there occasionally, with varying levels of success.
As for the Geordie one, it's safe to say I don't especially like him. My views and his are almost entirely different from one another, but we seem to get on. I've also spoken before of how much I admire the fact he's in the military, showing a level of bravery far greater than I ever could. There are few people out there who genuinely have no redeeming features whatsoever. I adopt almost a tabloid tone when doing these things - it tends to provoke the criticism that I sound like a "Daily Mail switchboard". Yet in the very next sentence, these same people complain about my use of the C-word, something which the aforementioned daily doesn't especially like itself. Regardless, I do indeed get some of the better debates going, and I intend to continue doing that...
Responding to some stuff more directly:
@ clementine_the_tangerine: You claim to have posted before and found a few of the replies rude and quite hostile. Unfortunately, I must admit I have been one of those people who has given you a hard time there. I see it as the hustle and bustle of politics myself, but that's clearly not a majority view. If you feel you can't post in P&D because of the likes of me, I can only apologise.
@ Indrid Cold: Something I've been accused of myself is that I won't change my opinion, no matter what facts present themselves to me. Not true - ask I'm With Stupid for confirmation of the following, if you don't believe me. I used to support the death penalty. After reading some comments of his, I changed my mind a short time later. I'm now against it, but probably not for the reasons he'd like, I admit!
@ Jamelia: I certainly don't think I could be accused of ignoring your views. You've responded to me many a time, and indeed, I'm grateful for all the contributions you've inadvertently made to my signature in the last few months.
All I really mean is that there is a group of big P&D players who have clearly been around a long time and have history, and like to argue back and forth, and sometimes they are so caught up in doing that that they don't respond to the contributions of newer people as much as they could do. So it can be a bit dispiriting because you try to make a contribution, but it can easily go unnoticed.
Of course, there is also the issue that when new people venture in there and offer an opinion that may not be completely thought out or perfectly constructed, they can tend to get their heads bitten off by the more vociferous and articulate members. I don't mind that too much, as I'm pretty thick skinned and resilient, and besides, I'm pretty good at expressing myself. But I can see why it makes that forum a pretty intimidating and unpleasant place for less confident posters.
I always imagine it as walking into a pub and all the locals staring at you and it going completely silent because your new and have never been in before.
You're probably right. In order to cope with it you need to be resilient and thick skinned and not take it personally when people disagree vociferously with you and tell you all the reasons why your tentatively ventured opinion is completely and utterly wrong, and what's more, has diabolical implications that you hadn't even considered.
Being able to do that is partly about having confidence in your own intelligence and convictions, and partly comes with practice. Something I see quite often in the teaching work I do is that certain people are unable to separate the idea that someone is criticising their argument or their position, from the idea that that person might be criticising them as a person. So then when someone tells them that they think they are wrong, they take it as a personal slight and get upset and defensive.
I think the people who cope well in P&D are the ones who aren't like this, so can handle being told on a daily basis that they are just plain wrong about everything, without thinking it means they're being called stupid. But that does require quite a lot of self-confidence. Age probably helps, too.
(None of this is aimed at you by the way Clementine - I'm not saying you take things too personally!)
Don't let having a half-baked opinion stop you voicing it in P&D, I never do! I find it's often the best way to test it out. For instance, I'm finding that I've got less and less time for overly-liberal, hippy piffle, and P&D is a great place to test whether or not my misgivings are properly grounded - there's a largely liberal bias, if you hadn't noticed.
You aren't poop at debating.
You are totally right that this should be the place to develop your own views and that there should be more inquisitiveness and tentativeness - it's a pity it doesn't always work out like that.
But you definitely shouldn't let that scare you away. Since that is what it needs and that is what you bring, you should be in there contributing and bringing your own modest and tentative style. If anything, it's one less angry and aggressive voice which is a much needed counterpart to the dominant mode in there.
The secret I think is not to be too personally wedded to your views, or too determined never to retreat or to back down. As soon as you're prepared to admit "actually, I'm not sure I have got any evidence for that claim, it's just a gut feeling I had, I'm still trying to decide what I think about this" or whatever, then a lot of other people's aggression and hostility is defused. The people who come in for a hard time are the ones who when pressed to defend their claims, cling to them for dear life even though it's clear they can't defend them.
But from what I've seen of you, you aren't like that, and you're an excellent and thoughtful debater. So you should be more confident
Right, bedtime I think, night all.
Yeah, Jamelia's posts generally make me want to make out with her. Of course you won't normally find me admitting that in P&D.
Heh, in P&D I am too full of overly liberal hippy piffle for you to ever think such a thing :razz:
But what a delicious thought for me to ponder as I drift off to sleep, making out with the Captain.
Right back atcha lovely lady - totally one of my fave peeps here!
What a love in, this is just getting embarrassing - now I'm definitely going to bed!