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Private schooling?

Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
I've been wondering...is it fair that some kids can get a better education because their parents have money - thus usually getting a better education? And that the rest who can't afford it have to make do with usual schools?
Personally i think it isn't fair...especially after my best friend went to a private school and i had to go to a public school, which is over crowded and i feel i've been let down because i don't feel pushed enough. Whereas at private schools, they nearly always do better because there's less of them so they get more help.
Just a thought...
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Comments

  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Is it fair some people are richer than others?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    bongbudda wrote:
    Is it fair some people are richer than others?

    Yes - there will always be rifts between classes in society. There are people that are better off than others - there's not a lot one can do about it. Improve the public schools, perhaps. Everything needs money - the more money, the higher standard... It's always been like that, and it will probably always be.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Ballerina wrote:
    I've been wondering...is it fair?... Personally i think it isn't fair...

    Life isn't fair.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    It isn't fair in two ways. Firstly people who go to them are getting a 'better' education just because mummy and daddy have a bit of money. Secondly it seems a lot of privately schooled people have no idea what the real world is like from looking at some of that sort here at uni. They dont mix with others and stick to their own...
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Renzo wrote:
    It isn't fair in two ways. Firstly people who go to them are getting a 'better' education just because mummy and daddy have a bit of money. Secondly it seems a lot of privately schooled people have no idea what the real world is like from looking at some of that sort here at uni. They dont mix with others and stick to their own...

    Well I would contend that that is fair, as it's the trade off for the [highly debatable] "better schooling" they receive. I would say there are distinct disadvantages to private schooling and the skewed socialisation that often does not compute in the post-education, "real" world is one of those disadvantages.

    Something I do think is very unfair is catchment areas for good schools, that can cause real problems for a lot of people, but I digress. It comes down to, as Babyshambler said, the fact that life isn't fair. We all have certain attributes and are born with things that work in our favour and sometimes against us.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Renzo wrote:
    Secondly it seems a lot of privately schooled people have no idea what the real world is like from looking at some of that sort here at uni. They dont mix with others and stick to their own...

    :yes: There's a girl in our beauty class. She went to private school, and she can't interact with us. She struggles to to talk to us about anything at any rate. And when we do talk, she's amazed. She found it amazing that I have a job, and pay for my own stuff. And it's even like she can't interact with us pratting about - we played a mad made-up version of pictionary yesterday on the board, and she just watched in amazement as we all fell about laughing, since none of us stuck to the rules.... it's honestly as though she treats us as a different specimen.

    She also doesn't have the independence to work for herself. Like Ballerina said, at private school they have someone willing to push them, and dedicate their time to you. She's gone from that, to a college, where you're expected to work for yourself. She's not completed many of the practical treatments we HAVE to complete to complete the course, and blames it on the lecturers.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Renzo wrote:
    It isn't fair in two ways. Firstly people who go to them are getting a 'better' education just because mummy and daddy have a bit of money. Secondly it seems a lot of privately schooled people have no idea what the real world is like from looking at some of that sort here at uni. They dont mix with others and stick to their own...

    Says a fellow privileged ex grammar school boy from Bucks. :p It's easy to oppose private education when you have the chance to go to a top state school better than most private schools...

    I know of people in areas with bad state schools where their parents who are not rich have put themselves into significant financial difficulty to pay for private schools to give their children a good education. It's not fair that they cannot go to a decent state school surely...Lots of things about education aren't fair. It's not fair that in some parts of London you can go to a good state school if you're of a particular faith, etc.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    It's utter nonsense to suggest that going to a private school makes you socially retarded.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    single sex schools can affect your ability to socialise with the opposite sex sometimes though
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Renzo wrote:
    It isn't fair in two ways. Firstly people who go to them are getting a 'better' education just because mummy and daddy have a bit of money. Secondly it seems a lot of privately schooled people have no idea what the real world is like from looking at some of that sort here at uni. They dont mix with others and stick to their own...
    i went to a private school because the state schools in manchester are shit. thats not mine or my parents fault though. they just wanted to give me a better chance to get a good education.

    secondly. you go to exeter uni which is full of yadida tosspots.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Ballerina wrote:
    single sex schools can affect your ability to socialise with the opposite sex sometimes though
    how do you know that? i went to a single sexed school and i had male friends outside of school. just like everyone else.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    lipsy wrote:
    i went to a private school because the state schools in manchester are shit. thats not mine or my parents fault though. they just wanted to give me a better chance to get a good education.

    secondly. you go to exeter uni which is full of yadida tosspots.
    the schools in my area are overcrowded and don't deal with troublemakers....the best school round here is a catholic school which i was refused entry for...even though i applied in year 5!
    My parents could afford to send me to a private school but not my brother aswell. They didn't want people to think they were favouring me over my brother so i had to go to state school.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    lipsy wrote:
    how do you know that? i went to a single sexed school and i had male friends outside of school. just like everyone else.
    not all the time, but i've seen it happen - its usually when they don't have friends outside of school so obviously they don't have that interaction. Of course, everyone soon learns when they're in the real world, but during and just after leaving, it can have an effect.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I don't think there was any suggestion of social retardation. Just commentary that there are distinct advantages and disadvantages to private schooling just as there are with state schools. A private school is often going to be a far less organic environment, as certain stipulations [yes, largely financial] mean they have a far more selective intake and pupils are going to be socialising (within school hours, anyway) in groups that are more often than not not a sweeping cross-section of society's youth. That's all.

    I would never send my children to private school, as despite the possible educational benefits it goes against all my beliefs about education. But the idea works for other people, it's another of those diff'rent strokes kinda situations.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    If you can afford it then why not?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    If you can afford it then why not?

    Because education is about a lot more than just results.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    briggi wrote:
    I don't think there was any suggestion of social retardation. Just commentary that there are distinct advantages and disadvantages to private schooling just as there are with state schools. A private school is often going to be a far less organic environment, as certain stipulations [yes, largely financial] mean they have a far more selective intake and pupils are going to be socialising (within school hours, anyway) in groups that are more often than not not a sweeping cross-section of society's youth. That's all.
    I don't know what "less organic" means - maybe something to do with pesticide use? - but I don't agree with you if you are implying that the lack of a cross section makes those who go to a private school unable to interact with those who didn't - not just your suggestion but some other posts have asserted this.

    I know lots of privately educated people who are perfectly pleasant, balanced people. It seems only those who went to a state school and did well there who are anti private education.
    I would never send my children to private school, as despite the possible educational benefits it goes against all my beliefs about education. But the idea works for other people, it's another of those diff'rent strokes kinda situations.
    Everyone has your idealistic view at heart, but perhaps you will change your opinion when your child is getting ready for secondary school and the state schools in your area are poor. Everyone would like their children to go to the local school, but everyone wants their children to do well at school too.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    bongbudda wrote:
    Because education is about a lot more than just results.

    I didn't say it wasn't, if you can afford to put your child through a better education then why not? All parents want the best for their kids and if it means paying for it then fair play.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Kentish wrote:
    Everyone has your idealistic view at heart, but perhaps you will change your opinion when your child is getting ready for secondary school and the state schools in your area are poor. Everyone would like their children to go to the local school, but everyone wants their children to do well at school too.
    :yes: i don't even go to my local school, i go to one in the next town because my local one is very poor - my dad went there and he didn't want me to go through the same. My primary school was a good 20 minutes away aswell and we had to drive there every day because the other primary schools weren't very good. The nearest is only at the bottom of my road and i know had it been a better school, i would have gone.
    Had my parents been able to afford for both me and my brother to go private, we would have done but they were worried about what people might think - especially with my brother having mild aspergers syndrome. So you can't distinguish which one to send, the gifted one (sorry to sound arrogant but i've always been very able) or the one with slight learning difficulties?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I'm undecided.

    School is a good place to meet people different from yourself, people from other religions, cultures, rich, poor, whatever.

    I know a guy who went to private school and though he's a nice bloke, he's pretty thick and seems to have had everything handed to him on a plate.

    When it came to my own kids though, in the future if I can afford it, and the local school is crap, I would at least consider putting them in a private school.

    I know from personal experience that people do better in smaller classes. I had very small classes at A Level (not private, this was a normal college) and really appreciated the extra help and time teachers had.

    They can always meet other kids outside of school.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Kentish wrote:
    I don't know what "less organic" means - maybe something to do with pesticide use? - but I don't agree with you if you are implying that the lack of a cross section makes those who go to a private school unable to interact with those who didn't - not just your suggestion but some other posts have asserted this.

    I know lots of privately educated people who are perfectly pleasant, balanced people. It seems only those who went to a state school and did well there who are anti private education.

    Everyone has your idealistic view at heart, but perhaps you will change your opinion when your child is getting ready for secondary school and the state schools in your area are poor. Everyone would like their children to go to the local school, but everyone wants their children to do well at school too.

    I was using it in a more figurative sense, but then I think you knew that anyway. I'll be sure to stick to literal terms in the future.

    I'd like to clarify that I didn't say (and don't for one second think) that privately schooled people are unable to interact with those who were educated differently (or are indeed social retards); only that given the selective nature of private schools they are going to be exposed to a narrower cross-section of their peers during the time they are in attendance at school. You may think that's a point that's debatable but I would tend to think now. Therefore there's a chance they won't be on the same wavelength - at least educationally and possibly socially - as pupils of state schools; though that imaginary chasm between the two groups is most definitely created by both sides.

    I know lots of privately educated people who are perfectly pleasant, balanced people, too. It's great that there are so many of them about.

    I can assure you now that my opinion won't change, it's very little to do with my possible idealism and I'm well aware of the problems I may face putting my hypothetical children through the state school system. Anyway, I'm just repeating myself now... I don't even really have that much of an opinion of private schooling and am not anti-private schools at all other than they are not the way I will be educating any kids I may have.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Isn't the single sex argument an argument to do with that and irrelevant to private vs state schools. Some state schools are still single sex and there are plenty of private schools which are mixed.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I had the good fortune to grow up in one of the few counties which has kept its grammar schools, and I benefitted from a good state education. I'd rather my hypothetical children didn't end up at a 'bog standard' comprehensive because I don't think they are very good for bright students, although it does vary greatly. It does bemuse and amuse me slightly that we are allowed to make all sorts of assumptions about people who went to private school (well, their family finances anyway) yet wouldn't dream of making the same assumption about those whose parents invest their wealth in a large house or a fancy car or luxury holidays. The decision to spend one's disposable income on education elicits all sorts of stereotypes.

    ps briggi, you still haven't explained what you meant by "organic". :confused:
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I meant it in the sense that the range of pupils in a private school is constructed, to an extent, because of the criteria a potential pupil has to fulfill to be allowed to attend. As opposed to the natural, unaltered and organic range of pupils who are automatically accepted into their local state school [catchment areas aside].
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    briggi wrote:
    I meant it in the sense that the range of pupils in a private school is constructed, to an extent, because of the criteria a potential pupil has to fulfill to be allowed to attend. As opposed to the natural, unaltered and organic range of pupils who are automatically accepted into their local state school [catchment areas aside].
    why assume that all pupils at a private school are the same? at mine, there were pupils of all different religions, family backgrounds and towns. i think it was much more diverse than the local state school who all came from the same primary school and local area.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    lipsy wrote:
    why assume that all pupils at a private school are the same? at mine, there were pupils of all different religions, family backgrounds and towns. i think it was much more diverse than the local state school who all came from the same primary school and local area.

    I'm not assuming anything of the sort.

    I don't for one second think that pupils of private schools are like a regimented army of clones, but there is a [financial] construct in a private school which does filter some potential students out.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    briggi wrote:
    I'm not assuming anything of the sort.

    I don't for one second think that pupils of private schools are like a regimented army of clones, but there is a [financial] construct in a private school which does filter some potential students out.
    they do have an assissted places scheme though.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    lipsy wrote:
    they do have an assissted places scheme though.
    scholarship?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    lipsy wrote:
    they do have an assissted places scheme though.

    Yeah that's true, you do have a point. I would hazard a guess that it's pretty competitive though, which is another thing I have reservations about [competing to get into a school].

    Do many/any private schools still have entrance exams?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    briggi wrote:
    Yeah that's true, you do have a point. I would hazard a guess that it's pretty competitive though, which is another thing I have reservations about [competing to get into a school].

    Do many/any private schools still have entrance exams?
    it sounds like a scholarship....when you have to take an exam and pass with flying colours
    these do annoy me abit because they only want those pupils to make their results look better
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