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Government preparing to massacre the railway network

MixBotMixBot Posts: 8,656 Automated Account
In an 83-page "consultation" document, the Department for Transport is hell-bent on devising a way of cutting huge swathes out of the railway network, replacing train services on many mostly Northern rural lines with a bus service instead.

The only thing that will decide the fate of a railway line is whether it makes money. Forget lines such as that to Whitby or rural Northumberland, which could never make a significant profit, if one at all. Forget the people reliant on the train service. Forget the gridlock that is endemic in most cities now.

Story.

And people trust these cretins to run a train service?

London will be fine, but as these rural areas don't have many people, there isn't many votes to lose. Yet again, a stab in the back for those in rural areas, who will be forced onto the roads and then charged an absolute fortune for not using "viable" public transport alternatives.

And people try and claim there's no need for a car in a city centre anymore. There will be if there's no bloody train service.
Beep boop. I'm a bot.
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Comments

  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Oh for fuck's sake.

    Why the hell does this fucking country have to be so backward?

    But they're still looking at spending £15bn to build another railway in London.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    The politicians are only serving the behest of the corporates who are the ones in control of what is or isnt viable in public transport (based on THEIR bottom line, not the public's) and a myriad of other areas of life so many take for granted.

    Of course the politicos will face the public indictments (as above) whilst those who should really be pulled down and have their empires broken up and redistributed back to the communities from whom they extort their riches will sail right on by to their next strategy meeting.

    Focus on the puppet masters and the puppets will fall in their turn.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I hate buses the train is so much more comfortable and cheaper :/
  • JsTJsT TheSite Graduate Posts: 18,265 Incredible Poster
    Its no suprise. Public transport - fucked if you use it, fucked if you dont.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    JsT wrote:
    Its no suprise. Public transport - fucked if you use it, fucked if you dont.

    Well, exactly. In the US their public transport is shite, but petrol (and cars) are affordable.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    So, business as usual for the Government then! Remember when they said privatisation and competition would force prices down? lol.gif
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Cain wrote:
    So, business as usual for the Government then!

    Yeah..well, they're a bunch of cunts that only care about London.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    bad seed wrote:
    Yeah..well, they're a bunch of cunts that only care about London.

    There's a country outside London?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Cain wrote:
    There's a country outside London?

    So I've heard. Couple of degrees cooler, too.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Damn it. I use the train every week to go Leicester to Liverpool, I think I'll be safe as its on the 'mainline' but sometimes I have to make changes at stations so backwater they could have filmed Deliverence there.

    Way to go Government.
  • Teh_GerbilTeh_Gerbil Stalin's Organist Posts: 13,327
    For fucks sake.

    Typical New Labour. Can we all PLEASE vote these cunts out next time?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Teh_Gerbil wrote:
    For fucks sake.

    Typical New Labour. Can we all PLEASE vote these cunts out next time?
    Problem is, who do you vote in?

    The Tories are not exactly friends of public transport- in fact they've done far more damage to the railways than Labour.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    Problem is, who do you vote in?

    The Tories are not exactly friends of public transport- in fact they've done far more damage to the railways than Labour.

    True that. Having a publicly funded system is against the Free Market(tm) and the Tories are all for privatisation in virtually every sector.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Kermit wrote:
    London will be fine, but as these rural areas don't have many people, there aren't many votes to lose. Yet again, a stab in the back for those in rural areas, who will be forced onto the roads and then charged an absolute fortune for not using "viable" public transport alternatives.
    I agree with you, Kermit. I don't know what's going on at the moment. John Prescott, when not pulling a muscle in a publicity stunt, is trying to put a plan through that is, in effect, "demolish the north, concrete the south". I suspect this is merely an extension of that.

    People often wonder why I'm leaving Wales and going into the city. "You live in such a beautiful area, why would you want to leave?", one daydreamer asked recently. Well, this is precisely one reason why. Better transport links, better job prospects, and such make it an enticing prospect.

    You can be cheerful though that, as the North of England are Labour heartlands, that Labour MPs will fight this. Oh wait, I forgot what a bunch of complacent, lazy bastards Labour MPs are.

    Maybe David Cameron will fight this, with his brand of conservative liberal democratism. Oh wait, he doesn't do "-isms", does he? And he lives in a swanky Notting Hill house. No luck there. As for the LibDems, they're all too busy coming out as homosexuals to remember there's a country going down the toilet thanks to this dreadful government.

    Tip to everyone - move south before Northern England is wiped off the map by a government that has no understanding of the countryside and rural areas.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    You know, who is in the current the Conservative Shadow cabinet are not the same as the people who were in power prior to labour. Parties change their ways when they change their personel. If they didnt we would have strikes and unions all over the place the moment labour came back to power.

    Also, i fucking hate trains!
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Problem is, who do you vote in?

    Voting isn't a solution, it's the fucking problem.

    People who routinely steal your money, order you about like you were children or animals, send your children off to some godforsaken rock to get shot at by strangers don't have your best interests at heart. :rolleyes:

    Frankly I am shocked. Who would think that a bunch of thieves and killers would run things for themselves and their friends benefit and shit on those too stupid to work out what's going on?
  • Teh_GerbilTeh_Gerbil Stalin's Organist Posts: 13,327
    Problem is, who do you vote in?

    http://www.wrp.org.uk/ :D
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Teh_Gerbil wrote:
    I'm not voting for a bunch of mad left-wingers! :p
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    Problem is, who do you vote in?
    How do the Green Party feel about trains?
  • Teh_GerbilTeh_Gerbil Stalin's Organist Posts: 13,327
    How do the Green Party feel about trains?

    Horse and Cart tbh. Evironment!1!!!

    Although, its here, on thier site tbh.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Well they see that this proposal is a bad idea, at least.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    The Tories are not exactly friends of public transport- in fact they've done far more damage to the railways than Labour.

    We've been through this before.

    Dr Beeching's report was commissioned and executed by a Labour government. Not a Conservative one. THis report has been commissioned by a Labour government, with the intention of being the government to execute the cuts.

    All the major cuts? All done by Labour. Don't forget that folks.

    Public transport is bollocks anyway. If I could afford to park outside work on the street I fucking paid for, then I would. 45 minutes of listening to some braindead toddler singing "wheels on the bus" should be a defence to murdering the said moronic spawn of idiots.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    If anyone thought public transport was bollocks Kermit and if they could park outside their work as you wish it was the case, then everyone would, and you would have such a hellish journey every day you would soon think trains were the best thing since sliced bread.

    And yes, we've been trough this before. It was the Tories who hurried off to privatise the railways and break them up into countless different divisions run by countless different companies. The rest is history-though Labour should definitely shoulder much of the blame for not having the balls, as it had promised, to renationalise the railways when it got into power, and for making an even bigger mess of the one the Tories had created.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Damn it. I use the train every week to go Leicester to Liverpool, I think I'll be safe as its on the 'mainline' but sometimes I have to make changes at stations so backwater they could have filmed Deliverence there.

    Way to go Government.
    Brief Encounter was filmed in carnforth station. :D
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    If anyone thought public transport was bollocks Kermit and if they could park outside their work as you wish it was the case, then everyone would, and you would have such a hellish journey every day you would soon think trains were the best thing since sliced bread.

    Doubt it.

    At least I don't have to put up with fat twats with BO problems, and moronic toddlers, in my car. I do have to put up with trucks, but as part of my masterplan I would put goods on the rails- which is what the railway was designed for- in order to get rid of the trucks.
    And yes, we've been trough this before. It was the Tories who hurried off to privatise the railways and break them up into countless different divisions run by countless different companies.

    Yep.

    And outside of the Smog, the railways are infinitely better for it.

    Remember who's shafting the rural north. It isn't the private company, is it? As has been said countless times before, the private companies have increased train services, increased the quality of stock, and decreased prices for many travellers (I don't recall being able to get to Oxford for £25 under BR, folks). It's the Government that's shafting it. Just as it was with Beeching. And it's strange how the Government in both cases wore a red rosette, isn't it?

    The railways were at their best in the 1930s. The railways then were private.

    And people actually want a Government to run the train service? It defies all logic.

    Still, at least the Londoners can rest assured they won't suffer. Indeed the leader of some campaign group or other for London railways is delighted at the news, saying that London will be all the better for all those scuffy Northerners losing their trains. So that's good, I suppose.

    The Government looks after nobody that doesn't live in London or Scotland. And that's why I wouldn't trust a Government to run a bath, let alone a train service with any competence. They had fifty years to get it right, and the private TOCs are already way beyond the level of service BR provided.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Perhaps some people still want the government (or rather, a government) to run the railways because in every other country in the world, government-owned railways piss all over private ones.

    So if it can be achieved elsewhere why not here?

    What's the difference I hear say? Well for starters public-owned railways don't put profit before people. And you don't get trains derailing and killing and injuring dozens because some fat bastard in a boardroom decides he'd rather put manteneance work on ice so his company's profits sit nicely in the bank earning interest.

    And for seconds prices are bound to be cheaper.

    It made me laugh out loud just now (so much so that I gave my cat a start) when I read your comments about prices coming down. Since privatisation prices have gone up at a speed that would beat the Space Shuttle into space. This year the Association of Thieves Operating Companies have really exceeded itself:

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4509956.stm

    And of course there was the recent story of someone trying to buy a ticket to Glasgow and finding 45 different tariffs- the most expansive of which being enough to fly you to America.

    And of course don't mention the subsidies to train companies, which in 9 out of 10 cases don't pay a penny back of. We're being screwed every which way.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    Perhaps some people still want the government (or rather, a government) to run the railways because in every other country in the world, government-owned railways piss all over private ones.

    They do?

    Which ones? SNCF, for instance, are shit.

    And some of Germany's suburban system is now private, I believe. But because it's Germany its still good.
    What's the difference I hear say? Well for starters public-owned railways don't put profit before people.

    They did, and they would.

    Because there's always a budget, and it always needs to be prioritised.

    British Rail lied enough times. Have you still not read about Ribblehead Viaduct?
    And for seconds prices are bound to be cheaper.

    Are they really?

    Is that why for off-peak advance journeys, fares are actually significantly cheaper?

    Sure, London commuters pay a bit more. But they should. Same principle as congestion charging.
    And of course don't mention the subsidies to train companies, which in 9 out of 10 cases don't pay a penny back of. We're being screwed every which way.

    What the hell have subsidies got to do with anything?

    Did the rural railways pay for themselves before privatisation or something?

    Most of the subsidy increases are due to the ROSCOs- which is a privatisation point I will grant you.

    To say the railways will suddenly be good if the Government runs them is preposterous. They have never been good in this country, for two reasons:
    The Government only gives a fuck about London.
    The RMT and ASLEF are skiving thieving vermin who only give a fuck about their bank balances.

    Germany and Japan have good systems because those countries are good at running things. Private or public, their systems work.

    In this country it will never work, because this country is ruled by a cabal of trade unionists, champagne socialists and business leaders who all have the same objective at heart: fuck the country, and fill your boots. The RMT and First are exactly the same.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Kermit wrote:
    They do?

    Which ones? SNCF, for instance, are shit.

    And some of Germany's suburban system is now private, I believe. But because it's Germany its still good.
    SNFC have the largest network of high speed trains- and the fastest speed trains in the world at that. The trains run on time too, and travel is cheaper than in the UK. What makes you say their trains are shit? :confused:

    You and me obviously have a rather different concept of the meaning of "good".

    Germany, again, nice network of real high speed trains, and no horror stories of bad delays, ancient rolling stock, and appallingly bad railtracks. There is in fact a funny story about the Germans building some trains for Britain, and having to make a specially-built section of track recreating average British conditions, because there wasn't a single test track in the entire nation- not even in East Germany- that was nearly as bad as the average railtracks here.

    Even Spain- a considerably poorer country, has a network of trains that pisses all over Britain's- and from next year the fastest high speed trains ever designed.

    Yep. Whichever way I look at it, I see state-owned railways being better than most private networks.


    They did, and they would.

    Because there's always a budget, and it always needs to be prioritised.
    Oh please! BR never put essential repairs on hold to maximise profits.

    There was no concept of "profits" or "shareholders" in BR.

    BR checked the tracks every night, by their own staff, as opposed to Railtrack which did it once every few days and subcontracted to death.
    Are they really?

    Is that why for off-peak advance journeys, fares are actually significantly cheaper?
    Er... read the link. Fares go up, up, up, up.

    Also read a few back issues of Private Eye. You will discover that private companies have ditched numerous off-peak tariffs and restricted the number of seats available. So even if a few seats have gone slightly done, in the overall majority tickets have gone up- way way up- under private companies.

    Perish the thought you might ever have to travel between Manchester and London on the sudden and buy a ticket for travel the following day at normal business hours. Because you'd need to find an incredible £200 for the privilege.

    Sure, London commuters pay a bit more. But they should. Same principle as congestion charging.


    What the hell have subsidies got to do with anything?
    They are yet another reason why privatisation is not only bad, but cost the taxpayers shit loads of money- money that goes straight into the pockets of shareholders.
    Did the rural railways pay for themselves before privatisation or something?

    Most of the subsidy increases are due to the ROSCOs- which is a privatisation point I will grant you.

    To say the railways will suddenly be good if the Government runs them is preposterous. They have never been good in this country, for two reasons:
    The Government only gives a fuck about London.
    The RMT and ASLEF are skiving thieving vermin who only give a fuck about their bank balances.

    Germany and Japan have good systems because those countries are good at running things. Private or public, their systems work.

    In this country it will never work, because this country is ruled by a cabal of trade unionists, champagne socialists and business leaders who all have the same objective at heart: fuck the country, and fill your boots. The RMT and First are exactly the same.
    Even if that was true I'd would still have them over fat cat bastards and faceless shareholders who probably have never even been on a train- let alone knowing anything about them- and who haven't even got any regard for passengers safety if it means it's going to eat into their precious profits.
  • JsTJsT TheSite Graduate Posts: 18,265 Incredible Poster
    French trains are good on the mainline. Try stepping away from the major cities and a big town will often only get one train a day, and if this is a good quality train then my name is Adolf Hitler.
    french%20train.jpg
    Compared to this the UK's railways look outstanding.
  • Teh_GerbilTeh_Gerbil Stalin's Organist Posts: 13,327
    This, sir, is a train!
    CentralStation_train.jpg
    RAAAH!

    It isn't the "newness" of trains I care about - it is efficency of service. And I have found in Europe, they are pretty good.
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