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No, because you're ignoring market forces. The farmer can't sell for that because noone will buy it. Microsoft, however, can sell their OS for a few hundred because people will buy it. Admittedly, it'll probably be businesses and system developers, but this is their core market anyway.
Boo Hoo. Actually you could, because you wouldn't have to have "ultimate" edition, or whatever it's called. You could get a cheaper edition. Your problem is that you can't be arsed paying for the OS at all. You're using ridiculous extreme arguments to justify a fairly indefensible position that you just want the OS for free.
It isn't force at all, because you don't have to buy the expensive version. Just like you don't have to have a Porsche in order to be able to drive.
So end it all. Or move to a different country, where you agree more with their laws.
Tough. Want to run the newer versions of games or programs, then pay for the latest OS. Don't want to pay? Move to something else.
I can see no valid argument for pirating an OS. It isn't like you need it to breathe, or eat. You choose to have a computer, you choose which OS you use. There is no genuine reason why you NEED to use a pirated copy of Vista - Win2k and WinXP should do pretty much everything you're likely to need.
Want != Need
Desire != Dependency
Grow up.
As for the XP + Vista for £75 dealie, spoke to someone and it is legitimate. You have to buy hardware with it though. I'm just double checking right now though
But it might be nice to have MCE for a few months.
All for just £75.
I have two genuine versions of XP.
You see no valid argument for pirating an OS? Well, you are obviously blind. How about... once I've bought it once, I shouldn't have to pay again, but with XP I was forced to. As for Vista, I fail to see why I should pay that much. MS has a huge profit margin. It is gigantic. They could release it at a reasonable price and - shock horror - maybe the high up executive could just cut thier wage a little. Say, from 10 million to 5 million? Or is that a proposterous thing to ask?
Grow up? Fuck off.
Eh? Care to explain that?
Or perhaps you think that we should be entitled to free everything, forever, once we have bought one of those things?
Why should I pay for clothes? I bought some trousers when I was 5, all the rest of my trousers should be free.
Why should I buy a new car? I bought this car from you just a few years ago, you should give me a new one for free, because it's better than my old one.
There's that forced word again, that noone is actually doing to you.
They've evaluated the market and released it at what they consider to be a suitable price point. As Shyboy has spoken about, it's available for cheaper.
Did Microsoft put a gun to your head and make you hand over the money? Or did you choose to give your cash to them because:-
A. You couldn't find your installation media, or product code?
B. You upgraded your hardware and could no longer activate it online?
If it was the latter, you should have pursued the matter with Microsoft. If it was the first, then you should have looked harder.
Because that is what they charge. You want it? Pay them for their product.
Yeah, Microsoft make a lot of money. They also spend a lot of time producing their software - why should you get it for free? A PS3 is a lot of money. A Lamborghini is a lot of money. Should you be entitled to those for free? Or should they give you a new PS3 because you have an original PlayStation? Or should you have a Murcielago because you bought an old Jalpa back in 1983?
You don't have to fund their money-making machine. You choose to use their products - they are NOT a necessity unless you CHOOSE them to be. And if you choose to use them, then you should pay for them.
I like to use my motorbike. I already own it, along with my leathers, helmet, and everything else I need. Should I stop paying for fuel, insurance and road tax just because I've already used it once? Or should I continue to pay the ongoing costs for the product I use?
If I want a new motorbike, should I just go out and steal one? They are hugely overpriced, after all. There can only be a few hundred quids worth of plastic, metal and rubber. How can they justify the £7k it costs for a FireBlade? As I already own a motorbike, why can't I have a new one for free?
Oooh... can't fight your argument sensibly, so you have to request my departure from this thread and use profanities at the same time. Not the actions of a sensible adult, are they?
He has a point if you think about it.
If you have three computers, say a basic desktop machine, a media centre machine and a notebook, you need three seperate licences for each machine, even though you can only possibly be using one at each time (well, unless you like multitasking, but thats not the point).
I think licences should be given out on a per-person basis rather than a per-computer. Then again, a family wouldn't want to buy 5 licences for mum dad and the three kids.
Mind you, in the 'olden days' if I bought a game I would happily let my brother play it. These days he'll need to buy his own copy because they're restricted to a single person (world of warcraft, battlefield series, half life / counter strike / DoD).
*shrug*
I told Scan about the guy offering to give me it for £75 and then said that yea, they could send me the OEM version, but the problem is when I send it off to Microsoft I need a 'PC number' that was assembled by them, and if I don't have it Microsoft might not honour it.
So for the time being, I'm just going to wait, they're bringing out an academic upgrade anyway. I wonder... if I have a licence registered to an old broken notebook how much hassle would it be to use that licence, to upgrade my new computer, bearing in mind the licence is no longer active on the notebook.
This thread has gone quite off topic
You started the insults mate, with grow up. "Fuck off" means I can't be bothered with your little insult games, although you continue above.
Insulting someone is hardly the actions of a grown adult trying to have a debate is it? I fail to see Blair or Cameron saying to the other "I dislike your NHS policy, and you smell like a mouldy shoe!"
XP - Various issues - hardware, failiure of SP2 to work at all, one of our keys managed to disapeer (good job we had one). I downloaded XP SP2 integrated nad used my original key. And OMG, it worked. I have used MS customer support before, and found them to be... well, on occasion helpful, on occasion just decided to be absolutley useless, namely with Win 98 and 2k issues. Thier game support is cracking though, I must say.
As has been pointed out before, stealing a physical object like a bike or petrol is actually rather different from piracy. In a big way. If you cna be bothered, look up those threads. I agree, they cannot justify the prices, and it should be different. Unfortunatley capitalism dictates it is ok to exploit like this.
Mist, kindly don't remove a comment from context. Even CTSM didn't do that with the XP comment. It was referring to once I have XP, I shouldn't need to buy it again. I didn't say "I have XP therefore Vista should be free."
Yes, Vista is availible cheaper.
I am not trying to say that Piracy is OK - I do intend once in am onetary situation where it is possible to buy everything I want to do so - I have stated this before. However, for now, that isn't so easy. It is just my view that, because of my cash situation, I shouldn't suffer disadvantages. Especially when things are priced with gigantic unessary profit margins that are not justifiable. Why can MS do this? Market Dominance. Alternatives for what I want to do are NOT availible. I daresay after Vista has been out a while, people will stop supporting XP like happened with 98 and 2k. However, by then, I should be able to afford it - 2 years I reackon? As such, hopefully, this argument will not happen again.
If I do see a Borg-esque version on torrent however, I shall get it ASAP, regardless of owning genuine. Because XP Borg was simply ace.
The idea of getting a free PS3 is nice. Although I don't buy consoles due to the stupid markup of console games which makes them an entire rip off. Long live emulation! Sony/Nintendo whoever still get my profits from the game, but I don't need a console!
Please tell me, the uneducated mind, what disadvantages are you suffering? I, personally, don't see any - you have a roof over your head, you have clean water, you have a warm house, hell you even have a computer that plays all the latest games on it.
I absolutely detest that argument that you are suffering. You don't have a clue. Just because you cannot afford the latest gear you feel you are at a disadvantage. Unfortunately, I do agree with the CTSM argument of 'grow up' here as you are sounding extremely like a spoilt little brat with your 'suffering disadvantages' argument. If you don't have the money to buy it ligitametly, then why should you buy it? You are stealing what isn't yours.
It wasn't an insult. It was a request and an observation at the same time - you're acting like a deluded little 5 year old child, and it's impossible to reason with.
So software is not a physical product? Are those lines of code imaginary then?
Buy it once, and only use it on one machine at a time - you should not need to purchase it again. If you fell into the set of circumstances where you could no longer use the product you purchased and were entitled to use, then you should have taken the matter up with Microsoft, and chased it until they sorted it.
So what exactly are you trying to say? Piracy of an essential piece of software which forms a fundamental part of your computer, used on an everyday basis, is bad unless we were in your shoes?
I can't afford a McLaren F1. I shouldn't be so disadvantaged - it isn't my fault that my cash situation is the way it is. So I'll just go and take one, yes?
Their profits are just as unnecessary as your need to steal their products. If the alternatives don't support what you need from an OS, then buy the one that does support your requirements. Problem solved - they're obviously doing something special that meets your requirements, so why not reward them for their product design, research and implementation?
So you don't buy consoles because you disagree with the pricing - fair enough. A sound decision IMO - but why take a different stance with your computer?
I can play console games without a console. I cannot play the latest PC games without the latest OS. Go try playing Doom 3 on 95.
I am acting like a deluded child. God forbid anyone woh doesn't support Capitalism and exploitation.
I am not suffering disadvantages? Alright maybe "suffering" portrays the idea of someine Africa... but it seems to be the word that fits what I am trying to get across - sorry for going to a shit school and not knowing better English. Instead we were pushed for exam results. I just feel it should be released at a reasonable price. Sorry for this.
Piracy is bad if say, someone who rich enough to afford everything they wanted in a media format went and downloaded it. Even then I still find it excuseable if done on the slighty protest point of that they are fed up with the incredible markup, a very very small percentage of which actually goes to those who made the product. (However, if you were that rich, the argument would seem a bit stupid.) Just like Music, where the majority of cash goes to the publishers, how mcuh do you think actually makes it from a purchase of Vista to the chap who sits programming it?
TBH, do you want a McLaren F1? I'd rather nick something more luxurious if I was going to bother.
I wish it was as easy as being able to buy the product I needed... I wish I had the cash, I really do. Then I would get a good job, with good hours, move into a good secure, comfortable flat, buy a nice, safe, car, have Windows Vista, Have nice clothes, have good healthy organic food...
However the reality of my life is more likley I'll have a shit job, have a crappy flat that isn't too secure or safe, a crappy old car that is likley to be a death trap, have Win XP until I am forced into Vista, have be eating cheap mass produced food.
God bless Capitalism, our great liberator. Of those born into well-off middle class families.
So buy the OS that allows you to what you want it to. If you can afford the games, you can afford the OS. Simple as.
Am I missing something, or are you blaming your schooling as a reason to justify the theft of something you use every day?
How many chaps do you think sit around programming at Microsoft? How many years of education do they go through to achieve the qualifications and skills required to create and maintain the products you take off them for free?
Do I want a McLaren F1, or need it? Markup - everyone is allowed to make money from their skills in life. And without profits, research and design would not take place. It's the profits that drive innovation - without it, you'd still be using Windows 3.1.
We have to choose between what we want to do, and what we can afford to do. I still don't see it as a reasonable excuse to pirate a fundamental part of your computer - Vista isn't going to do anything that WinXP won't do. Hence there is no real need to upgrade - for at least a year. Should give you plenty of time to save up the £50 or less you'll need to buy Vista?
Old or outdated doesn't mean it is no longer fit for purpose when it comes to vehicles. Learn to service them and you'll find it far cheaper to run something comfortable and nice. As for food - learn to cook. And if you want a better job, learn a new trade.
Is it everyone else's fault that you perceive them to have more than you?
So if I can afford something that costs £30, I can afford something that costs £120. Remind me why you can't afford a McLaren F1?
Nah, I was just coming back at the argument that I used the word suffering, in that I don't mean litteral suffering.
Although if I could afford Uni I could probably go straight into a high-up managment job and live the easy life. I'd also have gone to a better college.
...and how much do they get paid compared to the chaps who don't do all that work but are higher up the ladder? Not enough, I say.
So everyone is allowed to exploit everyone else if they so choose? Profits do not drive innovation. That is a standard human desire - to improve, to make things better. Profit does not make innovation - most of the innovative solutions come from, indeed, other sources! Microsoft was so innovative in its first OS it killed the competition. Programmed by - Bill and one Mate, in a garage. No profit drive there. They had no big money funds.
£50 or less?
LEarn a new trade, if only it was that easy! Someone HAS to do the shite jobs or the world doesn't go round - if only we COULD all work good jobs. And if only we had the time to learn that new trade and get the qualification! Instead, most people spend that time - working! To survive! Catch 22. Again.
Oh, and I only percieve people to have more than me? So that guy with the BMW, the Mansion, and rolling in dosh doesn't actually have it? Ah, ok. Now I know! He's really in an average house, driving a Astra and doesn't blow £500 on a night out.
At the end of the day, I don't see anything fundamentally wrong with what I am doing. You do. You aren't going to change because random internet man #236 says something, neither am I.
I am going to buy Vista, because I am fed up with pirate XP. However, if Vista crosses me, or MS cross me, they can be assured I'l be straight back to pirate. Plus no-doubt I'll be installing 200 cracks a year ot keep Pirate safe with all the MS Spyware (sorry, I mean security) features. I hope they don't try to use that to crack down on torrenting and the like. Although no doubt you would approve, because those poor rich men need thier suits and whores.
Time to save up ludicrous money amounts for Ultimate. :rolleyes: Fuckers. Highway robbery.