How does this train issue work?

Former Member

Well, my girlfriend came up to see me, although her first train was cancelled, and then the second delayed, so she arrived in York at 23:40 instead of 20:10, but we got to spend today and last night together so that wasn't the issue. Catching the train back today, the train was delayed, again. So she missed her next train. That was the last train back to Leicester, so she asked a member of the station staff and they said if she got a train to Sheffield she could get one from there. She got to Sheffield, and low and behold - no more trains back to Leicester.

So she's bought a ticket back to York and is going to get a train to Leicester in the morning, though I'm angry that she paid for it (didn't want to kick up a fuss) so I certainly will be with them. The thing is, are the trains allowed to say 'service disruptions are expected so we can't guarantee you'll get to your destination' in the event of a complaint? It's really out of order, because Doncaster is 20 minutes away and it was there they told her she could go to Sheffield (since her first train was late).

I understand when there's disruptions on the line there is nothing they can do but still that's not much good to paying customers is it? So has anyone got any experience with this? I thought initially they would be obliged by law or something to arrange a taxi / bus back to Leicester for her, but since they haven't done this I'm not sure...

Former Member

I don't think she should have had to pay for her ticket back to York, and she shouldn't have to pay to get to Leicester in the morning, but she'll probably need to talk to the ticket office rather than just get on a train.

I don't know about the taxi thing, sorry.

Former Member

Yea, she paid for the ticket because she didn't want to make a fuss, but I'm fairly confident a strongly-worded letter can get that reimbursed at least. I'm not complaining, I get to see her for another day, but she has a driving test in Leicester at 3.30pm tomorrow and was hoping to be home for 8pm for an early night and everything. Now she won't be in york till 10pm!

Former Member

Best make sure she keeps the tickets. And gets an early night!

Former Member

She shouldn't have got a ticket back to York.

If you are delayed and miss a valid connection the train company has a legal responsibility to get you to your destination- that means you are taken by taxi or by coach. Quite a few times I've come back from London on a delayed train and we've had to be taken by taxi because the last connecting train has gone.

Sheffield is a valid connection to Leicester- there isn't really another way- so it shouldn't be an issue. She should have insisted on a taxi home if the last train had gone.

I would write to the train company- Midland Mainline- and ask them for refunds for both legs of the journey. If a journey is more than about an hour late you are eligible for refunds anyway.

JsT

As Kermit says, she shouldn't have bought a ticket back to York. As long as there was a valid connection time. she should have been provided with alternative journey arrangements. Keep all the tickets and send them back to the train operator who caused the delay (more than likely Midland Mainline or possibly Virgin).

The National Rail conditions of carridge do state:
43. Help from Train Companies if you are stranded
If disruption caused by circumstances within the control of a Train Company or
a Rail Service Company leaves you stranded before you have reached your
destination and the Train Company whose trains you are entitled to use is unable
to get you to that destination by other means, any Train Company which is in a
position to help will, if it reasonably can, either arrange to get you to that
destination, or provide overnight accommodation for you.

It may be helpful to quote the conditions of carridge in your letter, they can be found at http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/times_fares/nrcc/


At the very least you should expect full reinbursement of all costs and tickets in rail travel vouchers.

Customer service details:

Customer Relations
Midland Mainline
FREEPOST DY940
DERBY
DE1 2BR

Virgin Trains:
Customer Relations,
Virgin Trains,
PO Box 713,
Birmingham,
B5 4HH.

Always worth paying for recorded delivery to ensure the letter and tickets arrive.

Former Member

She went to the information desk, and the said 'No sorry, there's nothing we can do.'. It was then she decided to get a ticket back to York before it was too late. Also, she was told to get a train to sheffield (I mean, she'd missed her connection so asked what to do next) but when she arrived at sheffield there was no trains by any routes to Leicester.

She's kept her tickets anyway, hopefully they'll be nice, having some experience with CS they always seem to bend over backwards if you have a legitimate complaint and know you have a legitimate complaint, so can really put pressure on them.

The one thing is though, who is ultimately responsible? She bought her tickets at Leicester station... then was going to get the 6.15 to sheffield, but that was cancelled, so she got the 7.15 (which was an hour late, so arrived at sheffield at around 9.00 ish). The rest of her Journey here was uneventful however.

Then on the way back, she got on a GNER from York to Doncaster, but that was 15 minutes late so she missed her connection, and thought it was the last one, but upon asking someone who worked for the railways, he told her that if she went to Sheffield she could grab a train to Leicester there. So, she got to sheffield and there was't any trains to Leicester, so asked at information and they said there was nothing she could do, so after speaking to me and her mum she thought rather than be stuck in the middle of nowhere she'd grab the train back to York.

But yea, will start complaining, just not 100% sure who to complain to yet...

Former Member

Sheffield is the usual changing point for Leicester (either there or Derby) so the railway staff were acting in good faith. Doncaster is not usually a changing point for Leicester, but there are a small number of connections.

She should complain, quoting the National Conditions of Carriage as above, and she should receive a full refund. I would also complain to MML/Virgin about the delays on the outward leg.

As to who to complain to, I would send the same letter to both MML and GNER. Whilst it was the GNER train that was late, and it was a valid connection at Doncaster (Doncaster has a minimum 7-minute connection time) MML should have arranged the onward transport from Sheffield.

It's a shame that some railway staff are lazy/clueless, because it does tarnish the reputation of what is an otherwise good service.

Customer Relations Manager
Great North Eastern Railway Limited
Main Headquarters
Station Rd
York
YO1 6HT

Former Member

i thought you were single?

Former Member

Kermit wrote:

If you are delayed and miss a valid connection the train company has a legal responsibility to get you to your destination- that means you are taken by taxi or by coach.

Which is what they did when I went by coach to Leicester. However, sometimes they'd just contact the connection, warn them that they're delayed and the connection would wait for the other coach to come to wherever it's meant to.

Former Member

Ballerina wrote:

i thought you were single?

http://vbulletin.thesite.org/showpost.php?p=1855651&postcount=2898

Last 3 paragraphs explain pretty much.

Ok then, duplicate letters off to GNER and MML :thumb: got it. I'll let you know how it goes thankyou. It was a shame they couldn't have told a lost and upset young woman that she was entitled to this in the train station and just said 'there's nothing we can do'. Though then again, I suppose it is a bit confused, since the train stations are run by someone and the trains are run by someone else then they can all pass the buck.

Suppose that's one of the issues of privatisation, nobody has liability / responsibility.

Former Member

Indeedy. The problem was also probably that she wasn't lost/upset enough. Not saying for a moment that she did wrong, but by appearing vaguely capable of sorting herself out they fobbed her off with the easiest answer. If you stand in their station on the verge of tears they tend to do a slightly better job of sorting you out.

JsT

Can't find any 18.15 on Saturday gone so don't know bout that. Sunday is GNER's error. So send the letter to them. Outbound complain probably to MML as can't see anything in the timetable that correlates.