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In my opinion the catwalks should reflect the average woman.
The average woman is not extremely skinny. Nobody is proposing the idea of putting obese people on the catwalk, just average sized people who are a healthy weight.
Surely women who are at a healthy weight will be a desirable goal for BOTH underweight and overweight women, as opposed to stick thin women being a goal for larger women and vice versa.
Average sized women is the way forward.
I think the problem is overstated by some for political gain, but there is a trend towards bigger people generally.
I also don't believe that the problems with weight are down to what people eat, but rather the amount of exercise they do. In a world full of desk jobs and huge amounts of homework of course people will do much less exercise. It's hard to go out and play football for three hours when you have four hours of homework to do, and its hard to go out and play football on the street when you have an ASBO and a curfew waiting for anyone who tries.
The argument is based using the BMI scale, which is where my issue stands. I am carrying a few too many pounds now, but even when I was really skinny I was overweight according to BMI.
You find that funny? I think it was an appalling thing to say.
As usual there is this knee-jerk reaction from the more slim/skinny/thin woman about how they are being ostracised for their natural weight. News for you, the majority of catwalk models are not naturally that extreme of a build and weight.
With respect to lemmings jumping off a cliff; I highly doubt people would start to overeat in an attempt to emulate any "plus size" (read: perfectly average) model who slipped through the net and onto a catwalk. Part of the reason "thin is in" is because in our society it is such a difficult thing to achieve. Before someone pipes up with "5 a day fruit and veg, exercise three times a week" it is still not that straightforward for a lot of people. Just like in ye olde days of yore it was desirable to have a bit of chunk on you as it showed you were wealthy and well-fed in times of scarcity; now that food is everywhere and cheap cheap cheap it is fashionable and desirable to shun it. The more we are shown thin, thinner, thinnest in magazines and on TV the more and more the average dress size is creeping up. It's a ridiculous state of affairs.
Someone will now doubtlessly pipe up that thin women are demonised by the media, too, and yes there is a small part of the media (heat magazine et al) that critiques the very rich and very thin; but in my opinion it is all reported on with a slant of envy and aspiration. "Oh, look how thin Nicole Richie is" followed by such and such a person's diet tips (when in fact they've just been in for a bit of a nip, lip and tuck) means that it all has such a false air about it. Even with the odd "keep you moral objectors quiet" article about women and weight is very rare when you compare it with the amount of articles about how some actress has gained a few pounds; any spare inch of fat you can pinch is maligned and given inches and inches of column space because we are so utterly terrified of the way our bodies are naturally. Of course there are naturally thin women; but there are so many other body types and weight brackets -- as mystifymysoul said, all anyone wants is for fair and accurate representation of women in fashion and the media. That's not happening at the moment, and whether it ever will remains to be seen, but the focus and attitude of high fashion circles stink. No one is saying all models/role models should be obese, lumbering things... but neither should we have purely rail thin women modelling clothes. There needs to be balance and change, some of the models I've seen at the various fashion weeks recently are absolutely horrifying. I think the actual original "supermodels" have absolutely beautiful, slender, maintained-but-healthy-looking figures... some of these new catwalk models are the things nightmares are made of.
As for the essay: word.
I have no objection to slim models, I have an objection to people who are quite clearly not the size and shape that they are meant to be. Someone like Helena Christiansen is slender and attractive, but she's attractive because she's at a weight that suits her. She isn't attractive because she's slender. What you have now are a load of pubescent girls (many fashion show models are 16 and younger) trying desperately to starve themselves into their clothes, and when puberty strikes they will be tossed out as being "too fat".
What makes me laugh (and cry) the most is magazines like Glamour which do moralistic articles on how you should "love your body", and then furnish the article with a load of unhealthily thin pubescent girls prancing around in their smalls, as if to prove the point.
If an average sized women (size 16 i think?) got on the catwalk, she would be considered plus size.
But the main reason catwalk models are thin because the designers want to clothes to hang. So basically they're walking clothes hangers.
See what get's me. I find larger women to be so bitter and look down their noses at slim women, and think they have the right to say negative things about them, I remember Trisha Goddard saying once to a guest who was having weight issues "No man wants to make love to a bag of bones" :rolleyes:
Pfft... Don't people have a right to be slim? I don't particularly find fat people attractive, but I don't go up to them and say Go on a diet, watch you don't pop, etc..
People are always looking for someone to blame for their weight problems, at the end of the day, if it wasn't a weight issue it would be something else!
Im very happy youre thin and pleased with your weight, but that doesnt detract from the fact the modelling industry and designers heavily pressurise girls into eating disorders and drug abuse in order to become what they see as desirably underweight as is the fashion now.
Lots of people are naturally skinny, and yes, sometimes people will make a comment about it when they shouldnt, but dont kid yourself you have some realtrouble in society and that skinny people face as much social stigma as overweight people, because they dont - theres no argument there. Madrid arent saying you have to be overweight to model there. Tbh I dont even think theyre saying you have to have a normal BMI unfortunately. I think theyre just saying there comes a point where its TOO thin, and if you disagree with that then youre blinded by something or another or just completely nuts.
That's a load of bollocks..
With people gettin' fatter and fatter, Slimmer people are gettin' lesser n lesser. As now it is seeming that it is unsociable to be slim
say you go on a coffee break at work, everyone is talking about their latest diet... and i fit in ... where? Errr yeah... see where am going?
Not at all.
You're failing to see the difference between being naturally slim and preternaturally thin, as many of the catwalk models are. Even if you are a woman of slim build (as I am myself, just FYI) I would be willing to bet than standing next to your average, high-end fashion model you would end up looking distinctly average in the weight department and they would be exposed to have the praying mantis-like frames that they do.
The fact that you're dragging this debate on fashion week models down to what goes on on your coffee break at work tells me that you have a massive chip on your shoulder with regard to this issue; if I couldn't tell already! Oh, and I'll repeat that while thin women are sometimes maligned they do not face anything like the amount of vicious bad press that the average to slightly overweight woman in the public eye (or even out of it) does. You cannot claim otherwise, because it would be a falsehood.
I agree with your main point. It is unfair that there is a double standard whereby naturally thin people are seen as fair game for comments about their weight, diet etc; whereas it's a cardinal sin to suggest anything of the same calibre to someone overweight. But if you're attempting to go about changing the attitude that it's ok to do so then I suggest you be a little bit more pro-active about it, rather than tearing strips off anyone who can see the merit in a myriad weight and build range among models
I do actually agree with you on the old BMI thing as it really is a load of tosh. I won't get into the "it's what we eat" debate as it's the wrong thread to do so
I think the dilemma will come when people try and determine "an average healthy weight" as it is a very hard thing to decide. Some people say a size 16 is a healthy size etc. If i was a size 16 i would not be healthy based on my bone structure and my build as it is. My broader, bigger boned friend could be a size 16 and look normal on it even though she's the same height as me.
But like Kermit and Briggi have said, supermodels used to be healthy looking, fit and radiant creatures, that is why they were called supermodels. They were a breed apart from us mere mortals. But those were in the days were they had hourglass figures, hips and boobs. Okay they weren't fat but they didn't look like they were going to die any minute. I think the rail thin girls, like Nicole Ritchie, look dreadful. Posh is one of the worst looking women. If she didn't have fasle boobs she'd be an anorexic boy. She eats in a day what i eat in a morning.
What the chuff are you on about?
You assume that anyone who criticises the fashion industry must be a fat heifer- why? Briggi isn't fat, and neither is Ballerina (a clue about her size is in her name).
It's not jealousy to point out that if you can only keep your figure through the copious usage of cocaine then you're probably not at a safe weight.
People can be whatever size they want, but when women who are obviously unhealthily too thin are being held up as a role model for beauty, then I have issues. Being underweight is as dangerous as being overweight, after all.
You are confusing being slim with being unhealthily skinny. Helena Christiensen is very slim but that's her build, she's the size she's meant to be, so she is very very attractive. But someone like Paris Hilton or Nicole Richie (and indeed she has confessed to being anorexic) are blatantly unhealthily thin- that's their choice, but it sure as hell means that they aren't suitable fashion role models.
And as for slim women getting dog's abuse, oh please. Whilst you may get some abusive comments, you don't get as many, and the whole fashion industry isn't against you too. As if to prove the point, Karl Lagerfeld went off on one saying that anyone over a size 10 is "too fat" to wear his clothes after H&M extended the range he's designed for them to cover up to size 16.
I don't know how anyone can think most catwalk models look healthy and are a healthy fashion and beauty role model for young women.
You sure you're happy with your weight, you don't sound it. You sound like you want everyone to love you because you're slim.
If you take away all the models who are Anorexic etc.. and replace them with Naturally slim women fair enough, but you can't judge every model as being unhealthy just because they are slim (ie,Spain bans skinny models)
I am happy with my weight, If anything, it's everyone else who isn't!
This is just another example of narrow mindedness!
Theyre not banning naturally slim models. Theyre banning the ones who are hugely underweight.
Shes slim, but she looks like shes supposed to be that way.
The ONLY time ive been truly happy with my weight is when ive been a small size 8 with my hip bones jutting out and my ribs showing - its not my natural size. I know I look better as a 10, but id probably look enormous now as that next to most catwalk models, in fact id look enormous as an 8 probably in comparison.
woah, thats shocking! Im a size 10 nowdays and i get called boney and skinny sometimes, these supermodels must actually have small bone structure to be that small, because i cant grab any fat on myself.
Why would I need to get over myself.. For having an opinion?
Sure, okay! :rolleyes:
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I dont even know what youre trying to argue - that people arent allowed to be skinny? - they are! That skinny people have a harder time in society? - they dont! That everyone here who disagrees with you is obviously fat and jealous? - Bullshit.