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people vs bankers
Former Member
Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
Klintock has mentioned this topic lately. Money from nothing. Class action in Canada, what will come of it?
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Great.
If, as some believe, the world is controlled by a secret cabal of bankers and wealthy industrialists they will have the clout to stop this.
If, on the other hand, they are wrong and that the world isn't controlled by anyone the chances are the banks are operating legally and the complainants have the wrong end of the economic stick and the case will be dismissed.
He's not that bad. And nobody's proved him wrong.
i think the general basis for the case is that the US constitution specifically forbids the senate/government to grant any private bank the powers to create money, and thus basically control the circulation and the economy.......what everyone seems to forget is that the "Federal Reserve Bank" is in fact a consortium of privately owned banks, and the Federal Reserve Act of 1913 blatantly violates the US Constitution, Wilson admitted as much after he realised what he had done but it was too late.......this is why Kennedy had it repealed when he was in power, but that didn't last long......
ETA: see my sig, this is not just some whack conspiracy TJ predicted what might happen long before it did....
But this is a case filed on behalf of the people of Canada against Canadian banks and has nothing to do with the US Constitution
yeah i noticed that, the american example has been copied worldwide e.g. Bank of England, so the premise for the case is still the same, im pretty sure most democratic countries stipulate money should not be created privately in their respective charter/constitution/whatever........it's pretty obvious why.
I am constantly amazed that so many scoff at the notion that powerful banking elites over generations could be incapable of colluding to establish and entrench a fictional system intended to secure financial winfalls predominantly for those at the top of the hierarchical economic ladder. The mechanisms of interinstitutional collusion and reinforcement are demonstrable across the entirety of the modern Western system such that only a compratmentalised mindset could fail to see its interconnected and self-perpetuating duplicitous scheme of promise and coercion.
Sooner or later, even those who wish to hide from the truth will be forced to see that the system is indeed inherently zero-sum oriented. The coming collapse will, however, make its Great Depression Era predecessor look like a dress rehearsal.
Oh well, given that all anyone says about it seem to be long words and hints at dark forces I'll just have to sit it out and scrabble around in the dirt when it all goes tits up.
oh and btw long words and legalese is a favourite trick to put the layman off ever understanding the inner workings of government and corporations, just have a look at the eu constitution......shouldn't stop you looking for answers though.
It doesnt go anywhere though, there is no suggestions, anyone can point the finger and say 'I dont like that' but its much harder to say 'we should do this instead'.
Its a matter of wrestling with the information until you are able to see the interconnectedness of it all. Its elaborate for sure, but then it was generations in the making and took many many minds to set in place. Nevertheless, it's a house of cards with its own inherent flaws as are all human constructs.
The question is, will people wake up to that fact and overturn it before that house collapses altogether?
fair enough, but i would say the problem lies with greedy and corrupt politicians handng over too much power.......surely one step forward would be to reclaim all the banks so they are state-owned, and have much stricter legislation about who can do what regarding banking and commerce........
The vastly larger percentage of increasing global impoverishment and unsustainable consumption is the zero sum effect under which this numbers game is bound to implode. 60-100 years is nothing in the scope of world history and those pushing the debt envelope the fastest are those who recognise this ship is sinking.
To be fair even if there is a economic depression worse than the Wall Street Crash its probablky not going to be as catastrophic as painted. The only casualties of the WSC were a few bankers who threw themselves of buildings, - no-one starved, Governments continued to be able to feed and protect their populations and economy's readjusted.
There have always been doom-mongers about, from the early Christians convinced the Apocolypse was just round the corner to Malthus and his overcrowding. There's a lot of conjecture and theories in the current crop - but very few cold, hard facts (and even those are usually out of context)
But in real terms thats nearly as pointless as cash money. So you can back it up with gold, who wants gold?
I agree, but I was only suggesting gold because (as far as I understand the argument) current money is worthless because it often has no phyical substance (being in the cyberspace of bank accounts).
if it's backed by gold that prevents the fractional reserve banking practice which is common today.......this is what the canadians are complaining about, money from nothing........
Its what one Canadian is complaining about. Lets not over play it.
if you read the article he is actually filing the suit on behalf of several people, probably because he is the only one who can understand the nature of the beast well enough to tackle it.....
The class action suit, the first and the biggest of its kind in Canada is intended to give the justice system the opportunity to prove to itself and to the People of Canada who is really in control or whether they would continue to allow itself to be used by the banks as a tool in their unlawful and fraudulent banking practices which always ends in the enslavement of the people and confiscation of the people's properties.
Two other class action suits were filed by John Ruiz Dempsey against the banks. The first one was filed by Dempsey on behalf of Ian Dennis Gravlin of Calgary, Alberta and Pavel Darmantchev of Kelowna, B.C. versus the Canadian Imperial Bank of Commerce. This matter is set for case management conference hearing on April 26, 2005. The Plaintiff expects a stiff opposition from the defendant's law firm. Madam Justice Garson is the case management judge assigned to the case.
A second class action suit was filed against MBNA CANADA BANK on behalf of Pavel Darmantchev of Kelowna, B.C., Ian Dennis Gravlin of Calgary, Alberta and Dena Alden of Vancouver, B.C.
this is not some isolated problem, it's fraud on a global scale, and thanks to Mr Dempsey similar suits are being drawn up in america.......
A class action was filed on May 27, 2005 in the U.S. District Court, Southern District Court of Ohio by the Plaintiff, Patrick Rudd from Rhode Island. The file number is C205523. The class action in Ohio is based on some class actions launched in Canada:
http://www.freewebs.com/classaction/classaction3.htm
More class actions are being prepared in Philadelphia, Texas and other states.
and about bloody time.
Its not worthless - I can still buy food with it.
bb my point is this is not exclusively a canadian problem, just because most people (like yourself) put too much faith in these unknown private entities doesn't make it any less real..........what is your point?
Its hard to summarise an argument which I personally think is mad, but (and Apollo can correct me if I am wrong) without something solid behind it the bank can creat new money (addsing a few million electronic pounds to their balance sheets) and have a metaphorical licence to print money.
Once we realise this is happening we'll no longer trust money, the economy collapses and we'll all die.
I think
I understand the point, but I do dispute that it is money from "thin air". Loans affect electronic balances, and electronic balances count at the ATM, therefore the money is tangible.
It's tangible because I walk into a shop and can get other tangible things for my money.
You don't seem to grasp how it works, though.
What is a tangible physical asset? Gold is not a tangible asset of value if nobody wants gold just as much as a £5 note is not a tangible asset of value if nobody wants a sheet of green paper.
What is wrong with interest? The bank is saying "I will give you £10 if you pay me £15"- if you don't like that deal then don't go overdrawn.
Electronic balances are tangible because electronic balances purchase goods. A loan of money is tangible because I can go to the ATM and withdraw it and buy tangible goods with it. I can buy goods with the balance in my bank account.
I fully understand the arguments about "thin air" economics, I just don't agree with them. Gold and diamonds' values are produced "out of thin air" too, if you think about it for more than five seconds.