devolution

Former Member

Do citizens of Wales, Scotland & Northern Ireland get to vote in the General Election now despite their own respective Parliaments/Assemblies?

Former Member

Yes.

Former Member

well to turn this into a contestable point, why doesn't England have it's own Parliament then? I realise that assemblies don't have the fully fledged powers of a parliament, but why is it the case then that the Scottish Parliament can create it's own laws and Scottish people can vote for their own parliament and yet still have a say in an election process which affects by numbers many more English people, when the reverse would be considered out of the question?

Former Member

el_dude wrote:

well to turn this into a contestable point, why doesn't England have it's own Parliament then? I realise that assemblies don't have the fully fledged powers of a parliament, but why is it the case then that the Scottish Parliament can create it's own laws and Scottish people can vote for their own parliament and yet still have a say in an election process which affects by numbers many more English people, when the reverse would be considered out of the question?

Whats the point of an English parliament? It encompasses 85% of the population of the country anyway. The scottish can pass *some* legislation, whilst the Welsh assembly can only make minor ammendments to selected British legislation

Former Member

Renzo wrote:

The scottish can pass *some* legislation, whilst the Welsh assembly can only make minor ammendments to selected British legislation

Both subsidised by the English of course.

Former Member

Kentish wrote:

Both subsidised by the English of course.

So do Scottish and Welsh people not pay taxes? :rolleyes:

Former Member

Well what is the point then of creating these devolved parliaments/assemblies if voting is to continue in the General Elections? If greater representation of Wales,Scotland and N.I is the reason of these devolutions then surely they should be full devolutions as opposed to half assed efforts which don't really do the job, funded by a majority of english taxpayers?







edited to say that "funded by the english" as opposed to "a majority of english" was rather sweeping

Former Member

Renzo wrote:

So do Scottish and Welsh people not pay taxes? :rolleyes:

Not enough to pay for their devolved policies, no. :rolleyes:

Former Member

I personally think Scottish and Welsh MPs should not be allowed a voting on issues that are completely English.

Devolved parliaments, just a gesture to make the Welsh and Scottish feel better about still being under English control. They should go for full independance.

Former Member

.

Former Member

girl with sharp teeth wrote:

Renzo, I don't want to insult you, or denigrate you, as being welsh obviously means a lot to you. But could you please give it a fucking rest? I'm probably as welsh as you are and I really don't think the 'oh, the rest of the UK is so hard done to by England' act is justified. There is no logical reason why England shouldn't have an assembly like the other 3 regions do.

I never said that.

I just think it's slightly pointless due to the fact that its most of the country.

If Wales and Scotland gained full independence then fair enough, but the two of them are still governed, especially in Wales' case from London.

You wouldn't treat me like that if I was english.

Former Member

Regional assemblies failed, so do the English actually want an assembly or are most of them happy with the status quo?

Former Member

I'll take the English only votes for now. I used to like the idea of an English regional assembly but the regional one was sold so badly I'm not sure it would be effective for the costs that would be involved.

Former Member

el_dude wrote:

Do citizens of Wales, Scotland & Northern Ireland get to vote in the General Election now despite their own respective Parliaments/Assemblies?

Yes, because we are still ultimately governed by Westminster, regardless of the Scottish Parliament and Welsh Assembly.

Former Member

*MrG spanks the search button*

http://vbulletin.thesite.org.uk/showthread.php?t=76337&page=1

Former Member

.

Former Member

BlackArab wrote:

I personally think Scottish and Welsh MPs should not be allowed a voting on issues that are completely English.

Ahhhh, the west Lothian question, brings me back to GV101 in my first year.

The impact of doing that would be you would in effect create 2 governments, as the Tories would have a majority in England. This would cause chaos - If we take the Parliament now Labour, in spite of being the government, would be in a minority on English issues and so could not fucntion. Say the Tories win, then they wouldn't be able to implement policy on Scotland and Wales because Labour would block it all.

Former Member

el_bertie wrote:

BlackArab wrote:

I personally think Scottish and Welsh MPs should not be allowed a voting on issues that are completely English.

Ahhhh, the west Lothian question, brings me back to GV101 in my first year.

The impact of doing that would be you would in effect create 2 governments, as the Tories would have a majority in England. This would cause chaos - If we take the Parliament now Labour, in spite of being the government, would be in a minority on English issues and so could not fucntion. Say the Tories win, then they wouldn't be able to implement policy on Scotland and Wales because Labour would block it all.

Good points but whats the alternative? I'm still not happy with the current situation.

Found these after a quick google,

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm199900/cmstand/c/st000216/pm/00216s03.htm

http://thecep.org.uk/news/ViewItem.asp?Entry=261

Former Member

BlackArab wrote:

I personally think Scottish and Welsh MPs should not be allowed a voting on issues that are completely English.

Devolved parliaments, just a gesture to make the Welsh and Scottish feel better about still being under English control. They should go for full independance.

English control? What the fuck are you babbling about?

It's us who control you .

Former Member

Spliffie wrote:

English control? What the fuck are you babbling about?

It's us who control you .

If you let me use your address for Uni purposes I'll buy you a deep fried mars bar. Deal?

Former Member

BlackArab wrote:

If you let me use your address for Uni purposes I'll buy you a deep fried mars bar. Deal?

He is from Stirling not Glasgow!! I live less than 10 miles outside Glasgow and I have never seen a deep fried mars supper.

Stereotypical remarks not necessary.

Scotland and Wales has MP's as the are still part of the United Kingdom - since Westminster still has powers not devolved to Scotland - defence, immigration etc.... I agree that Scottish MP's shouldnt vote on totally English matters but should the reverse be true - would all the English and Welsh, Irish MP's do the same.....?

Former Member

Whats his location have to with mars bars, they sell him everywhere?

The comment was tongue in cheek, as was his and your signature.

Former Member

BlackArab wrote:

Whats his location have to with mars bars, they sell him everywhere?

The comment was tongue in cheek, as was his and your signature.

Deep fried they don't - a Glaswegian invention.

Former Member

i just wonder how many of you arguing here are old enough to vote, if you are not then while you are entitles to your opinion, their is nothing you can do about it at all

people are not that bothered about politics at all, hardly anyone votes in the general elections anyway, if that many people were bothered, to the point of been able tobring the country to a standstill, then perhaps people might listen, but end of the day you dont have the support and its not going to happen, regardless of what anyone wants

Former Member

MrG wrote:

i just wonder how many of you arguing here are old enough to vote, if you are not then while you are entitles to your opinion, their is nothing you can do about it at all

people are not that bothered about politics at all, hardly anyone votes in the general elections anyway, if that many people were bothered, to the point of been able tobring the country to a standstill, then perhaps people might listen, but end of the day you dont have the support and its not going to happen, regardless of what anyone wants

This will be my first chance to vote and I am interested in politics - yes I am a minority.

Former Member

good, im glad your taking this seriously

though it does annoy me how quite a few people do go on about this problem in real life, yet are the precise kind to turn around and admit they didnt vote

Former Member

In Airdrie i'm sure it's de rigeur .

Heart attack suppers are usually only available on special request, though.

Using my address for Uni purposes? I'm lost lol.

Former Member

MrG wrote:

hardly anyone votes in the general elections anyway,

Yeah, just about half the country.

Former Member

most restaurants do everything on special request, its called asking for something on the menu that they havnt cooked yet

Former Member

Panthro wrote:

Deep fried they don't - a Glaswegian invention.

Ah but they sell haggis in the Tescos I use, so its not impossible. LOL.

Former Member

Spliffie wrote:

Yeah, just about half the country.

59.4%

of an electorate of 30 million or so, or something around that

so 30 million ish cant vote, of thos who did vote slightly less than haf voted for labour i think (43%)

so 12.9 million people voted for labour, against a population of 60 million, a difference of about 47 million, now i know that figure includes those who cant vote, but it shows what i mean when i say not that many people vote, especiallyfor the winner