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We are constantly trying to get our own houses in order.
We aren't allowed to say they are barbaric then? Even when they blatantly are?
I'm not saying we should go in and change it for them, Im just saying that people who say we are barbaric and evil and they are somehow the victims are wrong.
Ha you're sooo missing the point...it's got othing to do with countries...it's the system, it's the culture, it's the foundation of their morals, the ways of expressing the degrees of barbarity are different because in this country...the barbarity has been supressed...we're expected to have a good family etc etc...that drives us underground, don't say you don't have some crazy idiosyncracy only you know about, in Iran it's different cos the barbarity is at the forefront of the society, therefore it's acceptable to get mad and stone your wife if she cheats...here we usually go and shag someone else...still barbaric...got it yet...more than likely not...
Hmmm no you are missing the point.
Its not that Iranians are somehow naturally barbaric because they are Iranian. I'm saying that Iran is a barbaric country.
So you think that morality is completely relative and if a society decided to view murder and stealing as acceptable then it would be ok because thats their "culture", according to you we'd have to say that its fine.
well yes basically...i already said it's wrong but if an Iranian thinks these sort of actions are acceptable because it's the culture then it's not his fault...if he feels it's perfectly justifiable to stone his wife if she cheats then thats ok to him just as it's ok for us to feel it's ok to sleep with someone else if our spouse cheats...two different methods of "revenge" but equally barbaric in terms of what our belief system is and what theirs is...i'm not talking about Iran the country...i'm talking about the people...
An Iranian friend once told me about witnessing an anti-Shah demo before the Revolution, where the Army opened fire on the protestors from helicoptor gunships. Can't remember that happening lately.
Or killing 100,000 civilians because their leader abuses their human rights?
How about putting women and children in concentration camps because you are at war with their menfolk?
How about those civilised, well-behaved chaps getting off on pictures of children and babies being raped?
The Holocaust?
Having a bullet put through your knees and elbows for being a joy-rider?
What a marvellous thing Western civilisation eh? :hyper:
The Iranian I know says she remembers the smell of blood when the revolution took place. And that while they weren't delighted about the Shah, then it was never as bad as when Khomeini came to power.
She told that people in Iran are so fed up, being that they have seen and experienced another life. She told me how she saw an old lady start hitting some sort of priest/clerc on the street and just curse away.
And from the home videos I saw of a wedding, as long as people are indoor they don't care about the rules.
Probably his wife Jacqs, you get that all the time in British city centres on a Saturday night.
No, not in Iran, but in Norfolk.
Think before you speak. Although the ruling elite in Iran and other "backward" countries are barabaric and brutal, they're not exactly dissuaded from behaving like that if it suits Western business. Think Musharraf, think Saudi, think the Contras, Chile...
And he IS treated as a hero by much of the media.
Think about sending suspects to countries like that for the information you will receive when they are tortured..
After reading the case manslaughter seems fair.
And it doesn't matter how he's treated by the media its how he's treated by the state that matters. If Iran's media was calling for death by stoning because you bonked a married man, but the Iranian state was saying 'No -thats not a crime' I wouldn't have any problem with Iran.
He shot a boy that was running away from him in the back. he intended to cause GBH to the boy. It is murder.
http://www.amnesty.org.uk/news/press/15825.shtml
http://www.awakenedwoman.com/wfafi_stoning.htm
Given that he was a few sandwiches short of a picnic wasn't it diminshed responsibility?
I PM'd him some videos, lets see if he withdraws his "hearsay" comment.
Guantanamo bay? And various other detention centres? The actuall holding in Iraq of prisoners?
It was only a few years ago women were treated like that in the west. We're no so far ahead as you think. WW2 bought them rights over here, and people began to pay attention. Its not that long ago.
Im not condoning it. Just pointing out we aren't as great as you might think. Alot of Women are still abused in the west. More action needs to be taken. But until people can get over petty things, like starting wars because your different, no hope at all.
Its Historical terms it isn't that long, thats what im talking about. Im not talking like 20 years.
If you really think that regular, old fashioned torture hasn't been ocurring in Gitmo, Afghanistan or Iraq you must be getting your news from Neptune.
Are they really?
Muppet.
Though that said its certain circumstances I won't be crying in my beer for the person executed using Iranian methods http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/4355029.stm