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All the cute ickle foxes get to live
Former Member
Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
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Pointless.
More hope of Tony Blair losing the election. :thumb:
well, no. they'll still die. only they'll be shot, or caught in traps instead and die less violent but more extended deaths.
for the difference it'll make to the foxes, i personally think the government should have concentrated their time, money and effort on something that would have actually improved the quality of life for humans. or animals.
Doubtful, there is no real opposition that looks ready to take over. He'll loose seats and the majority wont be as good, but he'll win.
As for the ban, frankly I really couldnt care all that much either way. Though I really dislike the Countryside Alliance so if it annoys them, great.
Seconded.
And that makes what difference?
We don't hunt any other "vermin" in this way, oh and deer aren't "vermin" either and this law covers hunting of them too...
Personally I welcome it and I'm glad that Parliament has spent some 700 hours recently debatng the issue. As these boards show it is something which most people have an opinion on and surverys show that 70% of people oppose this form of hunting.
true. however, some if not most people are grossly under-informed about what the ban actually means, and what hunting is like.
How does this flout democracy?
Because the House of Lords is so democratic isn't it....
Good it's banned, hopefully once it comes into place the countryside alliance and all those other toffs will shut up.
You're quite the bigot aren't you renzo?
I don't 'hate' the upper classes. They have just been allowed to continue with fox hunting because of their status though. Also fox hunting is cruel and barbaric.
I was just saying that they arent really comparible. Foxes arent (in the main) bred for the hunt, unlike the dogs and cocks used to be.
And unlike with dogs and cocks there is some (however minor) merit to hunting.
I'm still pro-ban, I just was suggesting that its not comparable to dog or cock fighting, thats all.
Doesn't answer the question.
The duly elected house voted to ban hunting with dogs on more than one occasion.
The unelected house voted against.
If anything the lack of a ban would have been undemocratic
proving my point exactly.
yes, it's a 'sport' that traditionally royals are into, but if you go to any hunt, especially any in the north, the majority of people that take part are farmers, village people (residents, not the homotastic pop-group) and stablehands earning maybe £9000 a year. for years i rode at a stable where hunters kept their horses and i never came across any 'toffs'.
Always when they are moaning on the TV there are lots of posh people though. I regard that not all of them are like that but it seems a hell of a lot of them are. Not to worry if they really want to continue at least they'll get whats coming to them.
If you eat meat, you are guilty of a cruelty far worse than that done to most foxes.
If any of you have ever been to or worked at an abattoir, you will have witnessed the sight of the absolute fear these animals experience. They sense and know that they are going to be killed. Their eyes roll back in fear, they froth at the mouth, they tremble, they shit themselves and the noise is terrifying. But they cannot escape. They are trapped and spend the last few hours of their life in abject terror and stench.
Foxes? They have the opportunity to escape. The majority of them get away when chased by the hounds. Given a choice, I'd be a fox rather than an abattoir animal any day!
I am neither for nor against fox hunting. It just annoys me that left-wing politicians and city people think that the fox should be spared 'cos he's cute 'n cuddly - and a lot of it is about class. If you seriously want to end animal suffering, start in the abattoir and give up eating meat otherwise you are just being hypocritical. But that bacon butty is just too good isnt it?
It isn't a class issue - only those supporting the ban insist that it is in order to justify their objection.
I have no vested interest in hunting, but I am annoyed at the amount of time it has taken away from more important (IMHO) debates that MPs should be having.
The Labour Party included a ban in its manifesto.
The public voted for a Labout Govt.
The Govt has pushed through something in it's manifesto.
Jeez, for once they have done what they promised and still people complain.
Yes there are other things which need attention. This is just one off a long list and the priority of that list will differ from person to person. It's not even like the whole 600+ MPs have been involved in the debate in the chamber for 700 hours.
Yes parliament could debate health, education etc ad nauseum and some would point out that they do, but what those areas need isn't more law - which is what parliament is there to create. Debating won't solve the problems, action will.
i didn't vote labour, therefore i reserve the right to complain.
Who actually benefits from the fox hunting bans? (Apart from the foxes
i doubt it'll make a difference to them. sure, being chased for miles and then ripped apart isn't nice, but neither is being shot in the leg and dying slowly of septecaemia, or being caught in a trap and dying of blood loss or starvation, and farmers are still well within their rights to use those methods.
to answer your question, the people who will benefit are the government, when all the wishy washy voters are won over because they love fuzzy foxes and they won't die anymore. quite.
It is when peopel in this thread are going "good it annoys the toffs".
Such a shame
Yes, but did people vote for Labour because of their stance on fox hunting? No - they voted for the economic and standard-of-living arguments presented by Labour. Fox hunting was just bundled in with it. If you wanted social and economic reform, how else could you vote?
Adios hijos de puta! :wave:
Finally!
With regard to the Parliament Act, Commons vs. Lords, etc, let's make one thing absolutely clear: the Lords are absolutely and solely responsible for the shambles and the endless affair this bill had become.
It really makes me laugh when some people claim the Commons are not being "democratic" in passing this bill through the Parliament Act. One of Labour's main points in its manifesto was to get fox hunting banned. When won. Twice over.
And let's remind ourselves that there has been an overwhelming majority of MPs, including many Tories and Lib Dems, who have voted in favour of the ban. Every single one of them being an accountable, removable and electable politician.
As opposed to their unelected, unaccountable, irremovable Lordships, naturally.
And when the people has spoken, and when the MPs have spoken, if that bunch of out-of-touch, self-serving selfish chaps think they can hold the country to ransom again, and again, and again, and again, they've got another fucking thought coming.
They have only themselves to blame for the Parliament Act being invoked. And thank fuck there is such a provision in place- otherwise their unelected, unaccountable, irremovable Lordships would have total control and power over the country.