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No he didn't make a mistake.
He wrote criterias for what defines someone from the lower class.
While you (British people) would connect class with financial status and/or job, he thinks it depends on behavior.
So ultimately he says that a factory worker with a minimum wage can be upper class if behaving according to his view of how an upper class person should be.
In all respect, as he is posting on a British board, one would assume that he is referring to British interpretation of upper and lower class (unless he makes himself clear otherwise). And bad behaviour is not the sole domain of the 'lower classes'.
We are ranked by HMGov according to our socio-economic status and these 'means of production' you refer to are not part of the equation
most people are confused by class, some want to be more w/c than they are some more m/c than they are
It's intelligent to ape the m/cs if you're w/c as the m/c tend to run things so if you want an easier and pleasanter life, that's the way to go
in your opinion of course.......which means naff all to me.
Im middle class and I know only one language and I prefer a bottle of 9.99 Vodka to a 4.99 bottle of wine :rolleyes:
Come back when you do know about different classes and how they work.........darling !!
Hello..........wake up !!!!
You aint got a clue what your talking about. People play loud music regardless of class.......ffs :rolleyes:
Why does the majority of people in this thread not consider that this is his personal opinion of hos class should be divided.
Not the British way.
I will not accept being called lower class and fit in the group that he describes.
I do not fit the category of :
People who spit on streets
People who have no Pride.
People who have no Honesty
People who have no Dignity.
He says im lower class because I dont drink wine and i only speak one language, so he assumes that i am in the same group of people as the 4 I just quoted him on.
Im not scum........thank you very much.
Hear, hear!
Yes I'm fully aware of the A, B, C1, C2 etc classification.
Nowt to do with class though.
did it ever dawn on you that people in a council house get just as annoyed by the endless bass beats coming from some dicks car as those in a private house ...with trees in the avenue ...wasting my time i know.
you realy are so narrow minded ...your view of the world is so tiny.
I grew up in a family that for the most part, did not have college educations, and many, if not most, held down laboring types of jobs (welders, pipe fitters, plumbers, etc.) I later went to college and earned several degrees. Alrighty? So am I middle class now, or working class?
And actually, who really cares? Labelling myself and doing so to another person seems pointless. Are we trying to elevate ourselves by seeing ourselves as "upper class" or "middle class" relative to "lower class?"
So the bottom line, is that I would say that there is NO objective upper, middle, or lower classes. Simply people with varying degrees of strengths and weaknesses, which are also subjective terms given that strengths and weaknesses are value-ladden labels that primarily exist in the mind of the person doing the evaluation.
In the US, being that it is the "land of opportunities", you wouldn't mind so much, as everyone is entitled to become something.
Here we don't focuse on the different classes due to the socialist roots in our way of perception and thought, where everyone is equal and no one is allowed to feel above others.
Where are you again? Denmark, right? Excuse my geographical ignorance....;)
I did not know you all were Socialist over there?
But I suppose that there are good elements of a Socialist philosophy. Obviously, I'm biased toward Capitalism, because of where I live; however, I also can see that there are philosophical strengths to a Socialist System that has an ideal that people should be treated equally.
Problem is, in my opinion, that human beings are also pretty self-interested, so to try and make people equal via government control is going to create problems at times.
So tell me Jac, where you live, to what level does the government have control of people's earnings? Does business work on a free economy type basis, with competetion among businesses, etc? Basically, the question is to what degree is government involved with your daily life and does it work or not work? I know nothing about where you are from.
and ?
You know thats how we are so why make an exhibition out of it ?
The welfare system here (which is along with Sweden's, the strongest in the world) is a result of a dominant social-democratic streak.
Everyone here might not be Social-Democratic but the general behavior bears a strong Social-Democratic influence. This would be that no one brags, no one is by any means cosidered better than anyone else, and no one talks openly about aspirations and hopes.
For example you would never hear a mother here telling her friends about her child's top-grades unless specifically asked.
That's in general though.
Myself I don't adhere to that school, and neither does my family.
I would say that the though behind the basis of our society is good, but with the broad opportunities one could expect better.
I think this article explains some stuff pretty well, and I find that I agree with it.
The state is involved in everything, though no one really thinks of it as it's "normal". Only time you hear uproars are when discussing taxes... Being that we have the highest tax-percentage in the world.
Because that TRQ is unfamiliar with the boards, and the mentality which is on show here, thought I'd explain why her post might be true but not appliable for most here.
Either way, I don't understand why you would get youself so worked up over it? I didn't demean you guys, and didn't say anything negative.
I've already told you about Holt and Burgess and their economic models of cities.
All cities will have rich areas and poor areas.
Why do you think London, the wealthiest city in the country has areas that would put India to shame
I wonder why that is.
I have heard of the success of the welfare system in Sweden, but did not know it applied to you all as well.
Many here in the United States point to it as an example of arguments for overhauling health care in this nation. But often, when there is discussion of "socialized medicine" in the media, people/voters get into an uproar.
As it stands, our welfare system has problems. Basically, "you get what you pay for." Not very equitable.
Also, I found it is interesting the example that you gave about people not bragging about their kids' accomplishments. So I guess you all don't have bumper stickers, like we do, that say, "My kid is an honor student at so-in-so Elementary School."
When I visited Japan, I found a similiar philsophy. Very different from us in the USA. We trump up our strengths in order to "sell ourselves" to potential employers which is completely opposite of how things are in Japan. In Japan, you must present yourself as humble and "not worthy" of the job, in order to get it. As a result, a Japanese friend of mine was having hell getting hired in the USA. We had to help him learn how to present himself with great confidence, and make himself look even better than he is. He was pretty uncomfortable with it at first, but after we got through coaching him, he FINALLY got a job.
Because lower class people are not the class i like to be associated with.
USA I dont like to be called Lower Class, its nothing to do with money but more the standards you set yourself too. Lower Class people 'tend' to be people i wouldnt want to be associated with.
These are just snobbery and show a complete lack of understanding aout diversity in entertainment...
What do you think of people who listen to both bach and Britney and see the value in both!
Nopes, actually people here are very "modest" concerning their kids accomplishments and their own.
When did I ever associate you with the lower class?
The post was not even about that!
It was about the fact that Brits emphasise difference in classes, nothing else.
Here's the strategy. You work to make yourself shine and act confident of your abilities and show great enthusiasm. Whatever the employer wants, is EXACTLY what you are offering them. You work hard, you have credentials (and if you don't, you assure them that you will catch on in no time at all), you are smart and motivated, etc.
Don't admit to weaknesses unless you can put a "spin" on them in order to make them positive. The perfect example, is that when the employer asks you, "What are some of your weaknesses". YOu would tell them, "I am much too detail oriented about my work" or "I spend way too many hours on my off time doing job-related work." These "weaknesses" are actually positives, in that they will benefit the company.
You do NOT tell them that you are late to work all of the time, and you can't get along with any of your colleagues or that you gossip all of the time, even if it is true.
No you didnt, it was whats his name
you see I dont think you quite understand that from my point of view to be called 'lower Class' is quite an insult. Im speaking for myself here and nobody else, but thats how I personally see it.
Hmmmm...I figure that whether or not I'd be offended by somebody calling me "lower class" depended on whether or not our definitions of the term agreed.
However, even if our definitions did agree, I don't like the implication that the word "lower" connotates....
For instance, if somebody called me lower class, and what they meant by the term, was somebody who grew up in a modest home, amongst people who cursed a lot, shot animals in the woods for food and sport (hunting), and who did not have a lot of formal education, I'd have to say, "Yes, that would be me." However, I would be slightly irritated by the term "lower" because it implies that there is something WRONG with that way of life. But then, I would only be slightly irritated because I would also realize that this person is ignorant and narrow minded. So, consider the source of the comment. If they are an elitist for no good reason, I would discount their opinions as the ramblings of someone who is insecure about their own status in life.
I fill some criterias on his list too. Who gives a shit?
He's a random, on the internet, who doesn't know you. And as long as he doesn't give you something positive to build on then there's absolutely no reason to take him seriously.
I do to be honest. If someone says something i dont like or disagree with then I will tell them so.
If he wants to start talking about different classes of people then thats fine by me, just as long as he knows what he's talking about............and in this instance he aint got a clue what he's talking about.
To give you an example, I'm guessing many of you have heard of Harvard University located in Boston in the USA, which is in the North East part of the USA. It is our version of Cambridge University.
Well, I was on an internship in Boston and many of my fellow students had graduated from places like Yale and Harvard, since the program I was enrolled in was somewhat prestigious.
Some of the Harvard people were discussing the "lower intellect" of non-Harvard people, particularly people from the Southern portion of the USA. Harvard is on the East Coast of the USA, while I'm from the deep Southern part of the USA.
So I sit there and listen to this self-congratulatory speech for a while. I finally made a comment that they were obviously insecure about their own abilities and thus, felt a need to "name drop" that they graduated from Harvard, as opposed to focusing on their own individual abilties. The conversation kinda lost its vitality after that.
These Harvardites (upper class) people were just as insecure as ANY person from a financially modest background would be if they went around talking about "snooty Harvard people." In both cases, the parties in question are insecure. The modest background person has a chip on their shoulder as they obsess about how somebody else thinks they are "low class" while the Harvardite who name drops all of the time, is really concerned that he/she is not smart enough on his/her own merits and so has to keep talking about the college itself in an attempt to convince the world and their own selves that they are smart.
So basically, consider the source. If you respect them, think they are good, honest, and talented people with good judgement on issues, then you might take their opinions seriously. If you think they are narrow minded on other issues, besides you, then who cares what they think? I ONLY consider the opinions of people who I respect. All others can bite me! :rolleyes: