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For lukesh, Major Tom and other frothing patriots
Former Member
Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
What is English/British culture anyway? I've tried to engage you on this question on some of the current threads and have been consistently ignored by you.
Come on, please articulate to me what this "Englishness" is that is being destroyed by immigration. Is it 6 pints, a kebab and a fight? A spliff, a can of Red Stripe and a jungle rave? Roast dinner on a Sunday? Morris Dancing? Cider & black and The Smiths? Voting BNP? Land of Hope & Glory, last night of the proms and weak chinned toffs called Tim Nice but Dim? A curry and a pint of lager? What?
Come on, please articulate to me what this "Englishness" is that is being destroyed by immigration. Is it 6 pints, a kebab and a fight? A spliff, a can of Red Stripe and a jungle rave? Roast dinner on a Sunday? Morris Dancing? Cider & black and The Smiths? Voting BNP? Land of Hope & Glory, last night of the proms and weak chinned toffs called Tim Nice but Dim? A curry and a pint of lager? What?
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You forgot the ol' fish n'chips matey!
actually fish and chips might not originate in England
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/3380151.stm
So are only English people the only group in the world to have a laugh? most of the comedy which comes from England now is pretty shite.
1) a lot of stuff which people consider to be english has influence from other cultures and places
2) the stuff u are saying is narrow minded and u are unable to take any point which disagrees with your world view
Who said that?
You're not answering the question, or indeed anywhere remotely near understanding what I'm getting at.
You keep saying things like
"London celebrates every other festival much 99% are nothing todo with Enlgihs culture"
"We need to bring back Enlgishness to England"
"99% of English people want a festival to celebrate our english culture."
"because englishness needs to be celebrated because it's the best culture in the world"
etc (and thats only half of one thread!), yet all you can come up with when defining this "Englishness" is "fish and chips.. people who can have alaugh, don't take things seriously.. football, sports as we invented a lot of them".
My point is that there is not one static, unchanging homogenous English culture. Culture is a mutable and plural thing, meaning many different things to different people at different times in differing contexts, but they can all be "English".
But according to you, its football and fish & chips. Don't you think that UK garage, jungle, indie, acid house, curry and kebabs are English as well? As is Elgar, country homes, foxhunting and, roast beef and wax jackets. As is football, lager and violence. And coalmining and shipbuilding (well, until Thatcher destroyed it). And ice creams, knotted hankies and Southend in the freezing cold.
My point is, the things that you get so worked up about, are becoming part of English culture, whether you like it or not. Cultures change. Deal with it or not. Its up to you. But you're gonna like mighty small minded working yourself into a frenzy about it.
Proving my point entirely. Thanks
You utter utter plank.
Oh for fucks sake! Are you being delibaretly thick or what?
The asian guy might eat different food to you, celebrate different festivals to you etc, but you have more in common with him because you will have similar experiences of being working class.
The toff might have the same colour skin as you, and might celebrate St Georges day, but what would you have in common? He's a rich toff who's never had to work, never had to deal with the crime on the streets etc.
Do you see what I'm getting at?
As for food, there isn't really an English food, unless you count a roast dinner?
English music/dance? Not really..when you think of traditional Spanish dance or Japanese dances for instance we don't have much to compare..maybe morris dancing??
Shakespeare? I'm clutching at straws a little bit but I don't think a culture comes from things as simple as food/dance/music. It's deeply ingrained. Manners are a big English thing. I got quite offended in the US when so many people did not use common courtesies like please and thank you.
Thank you.
For me it's pleasant villages where people attempt to play cricket - grimy mining towns - cockney rhyming slang - horrible beer - curries and kebabs in town and a liking for eating food that nutritionally has very little benefit - page 3.
We have great music, good fashion sense on the whole and generally people are far less rude.
We have a great sense of humour (particulary ironic humour) and I even love the way so many of us whinge (even those on here).
I think there's little doubt we have a strong culture. It may be influence by others but when it comes together it's still Englishness - and I love it
Because you have more in common with someone who doesn't necessarily share the same ideas of "Englishness" that you do, but has similar experiences of life.
"Englishness" and loving the country you live in has fuck all to do with flags, whether you celebrate St Georges day, Christmas, Eid or Ramadan. Its nothing to do with what God(s) you worship.
There isn't one conception of what it is to be "English". There are many and they are all valid.
I would agree with this.
But the point I'm getting at (Luke, take note) is that these things are more important than whether you celebrate St Georges Day or not, or whether you're Muslim or Christian.
Some of my Muslim mates have a far more wickedly dry sense of humour than some Christians I know.
Basically, I'm saying that the right wing traditional "patriotic" view of Englishness is far too limited, small minded and exclusive.
Again, I agree. See above.
But its also influenced by (and in turn influences) immigrant cultures. And thats peculiarly English as well. And I love it.
Wheras many immigrants into England consider themselves first and foremost (for example) loyal to their religion rather than being English/British.
But it doesn't have to be about a flag or St Georges Day or football teams. Start widening your horizons a bit.
It doesn't have to be anything. It can be whatever we want it to be. Stop limiting yourself.
Are you pretending to be stupid? Or is it for real?
I think that is what Blagsta is trying to say, but you seem to be offended (with an O - sorry, but you have spelt it affended SO many times) by how he has said it.
Oh I hadn't noticed...
What I'm trying to say is that it doesn't matter if you celebrate it or not. Do if you want, ignore it if you want.
Whether you do or don't has nothing to do with Englishness or lack of it.
Ya get me, sta?
Do you go to church?
Can you accept that some people in this country aren't Christian? And might not want to celebrate a Christian saint's day? Yet can still be English?