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Iraq...what the hell do we do now?
BillieTheBot
Posts: 8,721 Bot
As far as I'm concerned arguements over the legality of the war etc are now relatively pointles. Yes it would be nice to know, but what real difference is it going to make?
We have got ourselves in this mess and it has to be delt with, the US are already looking to pull out quick because of the election coming up there soon ish.
But to my mind we cant just pull out, what would become of Iraq, civil war? Extreamist Islam? Who knows, but it wouldnt be good.
Puts loads more troops in to stabilise the place? I just think they would be seen as more of the invading force.
The best option (which is still crap) is that the US pulls back from control, the whole thing is handed over to the UN and we try and get troops from Muslim countries there insted.
Anyone got any better ideas, the whole thing is really depressing because I cant see a way out of it that isnt disasterous.
We have got ourselves in this mess and it has to be delt with, the US are already looking to pull out quick because of the election coming up there soon ish.
But to my mind we cant just pull out, what would become of Iraq, civil war? Extreamist Islam? Who knows, but it wouldnt be good.
Puts loads more troops in to stabilise the place? I just think they would be seen as more of the invading force.
The best option (which is still crap) is that the US pulls back from control, the whole thing is handed over to the UN and we try and get troops from Muslim countries there insted.
Anyone got any better ideas, the whole thing is really depressing because I cant see a way out of it that isnt disasterous.
Beep boop. I'm a bot.
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Comments
We. Told. Them. So.!!!
:mad:
Back to the topic..
I agree with you about the best course of action: immediate withdrawal of Western troops (or at least those of the war cheerleading nations: US, Britain, Australia, Spain and Italy- and probably Poland as well), replaced by an predominantly-Arab multi-national force under the command of the UN. Handover of power to the Iraqis, and elections to be held in the very near future- 6 months max. And if a Muslim fundamentalist party or Saddam sympathisers win the election, then so be it.
It won't be perfect but is the best (and only viable) solution available.
I would couple this with UN sanctions against the US and Britain, in order to start the very long process of regaining the trust of an Arab and Muslim world that feels rightly persecuted under these crusading Christian warmongering hypocrites we have for leaders.
Actually, scrap that last part. Why should our countries pay for the actions of those two murdering bastards? Send them to the International War Crimes Tribunal instead. They wouldn’t look out of place sitting next to Milosevic anyway.
To be honest it looks like under pressure from the Democrates who will be running an anti-war stance the US will pull out too fast and leave the Iraqis just to get on with it. This will of course breed another whole country of people who hate the US.
If the coalition left it would be catastrophic IMO, leaving civil war behind, who knows where that would leave normal Iraqis. Things are not as bad as they seem, I think its just the anti-war people who are trying to claim some sort of victory. Since the war began I've had a feeling that some people actually wanted it to be a spectacular failure so they could be 'right'.
Saddam Hussein is a very bad man you know, I'm sure none of you will suggest that Bush or Blair could ever be compared to him.
I am just suggesting that the situation is getting less stable, something the Americans have eluded too, and in many places it could well be classed as unstable.
Far from the portrait of a happy, liberated people eternally grateful to the Americans the Bush government has been trying to push, the Iraqis are mighty pissed off at the continuing occupation by US troops, the lack of progress with water, electricity and other basic utilities, the lawlessness that makes Saddam-era Iraq look like a model of harmony, the installation of a US puppet regime that hasn't done much of anything (to put it mildly) in the 6 months or so they've been in power.
But above all, they are mighty pissed off about a trigger-happy, obnoxious cowboy US troops who don't have the slightest clue about peace-keeping or establishing good relations with the locals. The Iraqis might be glad that Saddam is gone, but they're certainly not grateful or happy at all with the continuing presence of what they see as a foreign, illegal, murderous invader who is seen as responsible for more and a decade of misery, bombings, famine and death.
Get the coalition troops out of Iraq now, and for good.
I can't argue with that, I was talking to a Royal Marine on leave about two months ago, I asked him about their feelings towards the American forces. I can't remember what his exact words were but it was something along the lines of them being useless cowboy bastards.
The coalition should stay until Iraq has a proper security force of its own.
http://publish.uk.indymedia.org/en/2003/10/279243.html
Looks like the spectre of past atrocities by Washington and our trigger happy Pentagon powermongers hasn't been forever buried after all.
What is most alarming and most condemning of this current administration (not mentioned in this article but which has been pointed out in the BBC World report) is that Rummy was also Secretary of Defence under Ford whilst the "investigation" was being carried out "quietly" by the Pentagon.
Can we hope against hope that some chance for his indictment and conviction for a lifetime of supporting crimes against humanity and attempted coverup might be drawing ever closer?
Present day report on US military atrocities against Iraqi citizens
Things now seem desperately out of control. According to the CIA itself there are now 50,000 resistance fighters in Iraq. It looks like things will get rather worse, and that Bush might be planning an early exit. Full story.
A short while ago we were discussing the increasing similarities between Iraq and Vietnam. Don't be surprised if we are yet to witness a scene similar to this:
Because I get the feeling the second the Iraqis regain control or their finances and their oil (if they are ever allowed that by the Americans) are going to say "not a penny from our revenues shall go to the policing or reconstruction of Iraq. Those who broke it should pay for it".
So then every UN nation would have contribute billions towards the mending of something they didn't want happening in the first place.
In the worse scenario Iraq will descend into a permanent civil war zone between factions while the rest of the world gradually lose the will to put things right, and eventually leave the fighting factions all to themselves.
A familiar story really.
"I should have said, I believed that I was serving the legitimately elected President and Vice President of the nation, Jeb and the Supreme Court said they were legitimately elected...".
or how about...
"Show me categorically where I ever said I was ever actually the lawfully appointed Secretary of Defence, I'm not even really here and didnt really launch any invasion in the first place!".
:rolleyes:
Hmmmm sounds more and more as if Tony and his gang have decided to adopt the Royal "we" and let the people be buggered, eh?
thriving markets and shopping malls ...rising property prices in the suburbs ...before ten years of amrican driven sanctions ...but even then property prices were rising ...reduced to rubble. bombed back to the stone age almost ...no electicity, no fresh water ...for huge sections of the population, no work ...no police force in place, no administration of any meaning at all in place ...
it could actualy be possible that the global outrage would demand UN sanctions against america and possibly the UK.
it's a crazy enough world. get the impression we might just be loosing this war?
"well we tried to help you Iraqis and now you dont want our help, well we'll just leave you to it then"
I think the US will continue with it isolationist policies too, and with parts of the world becoming more and more hostile this is only going to increase.
You have to remember how little a lot of Americans know of world politics, and more to the point how little some of them care.
sad 'cos it's so friggin true ...
Burundi have not oil.
Botswana have not oil.
etc,etc...
Burundi has not oil...
Botswana has not oil....
They are 'doing good' even if the world doesnt see that yet, Blair has more than once compared himself with Churchil for gods sake!
Thats why its not a huge concern if there are protests because they feel, or at least did feel they would be proven right in the end because of the greater good.
Shouldn't we be deeply worried that a man who believe such things is the leader of the only superpower and in charge of the nuclear button??? Sometimes I wonder if his IQ even hits double figures...
Would we be able to stop this happening?
Personally I think it was really only Saddam that stopped them from doing this a while ago. I just doubt they could ever work in a parliment together.
Yes, I could see a civil war between Islamists and other factions emerging. Let's hope it does not come to that...
Then what, I mean if they then start spouting hatred for the west (which is possible) then we have to liberate them again, and keep liberating them till the choose someone we like.