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CCTV - 1984 turning into reality....
Former Member
Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
Doesn't CCTV erode freedom?
Why should the state monitor your movements?
It's a waste of resources in watching people who do not commit crime!
Why should the state monitor your movements?
It's a waste of resources in watching people who do not commit crime!
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Does it? What freedom does it erode, precisely? Your freedom not to be watched? But wait, CCTV is only used in public places, where you have basically little or no privacy anyway, CCTV or no CCTV.
No CCTV.
The state has no right to monitor its citizens.
The problem is that we live in such a culture of fear that people are preaty much asking for an oppressive government, and the US is the worst for that.
Did you know the only person to vote against the Patriot Bill, did so because he hadnt read it, there were only TWO copies doing the rounds, yet everyone voted for it because they didnt want to be unpatroitic.
The next patriot bill will make internment legal for US citizens as well as non-US nationals. And no-one will protest because apparently we 'need' it to protect ourselves.
PNJ; how can you say you are from the 'home of the free' when you are about to have internment?
the legislation your country is bringing in and the guantanamo bay spectacle would suggest the terrorists are winning as well.
your fear factor is high ...the aim of terror ...and your rapidly erroding freedoms ...if any of it realy does have anything to do with terrorism ...shows that freedom is loosing and no one is loosing respect and freedom faster than the yanks.
As long as nobody watches me in my own home then I don't see it as erroding my freedom, the authorities have a duty to protect it's citizens from low lifes in public area's and this is a good way of doing it.
Do you feel scared and terrified when you walk past a camera on a busy street in London?
Its not so much the camaras its what is done with the result, with the new software coming of age it wont be long before the camara can adentify your face and follow you where ever you go, its this type of profiling that I find invasive. Its a short step between 'suspected' criminals and 'trouble makers', and then after that we're all fucked.
Remember once they take a freedom away from you its NOT coming back, all these measures are here to stay, dont kid yourself that they are short-term thing.
Draw your line in the sand and decide before its crossed how you will react.
Anyway, to answer your question Monocrat. Why should you be bothered about CCTV if you're not going to break the law? It's there to keep us safe.
it is a necessary evil that so far we have learned to live with but as bong says ...where is it moving to next with profiling and stuff?
you are right about lost freedoms never being regained as well bong ...i keep trying to warn the yanks about it!
what realy gets on my tits is the fact that millions of people are rushing out to by picture phones. self survielance!
'i left the pub half an hour ago dear'.
"show me".
you'll be able to download street scenes to prove your not where you realy are i suppose.
picture phone? ...no thankyou.
CCTV stops a lot of potential crime, which is better than having a crime committed and wasting taxpayers money on prosecuting those who could have been deterred had CCTV been in place.
It also helps prosecute those who are stupid enough to committ crime where there are CCTV cameras. Criminals are caught via CCTV everyday.
They have CCTV in shops, that has nothing to do with the govt. and they are able to detect shoplifters stealing. In the street CCTV can be used to capture car thiefs.
I have nothing to hide, so I don't give a damn about CCTV.
Monocrap - what with all these infringements of your rights you must be packing your bags between postings.... ready to head off into the land of the free.....
So let the police film criminals and not innocent people who have committed no crime.
How about I follow you through all of your actions 24hours a day videoing everything, in and out of your house, go through your rubbish, track your every movement, pull up profiles on all your freinds and everyone you have dealings with?
Its not the point of whether you are a criminal or not, people have the right to some privicy, the right to live your life without interfearance.
If you don't like being filmed I take it you don't go to shops then? Most shops have CCTV, and many larger stores have store detectives who will follow you around.
I think you're going a bit OTT saying we are filmed 24 hours a day. Perhaps you are saying that is how you feel CCTV is becoming? Well move away. Don't live here then. I for one am in favour of CCTV and would welcome more of it in areas with high crime rates.
You make no comment whatsoever on the fact that CCTV is used to deter a lot of crime. Take an incident a few weeks ago when a man was caught on CCTV trying to abduct a girl. It was caught on CCTV and the Police were sent. That girl was neither raped or aducted thanks to CCTV. Monocrat, would you advocate that CCTV be removed? In that instance a girl was being attacked and perhaps abducted. She could have been dead now. This is just one instance of where CCTV works.
I aggree with you though, CCTV is in many shops and in public areas and in theory I dont have a problem with that, as such, my concern is with whats done with the data, what controls are put on its use.
Personally, I think people should be more scared of the information that ruthless corporations have on us. Many large firms have files on customers - the ones who spend the most (how can they be lured to spend more? ), the ones who don't have any money (how can we make sure we don't sell to them?).
bongbudda, if that happened following you 24 hours a day with and videoing, that would be a complete invasion of your privacy and dont support that at all, yes they do have the right to live without interfearance, what would you do if they started putting cctv near your home with your house on the film what would you say about that?
I dont want to always have to protect 'big business' because I have reservations about the system we have too, BUT companies work within the rules that are set and enforced for them, who makes the law? If you want business to behave in a different way then complain about the government.
The business of business is business.
Shogun; As for CCTV near my house, I would ask why it was needed and attempt to gain justification for their position. If there wasnt then I would complain and campain against it.
So camera's should have a criminal radar or something? How can they film criminals if they aren't constantly on?
that is a very stupid thing to say...how can they just monitor criminals and not normal people as well...oh oh look there's a criminal, turn the camera on, catch him :rolleyes:
You actually have the right to see any footage in which you appear... whether used or not.
Try asking for the police to show you though...
The Govt love people who say things like that. Easy prey.
How many other rights don't you care about? Losing the right to freedom of speech won't *harm* you, but I doubt you'd give it up so easily.
This is about the right to walk freely without being under the constant scrutiny of the Govt. It makes no difference whether you have anything to hide or not, by monitoring everything you do [within the scope of the cameras] they Govt is effectively suggesting that you are guilty of something, they just haven't found out what yet...
If they have no reason to suspect *you* then why do they need to watch you?