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re: If the State Fails us
Former Member
Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
Sorry but that thread was actually valid for once and wasn't all pro gun anti gun rhetoric we've come to expect.
Back to the title though - crimes up, murders are up and violence with *gasp* firearms are up in England despite the ban. What then is the state doing? If not guns, why not mace, why not tear gas why not as I had in college, katana swords? By forbidding even the most basic weapons of defense the people in these provinces are made victim before a crime even happens, they become instead 'easy pickins' as they say here in the States.
A lot of you guys are young enough where you can actually think for yourselves and change the system later. Dont fall in line lock step with the liberal bs kids - while we may come off as extreme at times, we Americans do have it right: self defense is your right.
Back to the title though - crimes up, murders are up and violence with *gasp* firearms are up in England despite the ban. What then is the state doing? If not guns, why not mace, why not tear gas why not as I had in college, katana swords? By forbidding even the most basic weapons of defense the people in these provinces are made victim before a crime even happens, they become instead 'easy pickins' as they say here in the States.
A lot of you guys are young enough where you can actually think for yourselves and change the system later. Dont fall in line lock step with the liberal bs kids - while we may come off as extreme at times, we Americans do have it right: self defense is your right.
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Whats the matter toad - afraid you might learn something from intelligent thoughtful arguments?
It's been done over and over again, and it's boring. Leave it.
Kentish - and just what is my attitude towards violence. All I ever advocate is meeting force with force - if your force overpowers that of your attacker - so be it as your attacker had no right to inflict pain on you in the first place.
Im honestly not trying to turn this into a pro gun thread, rather a pro self defense thread.
I'll make it simpler for you by extending my anti-gun stance to an anti-weapons-on-the-streets one.
I hope that clears up your confusion.
Clears it up no doubt but thats utter foolishness. How can one adequately defend oneself against an armed attacker? Harsh words? Cries for the police? This trancends culture and politics Kentish - self defense is a basic human right.
You are using the same arguments as before, when you were going on about guns.
I won't agree, lets leave it.
technically though, ones foot (in my case steel toed boots) could be considered a weapon. It seems in your land as in mine - any form of retaliation to an attack is severely discouraged.
It is also illegal to carry a concealed weapon for one major reason.
It is impossible to persuade a court that you were carrying it for self defence. They automatically assume you were carrying it in order to inflict harm on others.
Don't complain, or say how shitty it is, it is the law, a law that makes sense and a law we have lived with for decades.
Never said it was stupid - just that its one that I have a really hard time grasping. Surely its better to fight back seeing as nowadays, people will beat you AND take the money!
As far as concealed weapons - homey of course I want to harm an attacker - the attacker by way of inciting an attack is inflicting harm on me and therefore is deserving of whatever I give him - jeez you cant even have mace!@!! Thats not even harmful!
No, you misunderstand. It is illegal because it is impossible to prove that you didn't intend to strike the first blow as it were. Carrying of concealed weapons if it is your second offence can see you propelled to the worring vicinity of the crown court and a jail sentence.
ANd I think thats what I disagree with - having a weapon, even mace in the case I prescribe is a preventive measure as recognized in the States. Why not the same in England?
Because it is too easy to be accused of carrying it for offensive purposes and not defensive. Many people carrying them for offensive purposes have said that it was for defence only, then they go out and stab someone. because of that the courts don't believe anyone in an effort to clean up the streets.
As for MACE, we use C.S. gas which i believe has a slightly different chemical makeup. CS gas is only available to the police, as it can only be washed out with chemicals, and they dont want people walking the streets carrying the stuff.