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Why we need to attack
BillieTheBot
Posts: 8,721 Bot
I agree that the march on saturday did obviously show that a lot of people in this country disagree with the war.
However, it is still not truly representative, and we should topple Saddam before he really does get the chance to attack us.
I know it isn't the best paper around, but I was reading the mail today, and in it there was an interview from a journo who was in Iraq at the end of the Gulf war. She was standing with an American soldier who was nearly in tears, he felt sorry for the thousands of innocent Iraqis who were dying under Saddam's "beneveolant" rule, and couldn't bring himself to tell the the civilians pleading with him to help them that politics were stopping him from doing it.
Yes, there may be alterior motives from Bush and Blair, but at the end of the day Saddam is still torturing his own people, and if given the chance will attack us too.
Just a thought.
However, it is still not truly representative, and we should topple Saddam before he really does get the chance to attack us.
I know it isn't the best paper around, but I was reading the mail today, and in it there was an interview from a journo who was in Iraq at the end of the Gulf war. She was standing with an American soldier who was nearly in tears, he felt sorry for the thousands of innocent Iraqis who were dying under Saddam's "beneveolant" rule, and couldn't bring himself to tell the the civilians pleading with him to help them that politics were stopping him from doing it.
Yes, there may be alterior motives from Bush and Blair, but at the end of the day Saddam is still torturing his own people, and if given the chance will attack us too.
Just a thought.
Beep boop. I'm a bot.
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Comments
You keep deluding yourself that this is moral crusade and not a further regional grab for corporate and geo-political control. we'll see how attentive you are to what's going on there and who might be profiting in 5 years time or even 10. Same old story, youll simply forget about the country when it falls out of the headlines.
The BNP oppose the war. It is New Labour which supports the war.
Yes, I believe that should be obvious. Given how the European economy, and the British economy too, is falling into a massive recession now is not the best time to be going on foreign adventures to Iraq that will costs hundreds of billions of dollars.
ROFL! Who is that that is wanting to attack who? If Saddam wants to attack the British and Americans so bad, why the hell hasn't he already done it? Why hasn't crazy Saddam, the irrational madman attacked Kuwait? What is he waiting for? Why doesn't he go ahead and attack those massing troops before they are in position?
I know it isn't the best paper around, but I was reading the mail today, and in it there was an interview from a journo who was in Iraq at the end of the Gulf war.
LOL do not even give me bullshit about "caring" about civilians. America's allies throughout the world slaughter god only knows how many thousands of civilians annually. America's massive sanctions on Iraq as well have also killed thousands. You have to love the humanitarians with the gullitoine who use food as a weapon! Of course it was the United States that was giving hundreds of millions of dollars to the dictator of Somalia at the height of the Somalian famine.
LOL! The Kurds? Turkey tortures BY FAR more Kurds than Iraq ever has. Turkey has laid waste to thousands of Kurds driving them out of Southeastern Turkey by the millions! What is George W. Bush doing? Why of course, he is about to pay the corrupt and sadistic regime in Turkey TENS OF BILLIONS of dollars. That should not come as a suprise since America has given Israel TENS OF BILLIONS of dollars in foreign aid, both military aid and economic welfare for its population for decades which was so proud of its official policy of torture it even held it up as a model for America to imitate! You want to stop torture? Why don't you stop the torture of Americans in YOUR OWN prisons? Why don't you stop all the massive rapes in American prisons tolerated by guards? And one more thing, it was not Saddam Hussein who "gassed" Americans in Waco, Texas.
Lastly. .. The BNP banner above says it all.
The British National Party opposes the war on Iraq for the following reasons:
It isn’t our war!
This war is about the personal vanity of Bush and Blair. It’s about securing bigger profits for American oil companies. It’s about the power of the Israeli lobby in the US media and in British and American politics.
Saddam Hussein may well be an unpleasant dictator, but that’s a problem for the Iraqi people, and not for us. The civil liberties of every person in Iraq and the security of Iraq’s Middle Eastern neighbours are not worth the bones of one British soldier.
There’s no case for this war!
Despite all the propaganda, Blair has presented no evidence for a link between Iraq and Islamic fundamentalist terrorism. Iraq wants to trade with Britain - exchanging oil for food, medicine and equipment to rebuild an economy shattered by a decade of Western bombing and blockades - not to fight us.
The terrorism and fundamentalist expansion that threatens Britain and British interests – including here at home – is financed and inspired from Saudi Arabia rather than Iraq. Saddam Hussein is a secular dictator, not an Islamic extremist. Bush and Blair are about, in the words of Winston Churchill, to “kill the wrong pig.”
National sovereignty, not internationalist meddling!
Every nation on earth is entitled to secure the weapons it needs to deter a potential aggressor. Iraq is as entitled to so-called “Weapons of Mass Destruction” as America, Britain or Israel. The U.N. and the ‘international community’ have no right to dictate to sovereign free peoples how to run their own affairs, or what weapons of deterrence they can have. We wouldn’t accept this One World meddling for Britain, so why should we force it on Iraq?
Blair’s war makes us all targets!
Being seen as America’s puppet makes us a target for terrorists. If it were necessary for British interests this would not deter us, but as this isn’t our war it’s madness.
The war could rip our cities apart!
Blair’s war will put a huge extra strain on community relations in our towns and cities. TV coverage of British warplanes frying thousands of Muslim conscripts will lead directly to a further surge in anti-white race attacks in places like Oldham, Bradford, Birmingham and Luton. This raises the spectre of a communal conflict that would see entire neighbourhoods go up in flames and ethnic cleansing riots. Again, if the war were in Britain’s interests this would be a price of the multi-racial society we would have to pay. But as it’s Blair’s war, not ours, it is a wholly unnecessary risk.
Blair’s war will add to the asylum flood!
The war will displace more than 100,000 additional asylum seekers. Many will come to Britain, adding to the asylum crisis. Britain can’t cope with the present wave of spongers, without adding 100,000 more refugees from an unnecessary war.
Blair’s war will cost us a fortune! Blair’s war will place huge strains on the West’s economy and on the British taxpayer. When our own hospitals are falling apart, it’s hardly the time to spend £ millions destroying hospitals halfway round the world. The billions Blair is about to blow on his war should be used instead to rebuild our Health Service.
If you were in a shop, and had a choice between stealing some sweets while everyone is watching or waiting a while until people have forgotten, which would you do?
If we leave Saddam long enough, he won't hesitate to attack us or his neighbours. Noone in Iraq will object like people here are doing because they'll be shot.
It won't be a case of live and let live, Saddam wants revenge for his humiliating defeat in 1991, and the constant pressure his nation has been under to comply for the last 12 years. Instead of attacking while he is weak and we are strong, he'll wait. It's what any sane person would do, and it's what Hitler did in the 30's. He waited until he knew we'd do nothing to stop him and he waited until we were too weak to oppose him.
Why are people so unable to see the past repeating itself?
a) The west is not constantly watching Iraq, this will never happen whilst the regime is deemed hostile
b) Saddam has enough strength to actually pose a serious threat
and probably
c) he would actually attack anywhere, knowing full well that any attack will result in his complete obliteration.......
I undersdtand the arguments about freeeing the Iraq people but I cannot see war as being that way.
Also if we do go ahead with the war, who will rule afterwards, what will happen to the Kurds, will the Turks be involved, have there been provisions for refugees and humanitarian aid to match the scale of the crisis?
These questions need to be answered sufficiently....
I agree with many of the things the liberals are saying on the site. But the point about civil liberties or things the West has done to people in the past are valid points and miss the point. The point is: how are we going to keep our countries safe so people can live AND work. Don't forget how many people lost their jobs over these fanatics. Someone from Scotland Yard said with the IRA, they didn't want to die either. But when you're dealing with people who don't care if they die too, you can't reason with them. That sounds reasonable to me.
lol. no they didn't. you cannot DEcrypt 4048bit key encryted data in less than 10000 years with current technology. Even 256bit [the lowest the last version of PGP used] still requires around 1 year of dedicated computer time to decipher. You also have to have a tap on every data line - IP by its nature uses different paths to route, so if you send on ethrough a logging source, this adds delays and IP routes around it.....
if you're talking about echelon, that is a US thing, just happens to have a few bases in the uk - it mainly intercepts mobile phone calls. and its entire use is to listen in on business calls, not terrorists. if the uk had wanted to we could have wiped out 90% of the current members of the PIRA etc, just doing so would have just created more
just like what will happen if you try to kill current AQ members. you just create more.
Surely this statement alone is enought to throw doubt on any attack!!?
their reasons should not be 'alterior' ones
Help free the people held by the US without trial in the camps/prisons in Cuba! :mad:
Your such a fragile dove. Free Northern Ireland!!!!
Freeing a brutalized people? America and Great Britain have been BRUTALIZING those people for years! These are the countries that use WATER and FOOD as weapons! Iraq has never occupied Great Britain and massively exploited its population - unlike how in past history Great Britain has exploited Iraq! Winston Churchill himself was "strongly in favour of using gas against uncivilized tribes." Winston Churchill also shed not tears for the Palestinians who like the blacks of Australia and the Indians of America were being deplaced by a "superior race." Ha! How would you feel if Iraq decided to create the independent nations of Scotland and Ireland out of the UK or the independent nations of Alaska and Hawaii out of the United States? Do not give me any crap about "freeing" the people of Iraq either. America is going to install a military dictatorship over Iraq under General Tommy Franks.
LOL imagine if Americans decided to seal off all American blacks in "homelands" like Israel. Imagine if America declared itself to be a white nation and expelled all Black members of Congress. Of course this was INTOLERABLE in the case of South Africa, whom in self righteous hypocrisy was destroyed with massive international pressure, despite having fought for American and Great Britain in TWO World Wars. Segregation and Bantustans are fine for Israel, EVIL for America. :rolleyes:
You think? Perhaps if Tony Blair and George W. Bush were not letting in so many absolute total foreigners with their irresponsible immigration policies we would be less likely to be attacked. Of course the INS later sent Mohammed Atta a VISA! There are over 10 million undocumented illegal aliens running around America, thousands of whom are Iraqis! There are so many illegal aliens in America they would constitute a nation with twice the population of the State of Israel! George W. Bush and Tony Blair however are bound and determined to protect the borders of every nation in the world other than our own! These are the people who say they are "fighting terrorism." Ha!
Yes, that says a lot about the "free world" does it not? In Great Britain you can be arrested and prosecuted under European laws for "thought crimes." Who are these charlatans to speak of bringing freedom to Iraq! Bomb every nation in the world. Incite every terrorist on earth. Make absolutely sure every potential terrorist can run across the Mexican border or enter Britain as an asylum seeker. Do everything possible to incite another attack! Respond to the attack by cracking down on civil liberties. Switzerland does not have a terrorist problem.
Oh wait! I see. Some rights are more important than others! What we need in America is an Orwellian State to "protect our freedom." Ha! It is the U.S. and British Governments that are FAR AND AWAY more of a threat to the freedom of their citizens than Saddam Hussein, his army of camels, and his ragged and pathetic Third World military sitting on sand dunes in the Iraki desert! It is the U.S. Government which backed Saddam Hussein for years, encouraged him to brutalize his people, armed him to the teeth with chemical and biological weapons, whom bomn Iraq to incite terrorism, who allow the terrorists into the country, who do everything possible to encourage MORE terrorist attacks. MORE terrorist attacks encourage MORE spending and MORE government. Interventionism ALWAYS backfires.
Oh yes right, I forgot how Great Britain liberated Ireland by occupying it! Imposing your will on others incites hatred. Why can't you just leave people alone? Is America not a big country? Do you not have better things to do than to run the lives of Iraqis and the Irish?
LOL I think history speaks for itself how the British "protected" the population of Ireland or the population of India for that matter.
America is not a Western Nation. America seceded from the West a long time ago. America is about as Western as Bulgaria. Americans have done more to DESTROY Western Civilization than any people since the Mongols and Saracens.
Once again America is not a Western Nation and every Western Nation is massively opposed to America's war in its name. The O'Reilly Factor, Puff Daddy, and Joe Millionaire are not representative of Western Culture in the least.
I am not a Liberal.
What the West and the United States has done to people in the past is one of the main reasons cited by the terrorists as the rationale for their war.
Very easy. STOP TRYING TO RUN THEIR LIVES. Let them go about their own way of life. STOP TRYING TO IMPOSE YOUR WILL ON FOREIGN NATIONS. STOP THREATENING THEM. STOP TRYING TO BE THE ROMAN EMPIRE.
These people are not fanatics at all. Someone who is willing to die, to strap a bomb to themselves and commit suicide is passionately motived by a deep sense of injustice. The REAL fanatics are those who are trying to dominate a region on the otherside of the world. That is as plain as day to common sense. That was the foreign policy of the United States for decades, the foreign policy of the founders of your OWN country who KNEW what it felt like to be dominated and imposed upon. You can't simply be content to leave them alone. You have to impose your views upon them and they resist you. Americans would act in precisely the same manner if the shoe was on the other foot. In fact they did, they terrorized loyalists to the British Crown to drive out the foreigners to gain their independence.
You can't reason with people who seek to dominate and impose their views upon others, those who wish to exploit the resources of foreign nations, who for some reason cannot understand why they are so bitterly resented.
Are you planning to send to Cuba the surviving members of the Iraqi army as well?
As for Al Qaida members, why not charge them? They're members of a terrorist organisation are they not? Open and shut case.
I’ve already heard a rumour –at least I think I did- that more people are dying in North Korea than Iraq (I think that what I heard, I don’t know that to be sure 100% sure)
So will these figures be waved in our faces after the Saddam campaign comes to an end (If It ever will!)
And I doubt very much our government or the US’s has any real interests in helping the people of any other country, yet they pour out all the figures to make us believe that this war is to help them, and rid Saddam of his arsenal of course.
These are uneasy times, and I personally don’t believe war is needed, I’m more worried about Britain and her safety. I don’t believe Saddam can threaten us directly. But others already in Britain can!!
Maybe I’m a bad or selfish person, but I want to put my county safety first before anything else.
The argument about the threat posed by immigrants is inherently ridiculous....
If you do not understand why then look at some other threads or ask away.......
Anyone who believes that massive Third World immigration to the United States has not been a threat should look at the ruins of the World Trade Center or California's fiscal black hole this year.
On the one hand, Saddam Hussein is a brutal dictator who kills and tortures his own people.
On the other hand a war would cause death and destruction, and no doubt Britain would have to mop up the mess left behind for years to come.
Its a no-win situation.:(
No, actually I don't. The same people who gave Mohammed Atta an American VISA let John Lee Malvo run around on a killing spree a few months ago in Maryland.
LOL
Do you think that if there VISA application failed they would just give up?
Why do you need to meet every point with a comparison, it is possible to look at events in isolation........
You know, kind of like the ones that used to exist between NATO and the Warsaw Pact..
It didn't work either, but let's not let reality intrude...
Bearing in mind that the entire nation (if you exclude the "Indians") is based on immigration that's a pretty fucking stupid comment.
Even the "Natives" were immigrants, MOK.