If you need urgent support, call 999 or go to your nearest A&E. To contact our Crisis Messenger (open 24/7) text THEMIX to 85258.
Read the community guidelines before posting ✨
Options
Biggest ever anti-war demo in London on February 15
Former Member
Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
There will be the biggest anti-war demonstration in the history of Britain on Saturday February the 15th. It will assemble at 12 noon at the Embankment and start off at 12:30pm going to Hyde Park. The last major anti-war demonstration in London was 150,000 strong and that was the police estimate! This one will be even bigger. Full details are at http://www.stopwar.org.uk.
As well as this coming demonstration there have been calls for mass civil disobedience such as road blockades and blockades of military bases. Some acts of disobedience have already being carried out by groups of several hundred.
The threat posed by Iraq is based on speculation and is being hyped out of all proportion. Even American politicans have said that Iraq would not dare use a weapon of mass destruction it self but might be a threat should the Iraqi regime team up with a terrorist group, ie speculation!
A war on Iraq would cause terrible suffering for the Iraqi people who have already suffered more than enough under 12 years of economic sanctions and from the devastation of their country in the last Gulf War. Over one million have died due to economic sanctions which have prevented the rebuilding of water and sewage treatment plants damaged in the last Gulf War leading to massive outbreaks of water borne diseases which cannot be treated due to lack of medical equipment. No matter how bad Saddam Hussein is the Iraqi people certainly don't need another war.
the anti-war movement has grown massively on both sides of the Atlantic since the so called war on Terrorism started in 2001. We can stop this war and we will stop this war!
As well as this coming demonstration there have been calls for mass civil disobedience such as road blockades and blockades of military bases. Some acts of disobedience have already being carried out by groups of several hundred.
The threat posed by Iraq is based on speculation and is being hyped out of all proportion. Even American politicans have said that Iraq would not dare use a weapon of mass destruction it self but might be a threat should the Iraqi regime team up with a terrorist group, ie speculation!
A war on Iraq would cause terrible suffering for the Iraqi people who have already suffered more than enough under 12 years of economic sanctions and from the devastation of their country in the last Gulf War. Over one million have died due to economic sanctions which have prevented the rebuilding of water and sewage treatment plants damaged in the last Gulf War leading to massive outbreaks of water borne diseases which cannot be treated due to lack of medical equipment. No matter how bad Saddam Hussein is the Iraqi people certainly don't need another war.
the anti-war movement has grown massively on both sides of the Atlantic since the so called war on Terrorism started in 2001. We can stop this war and we will stop this war!
0
Comments
part of me would love to be there with you. a greater part won't be supporting you. just because the reasons being given for this war are bullshit, doesn't mean this war isn't right for the times and moments we live in.
i DO want the western world to continue prospering and being the ones who shape events. i realy don't want arabs, indians and pakistani's, eskimo's or red indians being in charge. we may have cheated, lied and robbed our way into our affluence but this is not the time to start feeling guilty about it. believe me, wether you like it or not, human nature dictates that someone, will always be on top. whoever that someone happens to be is going to have blood on thier hands.for now i'm ready to go along with the obvious aims of keeping my place in the pecking order.
to try at this moment in time to atone for our sins would be a fucking major mistake in my book.
i applaud your efforts, i realy do.
Ooooh, no I'm sure the army are bothered about you trying to blockade a military base. You do realise that during a time of war they can shoot you, I personally think they'll be doing the country a service.
If they don't shoot you they'll simply drive through you, either one will see your protest end quite messily.
As for Iraq, the only reason Iraq has sanctions on it is because Saddam is obsessed with taking over the world, and of course, it's our fault he invaded Kuwait because we trained some of his soldiers back in the eighties :rolleyes:
water borne diseases could be stopped if Saddam stopped spending money on the military, if he put his resources into public welfare his country wouldn't be the crap hole it is now, but of course it's our fault he buys tanks instead of making a clean water supply, and I do very much doubt we actually bombed water treatment plants.
Wake up and get a clue steelgate you dumb freak.
It is the sanctions that are preventing Iraq from importing medical equipment and strict limits on trade with Iraq that are hampering the rebuilding of Iraq more than anything else! Under the economic sanction imposed by the UN Iraq is only allowed to earn a tiny amount from foreign trade which is not enough to rebuild the country and vurtualy no medical equipment is allowed to enter the country either.
Those water and sewage treatment plants definitely were bombed and destroyed during the last Gulf War. Iraq was relentlessly pounded causing massive destruction to its infrastructure and cities during that war as well as causing tens of thousands of deaths and injuries. Iraq was an advanced country with excellent health care and life expectancy before the last Gulf War which was reduced to the level of an impoverished Third World country because of it.
Another war simply can't be justified as it will cause many more thousands of deaths, injuries and destruction to one of the poorest countries in the world which has already suffered far too much.
The voices in the wolderness website has full details on how the sanctions have affected Iraq.
Saddam CAN afford weapons, tanks, soldiers and to pay scientists who have defected from the old USSR, but he can't afford to build some water treatment plants, and this is OUR fault? Get a clue, you're embarassing yourself.
And any war on Iraq would be totally inhumane and unjustifiable considering the enormous ammount of death and destruction it would cause to the hundreds of thousands of people who would be made homeless or suffer and die! Iraq needs help in the form of aid and the lifting of sanctions to enable it to rebuild its country and feed its people.
The word, I think, is "domestic".
It was nice to see demonstrators in DC had adopted that line. Many of the placards read: "Protect our Troops- Say No to War".
LMFAO, "only a small percentage". Do you have any idea how much it costs to maintain a standing army as large is Saddam's? Maybe he doesn't pay them, but he still has to clothe them, feed them, provide weapons, provide munitions and fuel. He's got to get it from somewhere, and he has to buy it using money better spent on the people.
Don't for one second suggest this is all our doing when instead if he diverted the billions of pounds necessary to maintain his army and NBC programme he could rebuild his country.
If you want any more evidence look at other country's that have invested mainly in the Armed forces, look at Russia, during the 1950s and 60's it was one of the most economically powerful nations around, until it started trying to compete with the USA and diverted resources to the military.
Its economy has been crippled because of it.
"If UN sanctions were lifted then Iraq would be able to sell more oil to raise more money to rebuild the country. It is the effect of sanctions that have crippled the Iraqi economy far more than anything else! Only a small percentage of Iraqs gross desmesic product is spent on arms, even if Iraq was to spend all of its gross demostic product on rebuilding Iraq it still would be nearly enough."
Partly right. The war against Iran broke Iraq too and he continues to spend millions on acquiring nuclear weapons. Some of that was the oil for food money.
For instance, France was paid $250,000,000 for a nuclear reactor and other timing devices etc. that could be used to acquire nuclear bomb capabilities...before I was born in the 70's. He also offered a lot of money to Russian soldiers for nuclear materials.
ROTFLMMFAO!
Exactly what would you suppose that Sodamn Insane has done with the 50,000,000,000 dollars worth of oil that he has smuggled out of Iraq in the last decade?
If Insane would adhere to the accords he signed, then the cease-fire from a decade past would remain. If Insane switched his priorities from his self-possessed agenda to actually being a leader of his nation - and working for the welfare of them, rather than his own - then this would be a non-issue.
Just because your own personal agenda is returning the world to the stone-age so that your communist mind-fuck ideal might have a chance of existence does not mean that the rest of the world would buy into your justification of "unjustifiable"...
Tell you what... hand me that $50,000,000,000... and then stand back and witness the whole of Europe joining Atlantis in "history"... because you would not find even a trace to mark its passing.
Although many in my circle fullly support the coming reality, not one of them "glories in the destruction of human life in Iraq", but rather, see it as the lesser of two evils, and necessary to put an end to the evil embodied by one demonic despot. All of the temporizing by those such as you or clandestine-collaborator will not stay that reality... You are an inconsequential pissant, and pissing into the winds of reality will net you your just reward.
War is the very last thing Iraq needs! I have no respect for the men and women in uniform who are going to commit this terrible act of death and destruction on the Iraqi people, they are murderers and terrorists plain and simple. The only armed service personnel who desreve respect are those who refuse to fight in this burtal unjust war!
By the way even if Iraq has managed to smuggle a small amount of oil out of the country economic sanctions are imposed on vital medical equipment so they are still causing deaths!
http://www.stopwar.org.uk
What do you mean "even". The only reason Iraq is in the current state is because of precisely that. Saddam had the OPTION to sell huge quantities of oil in exchange for food and medicines. he instead chose to smuggle small amounts in exchange for military equipment.
The economic sanctions prevent him BUYING medical supplies, he is still allowed to exchange them for oil, but refuses.
War may be the last thing Iraq needs, but it's the first thing it deserves.
Saddam deserves to watch as his country disintegrates around him, he deserves to watch his "glorious" armies crushed and to see Bagdhad vanish under a ball of fire and he deserves a bullet to the back of the head.
Instead of providing for his people, he has continued to purchase and manufacture military hardware and NBC weaponry. Many times he has been given the chance to stop, and in return recieve money, food and medical supples.
EVERY time he has told the UN, USA and UK to stuff their generosity up their arses.
Yes, we damaged some of Iraq's infrastructure, Saddam continued what we did by refusing to send money to stricken towns and cities that were facing starvation and drought. It is HIS fault, not ours.
And yes, we are justified in attacking him, a few hundred Iraqi civilians dying is justified if it means millions more are saved.
Whilst it is true that Saddam does not use his money in the best way for his people :rolleyes: there are also strict limits on what Iraq can import because of the dual use nature of many items.
This means that many standard items cannot be found in Iraq (apart from in Saddams palaces no doubt) because of the potential military use.........
It made me laugh a while ago when Playstation 2 was launched and someone said that a few hundred units out of the tens of millions sold worldwide might have ended up in Iraq. Apparently the console is so advanced Saddam technicians might be able to use its components to build guidance systems for Iraq's missiles. That if they don't get distracted and end up playing Crash Bandicoot all day long.
Well if the man is allowed immunity in return for leaving the country he can always come to Britain and present Blue Peter: "And now childrrrren, I'll show you how to build a spaceship capable of doing warp 8 speeds with an old washing machine, and ironing board and a bottle of Fairy liquid".
Then you sir are a traitor to your country. You are also misguided and your mind is not your own.
The correct term for people like me is concentious objector by the way in which a person may refuse military service in a war if it goes against their religous or moral beliefs!
There is also a planned mass sit down protest at Piccadilly Circus at 5pm after the demonstration organised by ARROW - active resitance to the roots of war. Full details of it are here.
Actually, I think the point raised, particularly if you look at the quote in context, is that you are such for refusing to respect the men and women who lay their lives on the line for this country.
Conscientious.
And you're not being called up, are you? You're not a serving officer/soldier, are you?
Then you're not a conscientious objector; you're just another guy in the street.
A sit-down protest. How useful.
You want to actively resist the roots of war?
Interesting. Perhaps you could tell us all exactly what the roots of war *are*.
Has the demo happened yet?
No.
So how do you know it will be 'the biggest ever'. You don't. So don't bother quoting that at us, will you?
Oh, Aladdin, why does Iraq actually need graphite pencils?
More likely the Iraqi children will have to write and draw using crayons, pens or other instruments and miss out on the benefits pencils provide: shading, erasing, tracing...
Let's see, reasons why you are a traitor to your country....
1.)You want to see innocent lives in Iraq saved, fine that's noble. However if it means millions of people here die from some sort of plague then you aren't bothered.
2)You advocate the destruction of government and public property
3)you advocate the disruption of military supplies and personnel, potentially causing the deaths of service personnel abroad.
4)You advocate the attack and ridicule of military personnel even though they are trying to protect us
5)You advocate and participate in disrupting police enquiries in the attempt to stop terrorism
Stop me when you've had enough....
6)You put the lives of terrorists and criminals from this country and abroad before the lives of innocent British civilians
7)You think that ordinary civilians should be made to pay the conscequences by disrupting their lives, even though your beef is with the government
You see Steely, you are a traitor, and I hope that if and when war starts the government finds you and puts you out of our misery. This country doesn't need people like you disrupting things while we prepare for war. What good does disrupting military personnel and supplies do once the war has started except to serve to get our soldiers killed?
Firstly, due to a quirk of British law, Treason is still a capital offence.
Secondly...
How can they develop proper geographers without colouring pencils? Huh?
Foolish Iraqis; they don't know what they're missing...
At any rate, the demonstrations were small....especially since America has a population of over 287 million. Overnight, American flags appeared all over the place on houses and shops again. Just like they were after 9/11.
Most people in the US don't want to go into Iraq without the UN. I trust Bush and Blair.