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A farce to be reckoned with?
Former Member
Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
Not that wasn't a typo, that is how the Daily Express desctribes the Tory party today, apparently.
And it really highlights their problems at the moment.
IDS is clearly having problems. Not only is his party divided but he also seems to be getting his arse kicked by Blair at PM Questions every week. This week saw a revolt of 30+ MPs (a quarter of the total Tory MPs) against his three line whip and whilst only 8 actually voted against the party, many other abstained.
Then yesterday came his "unite or die" comment. The Irony being that he voted against the Major Govt on 50+ occasions, mainly on Europe.
Now, whilst I revel in this mess and laugh at the Tories expense, I have to admit some concern over the future direction of UK politics.
There is no apparent, decent, leadship challenger to IDS and the Tories appear to be on the verge of implosion. And even if they do find a successor, there are so many old open wounds that I think the heir apparent would have difficulty uniting them. Yet they are the main opposition to the Labour Govt - certainly the Liberals aren't yet strong enough to take on the role. Which means that we are potentially looking at a third straight landslide for Blair.
This troubles me, not because I don't think that Labour are doing any good, but because there needs to be an effective opposition...
What do other think, are we watching the Tory Party dissolve? Would that necessarily be a "bad" thing? And do the Liberals offer an alternative?
And it really highlights their problems at the moment.
IDS is clearly having problems. Not only is his party divided but he also seems to be getting his arse kicked by Blair at PM Questions every week. This week saw a revolt of 30+ MPs (a quarter of the total Tory MPs) against his three line whip and whilst only 8 actually voted against the party, many other abstained.
Then yesterday came his "unite or die" comment. The Irony being that he voted against the Major Govt on 50+ occasions, mainly on Europe.
Now, whilst I revel in this mess and laugh at the Tories expense, I have to admit some concern over the future direction of UK politics.
There is no apparent, decent, leadship challenger to IDS and the Tories appear to be on the verge of implosion. And even if they do find a successor, there are so many old open wounds that I think the heir apparent would have difficulty uniting them. Yet they are the main opposition to the Labour Govt - certainly the Liberals aren't yet strong enough to take on the role. Which means that we are potentially looking at a third straight landslide for Blair.
This troubles me, not because I don't think that Labour are doing any good, but because there needs to be an effective opposition...
What do other think, are we watching the Tory Party dissolve? Would that necessarily be a "bad" thing? And do the Liberals offer an alternative?
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Comments
mouthing the words. they have already dissolved from what i can see. mcdonalds and microsoft will be running the show soon...
All very bad for party unity, but surely those members have been elected by their constituants for there morals, ethics, policies, and understanding....
So surely they should vote on any given issue as they see fit, and not vote in a certain way just because the party leader says so.
If all the members vote just as their leader tells them, and not following their own judgement (they are mostly quite intelligent poeple), then when 1 party has more members than the others put together (like we have now) there is no hope of ever mounting an opposition, as the party in majority will always win.
Surely, for this reason, IDS should be encouraging MP's to vote for right, vote for the good of the people and the good of the country, rather than blindly following orders simply to have "party unity".
Whereas I am delighting in the Tory shambles and savouring every word in the newspapers, it is true that it's bad for the country at large to have a government running business unchecked. The tories have been a joke of an opposition since the defeat in 1997. There have been two clear and separate wings in the party, and a constant struggle for power between them. Ultimately, for as long as the party refuses to truly modernise and get rid of the ghosts of the past that are dragging it down- Thatcher and thatcherism, Norman Tebbit, the sleaze stories and yesterday politicians that won't go away, the antiquated and reactionary policies, the undying link with 'Daily Mail' mentality- it will not get anywhere near Downing St. There are lots of voters out there unhappy with Labour, but after one look at the state of the tories, who can't blame people for not voting for them? The much-trumpeted grassroots conservatives are mostly pensioners with one foot in the grave. As long as the conservatives don't modernise and try to embrace a younger, more open minded electorate they will remain in the wilderness.
But most important, if it does not resolve its differences between its two wings the party will break up. There will be the right-wing, reactionary anti euro Conservatives and the left-wing (for want of a better expression) pro-euro, modernising Conservatives. Maybe one day one of those two camps will be big enough to win a general election. But the outcome is not good for them.
Blair is not doing well AT ALL. We NEED effective opposition, to stop him screwing the working classes over even more than Thatcher did. But, as Thatcher did, he can get away with it due to majorities.
Blair is bad news for this country. We need a left-wing Labour party back in power, but one taht tells the unions where to get off.
*starts up his own party*
May I suggest Tony Benn as leader?
Thats a very good idea...I like Tony Benn. A politician with morals, very rare in this day and age.
I wouldnt have Dennis Skinner in it though.
after the next election they are almost certainly going to have more seats than the torys....
In fact the only reason we are looking at the conservitives for opposition now is habit.
Although that is only based on recent history, with the swing between Labour and Tory Govt only really coming about since WW1. Before that is was the Tories and the Whigs (Liberals)...
With Labour's move towards the central ground they have usurped the Liberals to a large extent (and the Tories to a lesser one) and perhaps the Liberals will form the most left leaning party of the future.
BTW Whilst Benn has been a great example of what an MP should be, he is unfortunately a spent force. Which is the problem with politics at the moment, there is no-one in parliament who is held in much regard by the general public anymore.
What I wouldnt give to see them all exiled and a whole new set of politicos brought in.
With Labour's move towards the central ground they have usurped the Liberals to a large extent (and the Tories to a lesser one) and perhaps the Liberals will form the most left leaning party of the future.
In the future...?
Today (or yesterday) which of the major political partys is the most left leaning?
Toadborg
At the moment they are shafted because New Labour have stolen a lot of their ground from under them. I do however think that Labour cannot continue trying to please veryone forever so they will eventually fuck up....
What do you mean "eventually"....
Soon I think they will lose the support of most of the 'original' labour supporters btu I am not sure who they will turn to.........
This doesn't mean harm for New Labour though, as the missing supporters are being replaced by floating and conservative voters.
Labour lost its soul the moment it ditched Clause 4. However this didn't cause much damage at the polling stations, to say the least. I guess we're all conservatives now.
Harsh...I'd much rather it was Rajas (my local pizza place) and Apple...
Voting Lib Dem for next local, as I've no idea how good or bad they are.
I've seen the Torys...oh yes...and Labour. Not too impressed.
I just can't seem to get my head round political parties, policies etc. Interesting, though.