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Tory arrested
Former Member
Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7753557.stm
Mixed feelings about this one - as far as the civil servant is concerned they can lock him up and throw away the key, he was in a position of trust and abused it.
But I'm not sure that they should be arresting those he passed the info too. It was politically embarrassing, but it would be hard to argue that it damaged the UK's national interests or put people's lives in danger.
Mixed feelings about this one - as far as the civil servant is concerned they can lock him up and throw away the key, he was in a position of trust and abused it.
But I'm not sure that they should be arresting those he passed the info too. It was politically embarrassing, but it would be hard to argue that it damaged the UK's national interests or put people's lives in danger.
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Nah, you wouldn't have had any electricity to power your computer if you had.
Anti-terrorist officers, but I think the legislation may have been under Official Secrets Act
An explanation from the Guardian - http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2008/nov/28/conservatives-whitehall
And this wikipedia page outlines the response of the (high?) court to the Attorney Generals questions clarifying the offence.
http://www.wikicrimeline.co.uk/index.php?title=Misconduct_in_public_office
There does seem to be an interesting issues here about the slowly growing use of the offence.
The stats from 1996 to 2006 for the number of people found guilty are -
1996 - 0
1997 - 0
1998 - 0
1999 - 2
2000 - 2
2001 - 1
2002 - 2
2003 - 3
2004 - 10
2005 - 3
2006 - 12
Anyway, just some info for those that are curious about the offence
but back to topic - either
1) Labour Ministers knew about the arrest - in which case I expect resignations, and/or
2) Ian Blair ordered it in his last day in office - in which I expect him to be prosecuted or
3) A junior copper did it without thinking, this might not be a good idea to do without speaking to my bosses - in which case I'd expect him having a coffee without biscuits chat with his superiors
My understanding is that malfeasance relates to an unlawful act, whereas misconduct is broader than that? Not sure though
i need new glasses...i got really worried for a second...
Next, I initially thought the idea that Ian Blair somehow ordered this as some kind of revenge against the Tories for kicking him out of the Met is ludicrous. Whilst nobody can deny that New Labour's favourite policeman is a political stooge - this is the man who allowed police vans to carry Labour Party propaganda in the 2005 General Election, remember - not even he would stoop that low. Or would he? It's worth looking at his actions in the last few years to work out what kind of character he really is.
Jean Charles De Menezes, anyone? On July 22nd 2005, he must have been the only copper at the Met to have believed that his officers had shot a terrorist. His force leaked vicious stories about the man they'd killed - stories about De Menezes being an illegal immigrant, for example. His force was found to have made huge mistakes in the run-up to this man perishing in these circumstances, yet he never considered resigning as a matter of principle. And of course, his friends in the Labour Party supported him all the way. Given the appallingly bad judgement this man showed during that episode, I wouldn't rule out political motivations in this.
UPDATE: Whilst checking what news sources and blogs are saying about this story, I came across this brilliant piece by Daniel Finkelstein at The Times. I wonder what Macavity will have to say about it?
Jim V - I've always suspected he was a wrong 'un.
If I was nicking the opposition I'd like to think they'd never be heard from again, not discussed in public
The fact that nobody is making such claims could in fact mean that most people acknowledge this is not only an isolated incident that means nothing for the Conservative Party, the police or the government at large, but that it is pointless to speculate while the investigation is ongoing and not that much is known about it.
So a good thing that people aren't making a big deal out of it, the way I see it. Unless you actually believe the government really is controlling the police and sending them to arrest political opponents, which of course would be an extremely serious issue and worthy of the upmost attention by everyone.
If they're capable of that, they would have no problem whatsoever with getting opposition politicians arrested. It just makes you wonder who they're gonna come for next. Will they chase down the person who leaked most of the pre-Budget report beforehand? It used to be a sackable offence to leak any part of it - how times have changed. Will the people in the Metropolitan Police who leaked vicious lies about Jean Charles De Menezes be getting their collars felt? Will Gordon Brown be thrown into the cells because of all the leaked information he gained access to during the Thatcher and Major years?
Damian Green's arrest stinks in the extreme. Ministers of Fuhrer Broon's regime are using the Manuel defence here - wheeling themselves out in front of the media and saying "I know nothing". When Macavity said it, you could clearly see in the interviews that his body language suggested he was hiding something. The man is not only emotionally defective, but also a liar. The same goes for our Minister of the Interior. Notice how defensive she got when the Beeb had the cheek to ask her about it on Friday? Watch the interviews - their body language gives the game away. These people couldn't tell the truth if their lives depended on it.
Worst still, their pathetic little defence has a horrifying implication. They claim that the lack of ministerial involvement somehow proves the "independence of the police". If they really believe that, they're ultimately saying that the police are ultimately accountable to no one, that they can do what the hell they like. This sort of theory would make the likes of Josef Stalin blush.
Of course, Jackboot Jacqui wouldn't want to upset the police, after all. She's the one who deprived them of a pay rise which would have cost £30million to implement on the grounds that inflation would go up to three million percent or something stupid like that. So no wonder she's pretending she had nothing to do with it...
I agree with Jacqui Smith on this. Police should have operational independence to pursue investigations even if that means arresting MPs - they should by no means be immune to the police. Whether the police are doing their job properly or well is a bigger question and one I would be cynical about a positive answer, and that's where the home secretary's duty comes in. But surely she shouldn't have to respond to individual cases because an MP was involved, because then you're turning a police investigation into something political.
Something that right now the conservatives would love to do, but is it the best thing for the country that we politicize the police? Or at least give that impression?
SG - the police are accoutable, but not to politicians. This presicely prevents abuse of power. They are accountable to the independent police commision thing. Why is nobody complaining about all the false arrests in working class areas? We don't even KNOW it was a false arrest.
Lets be rational about it.
This Jacqui Smith woman cares so much about police independence that she over-ruled the decision of an independent panel to give coppers pay rises, forcing them to take far less instead. This is also the same Jacqui Smith who's about to give out tasers. At this rate, I suppose it's lucky Damian Green wasn't shot in the head by some idiot who thought he was a terrorist. In case you hadn't noticed, it already is political. The House of Commons authorities gave permission to the police to raid his office. It was claimed this weekend that the Tory Party actually has the footage of the raid. It would not look good if that became public, would it? Naturally, the truly dreadful Michael Martin is also pretending he had nothing to do with this. These people are all living on another planet. Oh dear, oh dear. We've seen the politicisation of the police in the last few years. One name keeps coming to mind - Sir Ian Blair. Repeatedly, he's allowed Labour to have their way. His decision to allow police vans to carry Labour Party propaganda at the 2005 general election gave the game away. And notice how only Nu Labour backed him to the hilt when people demanded his resignation after the health and safety legal action against the Met? Bollocks. This body is completely toothless. I go back to the De Menezes affair again. A body that truly held coppers to account would not have let them off so lightly. A truly independent body would have forced Ian Blair to resign for the good of the Metropolitan Police.
It doesn't exactly help encourage any form of discussion to insult other user's opinions. You may disagree with what shyboy has to say but that hardly makes it drivel. Please don't be so dismissive of the opinions of other posters.
However there's also a difference when a comment sticks out like a sore thumb in a thread and isn't part of any general discussion or banter and is simply an insult. It's unnecessary and unhelpful