Thank You Cousins ~ !

Former Member · October 2001

We just went hot...and for all our bickering, you, the ol pirate kingdom, stood with US sholder to sholder...I am humbled.

Thank you...and be careful;

Watch out for that other shoe...it appears that ol salamibentlabia wants to be viewed as mohamud reincarnate...and his followers are all of islam...they will strike again, and again, and again! And their view is simple...if your are of islam...you must be with us or be destroyed with 'them' and the them is US!

Diesel

88888888

Former Member · October 2001

Diesel, it is because we are so alike that our differences become magnified.

There are now only two sides, those that help and those that don't. There is NO neutrality...

"Perhaps my best years are gone, but I wouldn't want them back. Not with the fire in me now." - Samuel Beckett

Former Member · October 2001

I'm not your cousin

Former Member · October 2001

Originally posted by Man Of Kent:
There are now only two sides, those that help and those that don't. There is NO neutrality...

true, true. either you are against terrorism absolutely, or you are a terrorist. thats the way it always should have been.

also, i'm proud of britain for taking the role we have in this. we may just have made ourselves target #2, but i'd rather that than we stand idly by as this war is fought.

Nolite te bastardes carborundorum

Former Member · October 2001

While military action is distasteful I am glad its finally happened. Its obvious the Taleban had no intention of handing over Bin Laden. Unfortunately they left us no option but to take him, and now them out of the picture.

God bless our armed forces and keep them safe.

"Let's roll......" Todd Beamer, American Hero

Former Member · October 2001

Diesel for once I agree with you

peacechild

Former Member · October 2001

http://wsphotofews.excite.com/034/Yb/UC/t0/dv55469.jpg

Diesel

88888888

[This message has been edited by Dom Waghorn (edited 10-10-2001).]

Former Member · October 2001

Originally posted by dazed_dan:
true, true. either you are against terrorism absolutely, or you are a terrorist. thats the way it always should have been.

I'm absolutely against it, unlike most Americans and Britons.

If Bin Laden made it to the UK we would not, even with the evidence we have, be able to extradite him to the US. Does that mean we are a legitimate target for the Americans.

We need a European army.

Former Member · October 2001

Originally posted by Balddog:
While military action is distasteful I am glad its finally happened. Its obvious the Taleban had no intention of handing over Bin Laden. Unfortunately they left us no option but to take him, and now them out of the picture.

I would have been much happier had the Taleban, or the UN, been given evidence. When they had then rejected that evidence, military action, cleared through the UN aimed at the terrorist would have been much more acceptable.

I have no love for the Taleban, but the current action seems to be aimed at overthrowing them, rather than dealing with OBL.

Former Member · October 2001

I would have been much happier had the Taleban, or the UN, been given evidence.

I do agree with you here. It seems as though it would have gone much more smoothy had we shown evidence to the Taliban...Of course it probably would have meant the informants would have been tortured horribly and then killed.

I have no love for the Taleban, but the current action seems to be aimed at overthrowing them, rather than dealing with OBL.

Surely doing both is a good thing? Getting rid of the Taliban is the single most important thing we could do for the Afghan people. The taliban are hated by the people, they dont even have majority support from their own ethnic group..These people are animals, pure and simple.

If Bin Laden made it to the UK we would not, even with the evidence we have, be able to extradite him to the US. Does that mean we are a legitimate target for the Americans.

Screw extraditing him..If he made it to this country he could claim asylum and live it up off our govt for the rest of his life.

Not sure I understand the Euro army point you tacked on the end there.

"Let's roll......" Todd Beamer, American Hero

Former Member · October 2001

Originally posted by Balddog:
quote:
It seems as though it would have gone much more smoothy had we shown evidence to the Taliban...Of course it probably would have meant the informants would have been tortured horribly and then killed.

I'm a little concerned that there was no evidence that could be used without compromising sources that couldn't have been brought to safety in the 4 week planning period.

Surely doing both is a good thing? Getting rid of the Taliban is the single most important thing we could do for the Afghan people.

I'm not in a position to comment on that, but I can't see the justification for doing it.

These people are animals, pure and simple.

I take exception to this. They are trying to run a country by their religous belief. That they are using a f*cked up interpretation of an outdated code (in my opinion) doesn't make things any easier for them. I do not beleive in the supremacy of democracy, theocracy might lead to better systems (although I doubt that any of the Judaic religions would form a basis for such).

Don't get me wrong; democracy, particularly representative democracy as used to be operated here, is the best system that I know of. Given a choice of living in a muslim state and America, I'd have no hesitation in choosing the "Land of the Free"

If Bin Laden made it to the UK [would we be] a legitimate target for the Americans.

Not sure I understand the Euro army point you tacked on the end there.

I am increasingly alarmed by american (for want of a better word) imperialism. There is no-one able to stand up to them. I'd be much happier if there was a force that, amongst other things, was capable of presenting a realistic opposition to America

Former Member · October 2001

We, US, get more done when we have a 'worthy' opponent...invent new things, build bigger and better weapons...etc.

With tha Afganistan solution we are droping bombs and beans...literally...and when the mess is settled and we bring home ol salamibentlabbia's head preserved in mule urin and virgin pee there will be left the largest 'welfare' project in history...preserving the very existence of the people...baring other events we surely will...!

Afganistan is about the same size as our state of Texas...and just about as sorry a place to live (for the most part)...but maybe, just maybe...we can get the mines cleared and put in some world class ski resorts.
http://fair4all.cz/OF/images/holyshit.jpg[/IMG]

Diesel

88888888

Former Member · October 2001

I'm a little concerned that there was no evidence that could be used without compromising sources that couldn't have been brought to safety in the 4 week planning period.

I suspect it has more to do with preserving the position of their informant/s for future use rather than just pulling them out to safety. I think weve seen that the west has appauling intelligence in the region and I reckon any 'insiders' they might have would be very valuable just where they are.

but I can't see the justification for doing it.

While its not being espoused by our leaders I think the justification for doing it is the freedom of the Afghan people from tyranny and famine. Of course thats not the reason our govt is doing it for but it will achieve this goal.

They are trying to run a country by their religous belief

Thats where the problem lies. They are using an extreme form of Islam to rule the country. The people of that country dont want to live by the intepretation of Islamic law used by the Taleban. Even most other Muslim nations cant abide the Taleban and their awful practices. I stick by my statement, they are animals...even by the standards of other Islamic countries.

I am increasingly alarmed by american (for want of a better word) imperialism

Why? Maybe its just me and I understand that its not possible but I would like to see the entire world working as a free democratic place. I would love to see the end of dictators, tyrannical rulers, harsh theocracies, communist states etc..I happen to think that all people should have the basic rights to freedom. Say what you will about America but they do cherish freedom and liberty above all.

The rest of the world dont need an army to keep the American govt in check...Thats the job of the American people and they will do it if America starts to turn into what they hate the most, a tyrant.

"Let's roll......" Todd Beamer, American Hero

Former Member · October 2001

Tell the people they are free often enough
and they start to really believe it!

Former Member · October 2001

Tell the people they are free often enough and they start to really believe it!

Good point..None of us are really free. I should have said relatively free <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/smile.gif">

"Let's roll......" Todd Beamer, American Hero

Former Member · October 2001

but one HELL of a lot freer than the poor blighters in afghanistan and the like. I absolutely hate it when people from this country start critiscising our freedom.

All those brave people who died in the last world war would turn in their grave to hear you slagging off our freedom that they fought for so bravely.

Former Member · October 2001

All those brave people who died in the last world war would turn in their grave to hear you slagging off our freedom that they fought for so bravely.

They may have fought for in the wars but its been massively degraded since then.

I dont see anyone slagging off our freedoms here. We are 'relatively' free compared to the Afghans but we certainly arent totally free..Its impossible while we have laws and government.

"Let's roll......" Todd Beamer, American Hero

Former Member · October 2001

They didn't fight for my freedom
They had to fight for their own perhaps?

Former Member · October 2001

They didn't fight for my freedom

If youre a British citizen then they most certainly did fight for your freedom. They fought for their freedom and freedom for their children...that means you.

"Let's roll......" Todd Beamer, American Hero

Former Member · October 2001

Originally posted by Carriage Return:

Originally posted by Balddog:
I would have been much happier had the Taleban, or the UN, been given evidence. When they had then rejected that evidence, military action, cleared through the UN aimed at the terrorist would have been much more acceptable.

Did nobody notice that evidence WAS given? Although it may have been far from complete, a few bits were very convincing, especially the timing of the orders to be in safe haven.

Former Member · October 2001

Tell me more then because I missed it obviously

Former Member · October 2001

Originally posted by Sean_K:
Did nobody notice that evidence WAS given? Although it may have been far from complete, a few bits were very convincing, especially the timing of the orders to be in safe haven.

Indeed - some evidence was outlined that was very persuasive. Until you thought about it. What remained was around evens to warrant extradition, between neutral countries.

I remind you that we could not extradite anyone to america to face murder charges. As there is unlikely to be anywhere we could deport them to that would be safe for them we would be probably be obliged to grant them assylum. (We would probably look the other way when MIBs arrived and "helped" suspects onto flights to America)

If America and other terrorist nations hadn't spent so long blocking and weakening an international court there might have been one around now. Ah well, sow the winds, reap the whirlwind.

Thank You Cousins ~ !

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