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Nukes in Red Square!
Teh_Gerbil
Posts: 13,332 Born on Earth, Raised by The Mix
For the first time since 1990.
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=080509113625.2fytcrew&show_article=1
How awesome. I quite like this, it builds national pride and is a wonderful celebration of the heroes who died in WW2 for our freedom.
Why don't WE do stuff like this?
Also the Daily Mail story on it was hilarious, but stupid. Then again, the Daily Riech probably cried when hitler died, they did support the guy, and Russia did sorta rape Germany after its initial fail. So what do we expect?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/worldnews.html?in_article_id=565421&in_page_id=1811
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=080509113625.2fytcrew&show_article=1
How awesome. I quite like this, it builds national pride and is a wonderful celebration of the heroes who died in WW2 for our freedom.
Why don't WE do stuff like this?
Also the Daily Mail story on it was hilarious, but stupid. Then again, the Daily Riech probably cried when hitler died, they did support the guy, and Russia did sorta rape Germany after its initial fail. So what do we expect?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/worldnews.html?in_article_id=565421&in_page_id=1811
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Comments
I mean, look at their peaked caps, it's like a competition for peakiness!
Peter Hitchens who wrote that is hysterical. Ever wonder which gender Russia is? Pete to the rescue:
"Russia is a catastrophic country, Nigeria with rockets, mainly dangerous to herself and mainly concerned about herself."
Bootiful. Now I almost feel pity towards her, she's just a laughable wikkle female...
What kind of a sucker do you have to be to make the implication that any sort of "Left-wing idea" leads towards an equivalent of the Soviet Union? He doesn't believe it. He's counting on readers who make connections like "AAARRR... RUSSIA... ARRR... SOVIET OONION... AARPPP... ENGLAND?!?! ... aarrrr... STALIN!" That's respec' for your readership, right there.
I wouldn't count on that. I watched him debate his brother recently, and the only thing that he genuinely didn't have a stereotypical conservative view on was the Iraq war (which incidentally, Christopher Hitchens does support, and still out-debated him on the issue). But this was a university debate, and he was spouting all of the same sort of shit in it. He got his arse thoroughly handed to him incidentally.
I think a lot of countries have a 'male' or 'female' identity though. 'Mother Russia', 'Brittania', 'The Fatherland', but maybe that's just from me watching war films.
Whowhere is no doubt far more knowledgeable than me on tanks, but I believe although not brand new the T-90 is a formidable piece of hardware as well.
lol - good one
Four years then they swap jobs back, at least thats the plan anyway.
nor are they the Soviet Union, ven ignoring the idelogical dimension to the Cold War, Russia has half the population of the USSR, and lacks the Eastern European cannon fodder, to say nothing about not having Cuba and other communist states as part of any fight.
Russia is a regional power, which may have some minor implications for the EU move Eastwards, but its main threat is to places like Georgia, not the UK or Western Europe
It may not have military might, but it has a lot of coal, oil, gas and other minerals - these days that means power.
And while its armed forces are still badly trained and equipped the trend was reversed a decade ago and improvements have and continue to take place across the board. Russia will unveil next year a next-generation stealth fighter as good as, if not better than, the F-22. It continues to develop new generation of ballistic missiles designed to penetrate missile shields and its brand new surface-to-air anti aircraft missile system is said to be the best in the world and capable of downing stealth aircraft as well as incoming missiles.
Dismiss Russia at your peril.
As many great leader have dismissed Russia at thier peril, then later regretted it.
Yes, they don't have the population of the USSR anymore. But they never recovered from losing 27,000,000 really, did they? A large army is NOT a strong army. Iraq invading Iran proved this. Russia's technology is FAR from 40 years out of date - the Americans always claim this, then realise how wrong they are. The T-80 and T-90 tanks are rated as the most survivable tanks on the modern battlefield. By the British. Why? Because they are. Simple as. Thier Airforce - is a wonderful beast. The planes you saw there - the Tu-160 - Fastest, largest, bomber in the world. Tu-95 - entirley equal in ability to the B-52 - using 4 contra-rotating turboprop engines instead of 8 jets. The Su-27/30/35 series Fighter Jet - currently the most able Jet in any asirforce worldwide - far more maneuverable than any jet, and armed to the teeth. I'd rather fly that than the F-22 and it's semi-stealth nonsense. And, something that wasn't paraded - the MiG-31 - probably the jet most western pilots most fear ever coming up against - the most power radar to ever be used in an interceptor, tracking 10 targets at once, flying on the edge of space.
The Smerch artillery system paraded thier today is probably one of the most devestating in service. The Sa-6 Gainful has recently been modernised to hell, to the extent it isn't really the same system. But needless to say, I wouldn't fly a Heli near it. Then there is the S-300 (possibly the S-400, there is little to seperate the two visually. If it was some S-400s, I am most impressed though.) Anti Air system is an impressive beast. The S-300 will intercept missiles or bombers miles away, with huge accuracy. The S-400 doubles the range, and also detects stealth aircraft.
Thier Navy is thier current weakpoint, but still, no-one ever wants to take on Russian subs.
Russia should not be dismissed, ever. Her armed forces are not backwards, which America always claims (Note the epic fail in Korea to anticipate the MiG-15), and they might be poorly paid, and morale might not be high, but come to war, and the Russians will fight to the death. They are strongly patriotic, like any good Army should be. And as for thier training, don't kid yourself anymore over that. That was hugely changed after Soviet times. Thr training unerwent huge changes in the late 90's and early 00's, and intel reports alot of improvement.
Russia is JUST as much of the threat to the West as the USSR was these days. Thier forces have upgraded as consolidated. Modernised and Retrained. That is to say, just as much threat as the USSR - it IS NOT a threat, it won't attack, despite America's ranting, but it could hold its own.
Also the threat of cutting off Europe's natural resource supplies is a big one. And I doubt much of Europe could stand against the Russian armed forces.
So lucky we're not planning to invade them isn't it...
Great they have some tech (though extremely poor comms). But that's pretty irrelevant - none of it is so technically superior it can make up for poor doctrines, training and leadership
No-one wants to take subs on full stop. But the Russians sub-force is poor, easy to detect, full of conscripts and with a horrible habit of sinking without any help
They might fight to the death - but that's a sign of fanaticism not training or doctrine. The purpose of soldiers isn't to die for their country, but make the other son of a bitch die for his (Copyright - Patton). They may be better than in the 90's - but given that in the 90's the Democratic Republic of Congo could have whipped them and gone home for tea I'm not sure that we're talking about a major improvement. They could probably beat the Dutch and Germans, but then so could a well armed Girl Guide troop. Against any decent force the Russians are second rate
The US isn't ranting Russia is about to attack. they're a miinor world player, and a bigger regional one. They're a bit of a pain and have nukes, but then so is France and we don't witter on about how tough they are.
Even without the US - the Soviets would be so much scrap metal. Admittedly we'd probably have a disadvanatage with the Belgiums, Dutch and Italians etc, but I suspect us and the French could get some agreement where we get the second raters to defend Spain in case of a sneak attack through Morrocco and then deal with the Soviets ourselves (though it'd be nice if the Canucks and Yanks could join us as well).
Bear in mind Russia is more dependent on selling its resources to Western Europe than Europe is in buying them. And every threat the Russians make just means we're more prepared to deal with their sulks and buy off their competitors
You're talking about apples and pears. I mean sure, we could spend billions getting supersonic stealth tactical nuclear planes, but what the hell is that going to do against some militias in Iraq? As for Russia, these parades are willy waving and that's all they are.
edit: some random comparison (first link on google I think):
http://www.indopedia.org/Comparison_of_2000s_fighter_aircraft.html#Combat_performance
Lockheed Martin/Boeing F-22 Raptor 10.1:1
Eurofighter Typhoon 4.5:1
Dassault-Breguet Rafale C 1.0:1
Sukhoi Su-35 'Flanker' 1.0:1
McDonnell Douglas F-15C Eagle 0.8:1
Boeing F/A-18+ 0.4:1
McDonnell Douglas F/A-18C 0.3:1
General Dynamics F-16C 0.3:1
This shows some predicted combat results. The F22 shoots down 10.1 SU-35 to every 1 lost. Green ones win, orange ones break even, red ones get pwned.
However, a better link is at the bottom, which states pretty clearly that they're all designed to o different tasks, so it's akin to comparing apples and pears.
I said it was willy waving actually :razz:
Why would we join with Russia instead of China and India. India gave us curry. China gave us tea. What the fuck has Russia ever contributed?
Vodka...
Meh, we would've got that from Poland anyway. They do it better too.
Since the wall came down Europe and Russia have been drawing closer together though some people haven't noticed.
It's down to geography and need.
There resources are fueling Europes industry/commerce.
Europes industry/commerce are filling Russias coffers.
We have a mutual need like never before.
I have tried so many times to point out this mutual and inevitable atraction and people react with shock.
It's already happening ...go back in time twentyyears and compare it with now ...it's changed beyond the wildest imaginings of twenty years ago but some of you can't seem to register it.
You go back to poor training, it is NOT that poor these days. Also thier comms network is often cited as being behind, but the huge failiure of Western comms in Iraq shows we are no better, really. Troops using mobile phones? Wonderful.
Evidence of this plox sir. Don't say Kursk, that has been disproven alot of times already. Never mind years of sucessful deployment of Akula and Typhoon class subs. Never mind the US nearly accidently blowing up half the world thanks to a faulty ICBM in the 90's. Easy to detect? Go tell that to our Sub Crews please. Ask them to go find a Typhoon. And the Akula isn't one of the most feared subs for no reason, you know.
Well, you claim this as fact. The Russian armed forces COULD probably decimate the majority of Europe with numbers and Air Superiority alone. Fanaticism did Vietnam wonders, and is working reasonably in the Mid East. The Germans also have one of Europe's best armed forces, so I worry for the rest of it then. As the rest of it is using large amounts of terribly outdates Soviet Tech from the 70's.
The Americans are actually. Russia nearly attacked Georgia recently. Russia is also getting defensive about its former Soviet states and this Missile Shield. I wouldn't put it past them, and if they do, well - what can anyone do about it?
You seem to doubt Russian equipment. I suggest you do some research. It isn't scrap metal. So a piece of scrap metal from 1970 is capable of shooting down an F/A18 in 1991? Then escaping unharmed? Awesome. I like scrap metal then. So it isn't all knobs and dials and computers. So what if they use older technology? Remember when the Su-27 first hit the scene in the 70's? It tooks years for the west to counter it. Decades, infact. The Raptor is the first US plane superior to the Flanker series. In a wonderful simulated combat against the (Wow, the BEST, surley) Indian Airforce, using Su-30's, MiG-29's, MiG-27's and a few MiG-21's, the US... lost. Terribly. Using F-15's. A bit shocking, really, India is hardly known for its Airforce superiority. The US themselves confessed the F-15 would lose against an Su-30 pretty much every time.
You do know what'd happen if they just cut of the resources, right? It's be weeks before we got any off someone else. Without resources. The economic damage would be huge, especially as some of the poorer EU states can't afford to buy from elsewhere.
Shyboy, that is a good link, but one important thing to remember is numbers. The US cannot afford all the Raptors it wants, without selling to other countries. Which it is trying to avoid at all costs. So has decreased its order alot. Also, no MiG-31 sadly. And as well, the Flanker series can get a radar lock on the raptor, but no range. So it would be a case of fire and let the missile hopefully work. The Russian missiles fly faster than US missiles, and at longer range. The hit ratio wouldn't be great. But with very few raptors even flying, who cares?
Also the JSF isn't on that list of combat success, probably as it is terrible at combat.
I just can't wait for the MiG-35 or Sukhoi next gen fighter. Sukhoi appear to be keeping quiet on all fronts, but MiG have shown everyone. I wonder whats happening there?
War with Russia will never happen. No-one can afford to attack a nation with such strength, and also lose the resources. In the coming years, the world will depend hugely on Russia's huge Oil Reserves in Siberia, due to the fact NO ONE is working seriously on alternative fuel sources. How Russia deals with this... will remain to be seen.
Also let's not forget, Russia is close to China. China supplies the West with alot. A hell of alot, we sent everything there because it is cheap. We gaveup our production, and let a Tyrannical state have it instead because they do it cheaper, and in return we let them get away with... well, murder. And oppression. And we fund thier Military, who are now modernised nearly all the way, and well on the way to two opperation Aircraft carriers, and reverse engeniering more! Also buying loads of crap old diesel subs of Russia for some unkown reason.