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Just how sacred is 'life'?
Former Member
Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
Take a look at this article ... sad isn't it?
Anyway... Where do we draw the line between 'life' and a simple existance? Looking at examples like this... When a person is born, who will have a limited life and is likely to be severely disabled either mentally or physically and who won't live as long, should we ever consider the idea of euthanasia...
In a sense maybe it feels different thinking about it, the written consent of a dying old man who goes to Holland or somewhere to die in a special clinic compared to a child who has just been born, has no concept of time and maybe love and who will never experience little things, like smelling the sea air or a quiet stroll in the part on a spring morning.
Is it right to deny a child life, if we know that the life will be shorter and more painful? If the child will be in hospital and unable to make friends or integrate and be kept awake at night in constant pain? If a child were born with such a condition... Should we leave him or her to die, or allow them to grow up until they can make their own decision?
On the ethical front it's a difficult topic, but should euthanasia be allowed on babies? If at all....
Fire away people.
A seriously ill premature baby will have a terrible quality of life dominated by pain, if doctors continue to keep her alive, a court has heard.
Doctors treating Charlotte Wyatt told the High Court she should be allowed to die if she stops breathing again.
David Lock, for the hospital, said a doctor had described her as "living in a plastic box" and that her life would be "dominated by pain and suffering".
Her parents are arguing Charlotte has every right to treatment.
Mr Lock summarised the trust consultants' findings by saying: "They are of the view that Charlotte has life-limiting conditions and that, despite their best efforts, she has no feelings other than continuing pain.
"Her quality of life is both terrible and permanent and they cannot see a way in which it would significantly improve."
Mr Lock said one the doctor had described her as "permanently sedated, living in a plastic box with a tube up her nose and blasted with gas".
Debbie Wyatt
It has all been very difficult for us
Debbie Wyatt, Charlotte's mother
The dilemma doctors face over denying treatment
Mr Lock added that a second doctor, a consultant paediatric neurologist, had said Charlotte "has no visual awareness and does not respond to sound... she does not respond to being cuddled and demonstrates no awareness of familiar persons."
David Wolfe, counsel for the Mr and Mrs Wyatt, said this part of the consultant's report was a matter of controversy.
Charlotte weighed just one pound when she was born 11 months ago and has serious heart and lung problems.
Dr E, a specialist in paediatric respiratory medicine, who took over supervising Charlotte's care in August, said she was suffering from "the worst case of chronic lung disease I have ever seen".
He added that Charlotte had lung scarring after having life-saving ventilation five times.
Doctors say she should be allowed to die if her breathing stops again, but her parents, Darren, 32, and Debbie, 23, want her to be resuscitated.
They argue that, as she has survived this far, Charlotte - who measured just five inches when born - must be given every assistance to help her live.
Suffering
But doctors say she will not survive beyond infancy because her lungs are so severely damaged.
Charlotte was born when her mother was 26 weeks pregnant, has never left hospital and is fed through a tube as she cannot suck from a bottle.
She also needs a constant supply of oxygen.
Portsmouth Hospitals NHS Trust says that while parents can decide what treatment is given to their child, they cannot insist on inappropriate treatment which would bring more suffering than benefits.
Ahead of the hearing, Mrs Wyatt told The Times newspaper: "It has all been very difficult for us.
"I just hope the judge makes the right decision. We want to cling to any chance we have."
Cases such as this are very rare, and are usually heard in private.
But, earlier this week, Mr and Mrs Wyatt - both committed Christians from Buckland, Portsmouth - were given permission for their case to be heard in public.
Trust managers agreed the case should be discussed openly so that it could reassure the public about the treatment it offered and the decisions it made.
At the preliminary hearing, the parents stressed that they maintained a good relationship with the trust, even though they disagreed with its view that Charlotte should not be ventilated if she needed it.
Mr Wolfe told the judge: "They are entirely happy with, and grateful for, the treatment which Charlotte has received so far from the trust and its staff."
The judge has banned the media from identifying the individual medical staff caring for Charlotte and the independent expert witnesses who are to be called to give evidence.
The case is expected to last two days.
Anyway... Where do we draw the line between 'life' and a simple existance? Looking at examples like this... When a person is born, who will have a limited life and is likely to be severely disabled either mentally or physically and who won't live as long, should we ever consider the idea of euthanasia...
In a sense maybe it feels different thinking about it, the written consent of a dying old man who goes to Holland or somewhere to die in a special clinic compared to a child who has just been born, has no concept of time and maybe love and who will never experience little things, like smelling the sea air or a quiet stroll in the part on a spring morning.
Is it right to deny a child life, if we know that the life will be shorter and more painful? If the child will be in hospital and unable to make friends or integrate and be kept awake at night in constant pain? If a child were born with such a condition... Should we leave him or her to die, or allow them to grow up until they can make their own decision?
On the ethical front it's a difficult topic, but should euthanasia be allowed on babies? If at all....
Fire away people.
0
Comments
Not an easy judgement to pass either... This is one of those "wouldn't touch with a 40ft pole" cases I think...
amazing things can be done with people's lives, they can still enjoy life even if they don't have a very good quality of life.
yet on the other hand, in some cases the parents will be burdened with the child's disability. some parents will disregard this as tehy love the child unconditionally, whereas others will want the freedom.
i'm out on this one.
It depends how you define 'life'.
In this case, the baby is unlikely ever get to the point of making a conscious decision. No, never.
It's a desperately sad situation, but imho the parents are just avoiding making the decision to say goodbye to their child. I can understand their point of view, but sadly this baby has little chance of independent life.
Personally I think quality fo life should be a factor, but then I think the parents should have the ultimate decision in cases such as this. It's only fair for all concerned, I feel.
no a correction, zero chance the baby has
no matter how much i or the doctors think they should turn off life support, its the parents decision, doctors cant make decisions like that
Heartless though it may sound, the NHS has limited resources, even for babies
i have flask and egg butties ...
There's plenty o'room up here.
Gi's us a sarnie?
The child has "no chance" of survival. Just turn out the light, it can't be saved.
They said that about GWST's sister when she was a baby. Didn't give her a year. Then didn't give her three years, five years. She's 13 now. Medical miracles come from necessity, and turning out the light means nothing gets done.
even doctors have used the word miraculous ...but then said ...she won't outgrow her teens.
she is now 23 and with all her difficulties is extremely happy and giggly and demanding and ...seriously enjoying her life!
Medical miracles. At the very cutting edge of medicine.
It's why people should never abandon a life unless there is nothing that can ever be done, and by that I do mean PVS.
this is ...a quality of life issue. this is living at home with mum and dad and family ...this is about time and trust and patience and love ...believe me ...the medical side has been brilliant for kidney failure ...brilliant for ovarian cyst ...but ...apart from those things there is very little by way of medical brilliance or technology.
I think its a shame. I can see her parents motives for wanting to keep her alive as long as possible and to not be the ones to make the decision.
I think im up there on the fence too actually.
I dont think the doctors would have come to their conclusion lightly though.
I honestly think id let nature take its course.....but im not in their shoes.
Another one kinda sitting on the fence....id hate to have to make the decision but with the amount of problems this baby has I think its the baby who is suffering here.
oh i dunno
Room for me as well? Bacon sarnie going to a starving student?
I'm not sure, part of me thinks that the child should be allowed to die, prolonging pain is only just short of torture. But then, medical miracles happen.